WildRose
Well-Known Member
The quote I provided is directly from Hornady's website.
They are a great target and varmint bullet. There are much better bullets for game including the Interlocks which have outstanding performance all the way around.
Hornady A-Max
- Thread starter Firecat
- Start date
Help Support Long Range Hunting Forum
They are a great target and varmint bullet. There are much better bullets for game including the Interlocks which have outstanding performance all the way around.
FAL Shot
Well-Known Member
Tnwhip had about the same result I did. Shot a larger mule deer than his deer in the neck with a 7mm 162 A-Max from a 7x57 at 200 yards and the spine was shattered with complete pass through meat with the recovered bullet near the offside hide. Recovered bullet had 38% weight retention after smashing bone at a relatively close range. There is nothing wrong with that performance.
The secret is to limit impact velocity to 2500 fps at the most and bullet should hold together well enough to get to vitals. The A-Max will continue to expand at a velocity below the lowest velocity that a Scirocco or similar tough bullet will fail to expand. If you are shooting at a range where your tough bullet tends to pinhole through, switch to a very soft bullet.
The reason I use the 7x57 is that impact velocities are ideal for medium game and real world open country ranges with the A-Max. The ideal impact range in my case goes from 200 yards to at least 500 yards. With a magnum, shove those distances farther out. 3200+ fps means you have at least 700 fps to bleed off before impact.
Nobody says you have to use the same bullet on every shot. I even shoot prairie dogs with two different pellets depending on the distance and my air reservoir remaining pressure. It ain't rocket science, just adapting to a changing condition.
The secret is to limit impact velocity to 2500 fps at the most and bullet should hold together well enough to get to vitals. The A-Max will continue to expand at a velocity below the lowest velocity that a Scirocco or similar tough bullet will fail to expand. If you are shooting at a range where your tough bullet tends to pinhole through, switch to a very soft bullet.
The reason I use the 7x57 is that impact velocities are ideal for medium game and real world open country ranges with the A-Max. The ideal impact range in my case goes from 200 yards to at least 500 yards. With a magnum, shove those distances farther out. 3200+ fps means you have at least 700 fps to bleed off before impact.
Nobody says you have to use the same bullet on every shot. I even shoot prairie dogs with two different pellets depending on the distance and my air reservoir remaining pressure. It ain't rocket science, just adapting to a changing condition.
Michael Eichele
Well-Known Member
And Varmint Hunter is quoting from the Hornady hardback reloading manual. If they did'nt work for our style of hunting, we would'nt be using them. In some cases yes, other 'hunting' bullets are better. But for many cases, the AMAX is a phenominal bullet for LR hunting. Which is what we do here.
300 RUM 178 AMAX on game at 100 yards, not so much. 300 RUM 208 AMAX on game at 1400 yards will blow the interbond, interlock or whatever intermawhatsit out of the water. 300 RUM 180 Interbond etc....on game at 100 yards or other close ranges, now you have a point. Since we are longrange hunters, we use what works for our style. The AMAX bullets work. Period.
SBruce
Well-Known Member
This past season was my first time trying the A-Max on anything but praire dogs, but I'll share the info for anyone that's interested.
Copied/pasted from another thread:
Everything I've read on the A-Max suggests that it should be used for medium to long range only, and for broadside presentations only. After using other match bullets for varmints and predators, I'd probably concur with what I've read about the A-Max.
I did shoot two whitetail fawn deer this past season with the 105 A-Max at 3000'/sec out of a 243. 1st one was 300 yds broadside and very close to disapearing into a ton of thick tall willows.....I purposely shot for high scapula/spine so I didn't loose it in the willows if it ran off a little. That one dropped right there and the wound at the top of the shoulder blades/spine was big enough to put my fist in without touching hair. The bullet would've been going about 2500'/sec. kill was instant as far as I know.
2nd whitetail fawn was about 180 yds and broadside in a large clearing. I opted for a double lung shot and it also dropped dead right there. The entrance wound (from inside the body) was about 2" and the exit wound (also looking from inside the body) was about 3". The lungs were schrapneled to the max and some stomach/intestine damage also.........very, very explosive and broken ribs both in and out. That bullet would've been going about 2700'/sec.
Just passing this on FWIW, I know the 105 is a totally different animal than the 208, and a whitetail fawn is totally different than an elk, but perhaps they act similar at similar velocities.??
I was meat hunting only this past season and I shot the only two whitetail deer that I had shots at. It wasn't long range by any strech of the imagination, but it's the only info I personally have to share with these bullets.
Copied/pasted from another thread:
Everything I've read on the A-Max suggests that it should be used for medium to long range only, and for broadside presentations only. After using other match bullets for varmints and predators, I'd probably concur with what I've read about the A-Max.
I did shoot two whitetail fawn deer this past season with the 105 A-Max at 3000'/sec out of a 243. 1st one was 300 yds broadside and very close to disapearing into a ton of thick tall willows.....I purposely shot for high scapula/spine so I didn't loose it in the willows if it ran off a little. That one dropped right there and the wound at the top of the shoulder blades/spine was big enough to put my fist in without touching hair. The bullet would've been going about 2500'/sec. kill was instant as far as I know.
2nd whitetail fawn was about 180 yds and broadside in a large clearing. I opted for a double lung shot and it also dropped dead right there. The entrance wound (from inside the body) was about 2" and the exit wound (also looking from inside the body) was about 3". The lungs were schrapneled to the max and some stomach/intestine damage also.........very, very explosive and broken ribs both in and out. That bullet would've been going about 2700'/sec.
Just passing this on FWIW, I know the 105 is a totally different animal than the 208, and a whitetail fawn is totally different than an elk, but perhaps they act similar at similar velocities.??
I was meat hunting only this past season and I shot the only two whitetail deer that I had shots at. It wasn't long range by any strech of the imagination, but it's the only info I personally have to share with these bullets.
Last edited:
WildRose
Well-Known Member
178gr Amax #30712 BC .495.
178gr Interbond #30709 .480.
No it doesn't blow it out of the water in any respect.
As for "we". I've been killing things at long range for over 30 years and I recommend not only what works, but what works best and most consistently.
Michael Eichele
Well-Known Member
AMAX = expansion at 1300 FPS (maybe less).
Interbond = expansion at 1800+ FPS.
Yeah. The AMAX will blow the Interbond out of the water at extreme ranges. Period.
I will totally agree with you about the Interbond, ACCUBOND etc....versus the AMAX at close ranges but never LR. Especially since most of my hunting loads dont have hyper velocities to start. If I used the 180 Interbond for deer in my 308, I am limited to about 550 yards due to the velocity requirments to open the bullet. The 178 AMAX will get me well past 800 effectively. I say effectively because the AMAX will 'consistently' open up at very low velocities where as ACCUBONDs, Interbonds, X bullets etc....dont. Again, short range = one bullet, long range = another. Many others here have been killing things at LR for a long time too. They (and me) recommend what works also.
That said, have you ever tried them on medium game at LR?
Well, have you?
I have only used the 140 a-max myself, at a MV of 2900 FPS.
I used this particular 260 AI for 2-3 seasons. I shot 13 or so deer and pronghorn.
Never shot one of them twice, every one died within 100 yards or less.
The shortest was a big bodied 165" whittail buck on a dead run at 75 yards bullet went in the pocket, mushed up his vitals and was sitting in the off side shoulder next to the hide.
Next was a 150 yard goat running broadside, center chest hit thru and thru, goat went down within 25 yards.
Killed 3 Deer over 600 2 bullets exited on adult does that were broadside, one remained in a large buck shot stem to stern.
The rest were all between 300 and 500ish. I can say that only once did I consider that the bullet failed (somewhat) I shot a average sized Mule deer at 300 yards quartering to me, hit the guy right on the shoulder knuckle. Thanfully bone frags punched thru the lungs and he only went 50 yards. Put many other bullets on that same bone and you could expect similar bullet detonation.
All in all I think the 140 a-max is a great bullet in medium cartriges.
I used this particular 260 AI for 2-3 seasons. I shot 13 or so deer and pronghorn.
Never shot one of them twice, every one died within 100 yards or less.
The shortest was a big bodied 165" whittail buck on a dead run at 75 yards bullet went in the pocket, mushed up his vitals and was sitting in the off side shoulder next to the hide.
Next was a 150 yard goat running broadside, center chest hit thru and thru, goat went down within 25 yards.
Killed 3 Deer over 600 2 bullets exited on adult does that were broadside, one remained in a large buck shot stem to stern.
The rest were all between 300 and 500ish. I can say that only once did I consider that the bullet failed (somewhat) I shot a average sized Mule deer at 300 yards quartering to me, hit the guy right on the shoulder knuckle. Thanfully bone frags punched thru the lungs and he only went 50 yards. Put many other bullets on that same bone and you could expect similar bullet detonation.
All in all I think the 140 a-max is a great bullet in medium cartriges.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Yes I have which is why I no longer use them.
I like to get a through and through wherever possible with a nice, neat hole on the backside.
I don't like massive losses of meat and big nasty holes. I don't like partial penetration.
That is why I do not use target/varmint bullets on game.
Those two bullets still don't expand at the same velocities and that is a big deal in the LR game. For medium powered cartridges or extreme long range a bullet that opens up below1800-1900 fps is a big deal.
And the 30 cal bullets you chose are by far the closest in BC. If you compare 6.5 or 7mm there is a much bigger discrepancy between bullet bc's.
I am not a guy that is against using a premium bullet for the right situation but I would argue it is just as bad to use a premium bullet for long range shots as it is to use a lightweight, frangible bullet our of a magnum up close. Both are going to give poor results.
One thing I like about Hornady bullets is that between the Interlock, Interbond, and SST, I can almost always get a bullet to hit very close to POI of my A-max's so I can just drop in one of those for a close-in shot and not have to worry about the A-max possibly blowing up. It really works quite well.
Scot E.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
And you would still be mistaken. Less than optimal velocities does not mean they do not expand at all.
As for my choice of bullets, I didn't choose, you did. Same weight, same caliber, same Hornady Loading Manual.
From the same manual, the 140gr Amax has a .065 higher BC than the Interlock. Better? Yes. Dramatically? No.
Friend, really not trying to be nit picky here but let's be serious. I really don't care if a premium bullets has a bent nose and I am not going to call said bent nose expansion. I would encourage you to read the many threads lately about premium hunting bullets penciling through animals and causing all kinds of recovery grief and in some cases lost animals. Most all of them were due to lack of sufficient impact velocity. A softer bullet like the A-max would have eliminated many of those issues IME because they open up wonderfully at the lower velocity levels that LR hunters find themselves at.
Can I ask if you have ever hunted with the A-max?
Also, the difference between the 6.5 140 gr A-max and Interlock is .12 in BC, not .065.
At 750 yards that is 15 less inches of drop, 11.5 less wind drift, 211 more fps, and 225 more ftlbs. I will take that any day, twice on the weekends and never look back.
Even if the A-max and SST are compared the differences are still 7 inches of drop, 6 inches of wind drift, 105 fps, and 115 ftlbs. Same bullet weight, same velocity out of a 260 Rem.
At 1000 yards and beyond the differences blow up. When you are talking vital zones of 8-18 inches and are dealing with cross current winds, updrafts, etc. I will take everything I can get.
The key is knowing what your bullet is capable of and being ready to make a change if needed. Again this is why having a close range bullet that impacts very similar to your LR bullet is such a good way to go IMO. You get the best of all worlds!
Scot E.
300WSMMAD
Well-Known Member
The 7mm 162 AMax is a phenominal killer up close and beyond.
I would suggest that a large proportion of the game killed here in NZ by long range hunters would be using the 162 AMax, lets emphise the LONG RANGE here 300 yrds IMHO is not long range.
dont knock em till youve tryed them.
I would suggest that a large proportion of the game killed here in NZ by long range hunters would be using the 162 AMax, lets emphise the LONG RANGE here 300 yrds IMHO is not long range.
dont knock em till youve tryed them.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Proper placement with the right bullet and adequate energy would have made the difference.
Already answered. Long ago. After watching several hogs and deer run off after being hit right in the bread basket leaving us with long and difficult tracks because there was so little bleeding due to the fact the bullet never exited I learned my lesson.
Pardon me I was looking at the SST. There is no 140gr interbond in 6.5.
You know I don't even carry a ballistics calculator or weather meter and I manage to kill much smaller targets than deer at that range and beyond with the .260 shooting 130gr interbonds and sciroccos so I don't see where such a crutch is necessary. If you are however using field calculations then having the proper variables entered eliminates the guess work.
So? That's why you have a ballistics program.
I can only think of one word that is really fitting for the use of a 6.5 at over 1,00yds on anything bigger than coyotes with any bullet, and that is "irresponsible".
No the key is using a bullet that is going to perform consistently and reliably at any range you pick within the practical limitatios of the caliber.
Before I'd use the Amax in the scenarios you describe I'd either go to the Scirocco or Berger Hunting VLD's. Much better choices of bullets.
I've got a very large 3x4 freak of a buck I've been watching for the last few weeks. If The shot presents itself my ambush set up will have me shooting him at between 800-1080yds. If he's under 900 I will use the .260, and if beyond I will use the 300 Rum. Both will be loaded with the Sciroccos and I have 100% confidence that the bullets will do the job even if I get a direct strike on the point of the shoulder.
At the same ranges I'm getting nice 1.5-2" exit holes on coyotes consistently and the doe I shot at 600 two weeks ago with the .260 gave similar results.
Shoot what you want. I don't care, but I will continue to recommend that quality hunting bullets be used in hunting situations to anyone who asks because that is what they are designed for.
