exploding bullets on impact...is this real or are people guessing?

[Palix-Dog]

Speaking of the Hornady Interlocks. I shot a mule deer at around 100yds with a 225 gn 338 WM at 2950 ft/sec. It left a 6" ext wound through the offside ribs. Everything in side was jello. Dead deer but it made me wonder what would have happened if I had hit a elk in the shoulder with this combo?
I know 338 is overkill for deer but my 270wsm was having a scope issue and this was my back up rifle.

 

[nicholasjohn]

Blow-ups are due to a combination of things - bullet mass, construction, velocity and material impacted.

Over the years I've seen more animals wounded and lost after being shot with a .243 than probably all other calibers combined. As a result I'm a big fan of monos (Barnes tipped bullets in particular), bonded core, hybrid (bonded front core, mono rear) and Partition/A-Frame type construction.

I once shot a Nosler 40g BT varmint bullet into a tin can containing a terrycloth rag that had soaked up some oil, so partially wet, partially dry. The can was on its side with the bottom facing me. The muzzle velocity was 4052fps, range around 40-50 yards. The interesting thing was no noticeable exit with lots of shrapnel holes and dents in the sides of the can.

Another time I used the same load to shoot a coyote at 300 yards. The bullet entered the rear of the head, killing it instantly. A single drop of blood was seen in one ear. No exit wound of any kind. Try as I might, I can't see a significantly heavier or more solidly constructed bullet doing so little visible damage.

Over the years I've killed elk with cup and core bullets, monos and hybrids, 140g to 225g, no problems. When my .257 Roberts gets carried, a 120g A-Frame is in the spout.

I used the 180-grain A-Frames in the 30-06 for a long time, and shot a lot of animals with it. I have never had anything but complete penetration with it, even on deer shot the long way. The tissue damage was never extreme, but the animals all went down immediately. I know that there are numerous factors that determine whether or not the animal will drop at the shot, and I've read a ton of stories about the "energy-dump" theory, and the bullet staying in the animal. If dumping all the energy in the animal is so important to dropping them on the spot, why then does a bullet which plows all the way through and makes smallish wound channels so effective at knocking them down right now ??? I realize that the 30-06 is a big gun for deer, and I have only used this cartridge/bullet combination on elk a couple of times. It has worked the same way - just not as many times as with deer.

 

[robert l]

Speaking of the Hornady Interlocks. I shot a mule deer at around 100yds with a 225 gn 338 WM at 2950 ft/sec. It left a 6" ext wound through the offside ribs. Everything in side was jello. Dead deer but it made me wonder what would have happened if I had hit a elk in the shoulder with this combo?
I know 338 is overkill for deer but my 270wsm was having a scope issue and this was my back up rifle.

I do not think 338 is over kill on white tail and up. you just use a smaller pill.One rifle fits every thing in north america.

 

[Pointman]

The only projectiles I seen "blow up" were the factory 17 Remington loads my wife was using in her new rifle. It was in the mid-1970s when she was shooting at the range on a foggy day with me. She told me she couldn't see any hits on the target. The range master speculated that due to the conditions and the speed of the load and the fragile nature of a 25 grain HP in the fog, this was what was going on. At the first "ceasefire", we went to check her target and lo and behold there were many "fleck" tears but no holes. Later that year I was using it on a ground squirrel hunt and took a shot at one at about 75 yds. The bullet never got there. There was some grass between me and the target so the assumption was that the bullet was deflected off course. When it did connect, that little pill did more damaged than my 25-06.

 

[memtb]

Speaking of the Hornady Interlocks. I shot a mule deer at around 100yds with a 225 gn 338 WM at 2950 ft/sec. It left a 6" ext wound through the offside ribs. Everything in side was jello. Dead deer but it made me wonder what would have happened if I had hit a elk in the shoulder with this combo?
I know 338 is overkill for deer but my 270wsm was having a scope issue and this was my back up rifle.

Your experience with the Interlocks, somewhat mirrors my findings with Hornady Interlocks! See post #194 memtb

 

[floyd kittrell]

bigngreen, I've had bullets that I've been disappointed with, but only one that absolutely failed (by my standards, not those of many here). I've been very pleased and successful with mono bullets. Though, once an antelope, hit "very" low in the chest....didn't leave blood for about 30 yards. The Antelope went down at around 40 to 45. And unless pushed very fast, shots over 800 or 900 should not be taken with a Barnes. Though, in reality an unexpanded bullet through bone and vitals, is likely more effective than one that "fragments" on the surface .....creating a shallow wound!

One should certainly operate within the performance limits of their chosen bullet. In summary: I will not take shots beyond 700 yards, and perhaps many here shouldn't take shots at less than 400 or 500 yards. I'll work within my limits.....but, will these other "sportsmen"! memtb

Yes Sir, I have been shooting Barnes for over 30 years , I always run them hot and light weight . Barnes will give you the data for expansion if you call and ask , I believe this is of utmost importance when using a high integrity mono bullet. Your range is limited by bullet speed for proper performance . I have never had a failure but nothing man does is perfect , my next fired Barnes could fail , I do not know but I trust them to do everything they were intended to do with in limits of reason. I normally limit my shots to 650 yards as a choice.

 

[nicholasjohn]

The only projectiles I seen "blow up" were the factory 17 Remington loads my wife was using in her new rifle. It was in the mid-1970s when she was shooting at the range on a foggy day with me. She told me she couldn't see any hits on the target. The range master speculated that due to the conditions and the speed of the load and the fragile nature of a 25 grain HP in the fog, this was what was going on. At the first "ceasefire", we went to check her target and lo and behold there were many "fleck" tears but no holes. Later that year I was using it on a ground squirrel hunt and took a shot at one at about 75 yds. The bullet never got there. There was some grass between me and the target so the assumption was that the bullet was deflected off course. When it did connect, that little pill did more damaged than my 25-06.

Your situation is similar to something I have experienced. When shotgun slug loads with sabots first came on the scene, we were all using one from accompany named BRI. It was a hard-cast lead slug, shaped like an hour glass, and they were 50 caliber in the 12-gauge load. When we shot on gusty days, they often broke in half on the way to the target. We attributed this to the sabots somehow not falling off a the same time, because sometimes we would only find one half of the sabot laying there on the snow out in front of the shooting bench. We saw a few bullet holes that were silhouettes of the hourglass shape, and a few that were obviously halves of those bullets.

I have also shot at prairie dogs that were screened by vegetation, and in my case it was the stalks of wild poppies. If these stalks happened to get blown in front of the path of the bullets, all sorts of crazy things happened. Once it was three PD's all standing on the mound, and my buddy shot a the one in the center. The poppy stems got in the way, and all three of the animals exploded at once ! What a show that was - wish I had it on video.

Lastly, I also had an experience with a 40-grain .224" bullet that was meant for the 22 Hornet. We trued them in the 22-250. I don't know how fast they were going, but it was fast enough to make them come unraveled on the way to the target. A couple of times we saw a puff of smoke just ahead of the muzzle of the rifle, but the only time anything hit the target was when we had moved it in close ( 25-yards ) just to see what was going down-range. The wholes in the paper showed that it was just pieces of bullets. Nothing was anything like a round hole. It was one of those bullets with the really thin jacket, and my rough-throated rifle was tearing them apart.

 

[JimmyCP]

I have read many threads over the years about bullets blowing up on impact and not being a lethal hit with game such as a deer. My questions are as follows:

1. Has anyone ever witnessed a bullet actually blow up on impact with a deer, and not kill the deer? and what I mean by this is you were able to get a second shot on the deer and actually see the first shot in autopsy to confirm and not guess what happened.

2. If your answer to 1 is YES, I just do not get the physics of this so maybe someone can explain it to me. I just don't understand how a 140+ grain object going 2800+FPS can explode, even on bone, and the fragments do not still penetrate to the vitals.

I have used ballistic tips in the past in excess of 3000fps and while they definitely "blew up" inside the deer, they still took the deer out no problem. Ive yet to have one blow up on a shoulder and not had fragments penetrate to lungs and heart.

Yep, seen results of eld match hit a rib on a cow elk. 6 inch hole on entrance side. One piece of jacket found in the rib meat on the exit. 365 yard shot.

The amp jacket on eld, eldx and amax was designed to expand at lower velocities so at high velocity shorter ranges they can have undesirable results.
It's a bullet I personally wouldn't have used on that hunt.

 

[keithcandler]

Perhaps we need to start a thread, "What bullets have you killed ten deer, elk, with that have not exploded on impact"

Also, "What bullets have you had pencil through deer and elk"

 

[Mustang72]

Memtb-- not blaming the interlock. I have shot them for years with great results. I was pushing them to fast and they were 20+ years old.

Robert l-- I u never made it a living but used to get paid to shoot pigs to keep them out of the corn fields. Those two from the 7 mag were the only two I ever had explode. Griddle plates can be tough and thick but I have never seen one stop a 308.


I 'll stick with my same theory -- if you absolutely want something dead shoot a partition!

 

[memtb]

Mustang72, I certainly wasn't suggesting that you were dissatisfied with the Interlocks. In my lower velocity rifles, I would certainly consider using them.....I loved them in my old .375 H&H. However, in my higher velocity stuff.....I went to Barnes' in '92. memtb

 

[Naymola]

I call hit's like these "splash's". This is a called in coyote, running, one single shot on the shoulder at 15 yards. I couldn't get it to stop, almost ran me over. 20-250 using Nosler Ballistic Tips 40 grain at 4300 fps. I've killed a lot of coyotes with this gun and bullet, this splash was a freak. 99% of the time, clean quick kills. This bullet has been very reliable. I've tried a half dozen different "varmint" bullets, some from custom bullet makers and all failed miserably (splashing) except the NBT. This coyote was DRT when I hit it. Typically, when a bullet splash's, it's a surface wound and I've got an animal spinning and biting at the wound, requiring a follow up shot or two. This of course is unacceptable, and it was only during the trial period of using different bullets. I'm convinced the solid base of the NBT assures good kills.

 

[arch408]

I had two other interesting blow ups. I was shooting prairie dogs on my property and waited until a mature prairie dog lined up with a half grown pup in front of it. I was using a .223 Rem with 55 grain spitzers. The shot was about 125 yards. The pup was almost cut in half, but the one behind it was literally blown up. I shot a mature jack rabbit broadside with a .17 Rem factory 25 grain bullet at about 150 yards. When the bullet impacted I noticed fur floating. The rabbit was lying with the bullet entry facing up. There was a light trickle of blood on its chest. There was no exit wound and all the fur on that side was gone.

 

[LVJ76]

Here is a coyote with a behind the shoulder shot hit at 100 yds with a 140gr Ballistic Silvertip from a 7mm Rem Mag, muzzle velocity at 3,250, instant death, bullet did not exit, just blew a big entrance hole. Got him as he was turning away so the shot hit a little back and dropped right on it's tracks.