Effectiveness of Glass Bedding

[ShtrRdy]

My hunting partner is a Savage guru and likes the Criterion barrels for a cost effective solution. Or you could buy from one of the excellent barrel makers such as Krieger, Bartlein, Shilen, Hawk Hill, Brux, ....

 

[Capt RB]

First torque tune the action to the stock. My model 10 was 35inch#s front screw 30 back screw. I ran up and down a few times. The difference was amazing. 1"300 yd groups were common. 1.5" 500yd groups if i called the wind well. sub 3" just about always hot cold weather or barrel.
Follow the directions and go up 5 in/#s at a time. I'm using a weaver torque screw driver for this. Wheeler works. Once you have it shooting make sure you check it if your going from a warm truck to near zero weather at the end of the day. The aluminum has a different rate of expansion than steel. It can show up on target. I didn't have an issue with the savage but I have with aluminum blocked stocks in the past.

 

[Orange Dust]

What Barrelnut said. Work with your Accu-stock first. I recently got a model 11 Longrange Hunter with Accustock. Out of the box when testing for max load, it seemed to throw everything almost in the same ragged hole. Then I took it out of the stock to adjust the trigger and have nothing but problems with it. Bad vertical stringing. After poking around about, I found this:
http://www.savageshooters.com/content.php?265-Proper-Torque-Sequence-For-The-AccuStock

It made a very big difference by backing off the front screw 1/2 turn (as per the instructions) and running the torque up to 45 inch pounds in 10 i.p. increments. 45 i.p. seems to be the spot on mine. Mine doesn't have the wedge but it still pertains.

Do the above first. Epoxy bedding may or may not help accuracy. It will seldom hurt accuracy. It can have a dramatic effect on a rifle with bedding issues. USUALLY it will make the rifle less sensitive to torque requirements on the action screws, and less sensitive to removing/replacing the action in the stock. And like I said, usually.

 

[ar10ar15man]

lots of things one can do.
bbl lapping savage bbls is typically a good thing.
i just lapped a 223 $300 cabelas special savage ad it did 2 things.
better accuracy, and easier to clean.
tubbs lapping kit
FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS all 5 bullets all 50 rounds

 

[xsn10s]

What Barrelnut said. Work with your Accu-stock first. I recently got a model 11 Longrange Hunter with Accustock. Out of the box when testing for max load, it seemed to throw everything almost in the same ragged hole. Then I took it out of the stock to adjust the trigger and have nothing but problems with it. Bad vertical stringing. After poking around about, I found this:
http://www.savageshooters.com/content.php?265-Proper-Torque-Sequence-For-The-AccuStock

It made a very big difference by backing off the front screw 1/2 turn (as per the instructions) and running the torque up to 45 inch pounds in 10 i.p. increments. 45 i.p. seems to be the spot on mine. Mine doesn't have the wedge but it still pertains.

Nice! Learned something new today. I saved this in my "Gunsmithing" folder just in case.

 

[Alibiiv]

I don't own a Savage, however have glass bedded quite a number of stocks. I always start by marking the inletted section of the stock and clear about an eighth to three-sixteenths of an inch all around the lug. I then put a mark four inches in front of the recoil lug and then clear that down at least three sixteenths of an inch deep up to the four inch mark in front of the recoil lug. I then try to take about one-sixteenth of an inch the rest of the length of the barrel inlet right to the end of the stock. I use .010 thousandths "pipe tape" from Brownells and put two layer onto the barrel itself, starting at four inches in front of the recoil lug; only on the barrel. I like the tape because once the barrel is removed out of the epoxy you will have a really nice .040 thousandths seam between the channel bed and the barrel, plus you will have a really nice .040 thousandths free floating barrel. I do a test run with the action into the stock and while that barrel is in the stock I use modeling clay to build a dam on the forend of the stock so that the epoxy will not run out when I bed the action. I have always improved accuracy when I have done this. There definitely will be varying opinions on bedding and free floating a barrel, all I can tell you is that it has "always" improved my accuracy when I do this. I've primarily done Remingtons and Rugers with this process. Also something else that I have done to improve accuracy is to lap the scope rings in once they are installed on the rifle. Wheeler makes a really nice scope mounting kit for around $100. It includes two lapping mandrels (1 inch and 30mm), lapping compound, a couple of levels to get your scope mounted straight onto the rifle, a number of really handy screwdriver bits and some torx bits, and a torque screwdriver. I use the torque screwdriver all of the time when mounting a scope on the bases, and the rings, as well as on all of the action screws. All this makes a difference with your accuracy. As others have written you can work up a load for your rifle. I have two rifles that were made together on the same actions, with the same reamer and by the same gunsmith; one is my son's the other is mine both in 35 Whelen. We both hunt and shoot together, his rifle absolutely does not like what my rifle likes either in bullets, powders or loads. All variables that will affect accuracy and you can find the right one for your rifle. I start with a particular bullet, and powder. From there I will start my loads about a half-grain to a grain below maximum charge and load four bullets, and then decrease the load by a half a grain and load four more rounds until I have used up all the brass making loads one half a grain lower for each set of three. And certainly a really good trigger will help, however from all I have read the Savage already has a nice trigger. So.....you have a lot of variables to think about.

 

[Merica]

I'm new to the forum and collectively it would seem that there are many hundreds of years of experience from the members here, so I'm much sure how much more value I could add to this thread.

Like others have said, make sure you work from least time/labor/cost intensive fixes to the most. I've had a few rifles that couldn't group where the rings were the culprit, others where it was the scope. Make sure that your optic is mounted properly and your rings are torqued/loctited. I've had multiple rings loosen themselves up causing my groups to open up and walk. I've also had a few quality scopes (leupold vxiii/Nikon buck masters) that broke internally. Both were warrantied with no issues, but I say that to show you that even the bigger names can have issues, especially with thousands of scopes being sold each year.

Once you know that your optics are solidly mounted (lapped rings and a level reticle help too) it might save you time and money if that helps tighten things up before you bed your action or change your barrel.

 

[Orange Dust]

I'm new to the forum and collectively it would seem that there are many hundreds of years of experience from the members her, so I'm much sure how much more value I could add to this thread.

Like others have said, make sure you work from least time/labor/cost intensive fixes to the most. I've had a few rifles that couldn't group where the rings were the culprit, others where it was the scope. Make sure that your optic is mounted properly and your rings are torqued/loctited. I've had multiple rings loosen themselves up causing my groups to open up and walk. I've also had a few quality scopes (leupold vxiii/Nikon buck masters) that broke internally. Both were warrantied with no issues, but I say that to show you that even the bigger names can have issues, especially with thousands of scopes being sold each year.

Once you know that your optics are solidly mounted (lapped rings and a level reticle help too) it might save you time and money if that helps tighten things up before you bed your action or change your barrel.

Welcome to the Forum. Great folks here.

 

[Greyfox]

My experience with two Accu-stocks...LRH and Predator.
-Both had a small pressure point at the tip of the fore-end. When removed and the barrel fully floated, groups shrank from +1 MOA to <.5MOA.
-The Accu-stock can flex with increases in torque, both effecting accuracy, and sometimes can cause the stock to make contact with the trigger bar. I found the front(lug) tightened to #45, and the rear to #20-#25 pounds produced the most consistent performance. Apply Blue Loctite as the bedding screws seem to loosen over time. If the rear is overtightened(+#45) it may deform the rear of the bedding block. It's a poor design! An aftermarket stock with a firm chassis, glass bedded, or both is the best solution.
-As an aside, the extraction/ejection can be substanciallly improved and reliable with two low cost modifications in about 5 minutes. Replace the .125" extractor detent ball with a .140"(Brownells), and the Ejector Pin/Spring with the long stem/heavy spring replacement(Midway).
-the factorybarrels on both of these Savages while a bit rough when bore-scoped, gave consistent and accurate performance in the Accustocks(tuned as above). When the 6.5x284 reached 1200 rounds and still shooting sub .5MOA, I replaced the original stock with an MPA Light Chassis and the barrel with a Criterion Light Palma. While the action is not as smooth and nicely finished, accuracy and reliability is on par with my best customs.
Shown . Top-Factory LRH, middle-Criterion Lt Palma, bottom-MPA/Criterion

-

 

[MTLIVIN]

Lots of good info already on here, but I wouldn't bed an accustock. I'm a savage guy and every factory gun I've played with shot under 1 MOA, often closer to 0.5 MOA with some work. I'd follow the torque advise and make sure the barrel is free floating at the tip of the stock, I had to open mine up as well on my model 116 in 6.5x284. Also try some Barnes TTSX or accubond 180 grain bullets before giving up on your barrel, both are offered in factory loads. If all of that doesn't give you better than 1 MOA accuracy, buy a prefit barrel from Northland Shooter Supply (Criterion & Shillen) or McGowen directly. Can't go wrong with any of those and the owner of NSS is a great guy to buy through.

 

[WildRose]

I own a Savage 116 FCSS weather warrior in 300 Win Mag and I am looking to improve my rifles accuracy. I am at around 1.25-1.5 MOA at 100 yards and the rifle is completely stock. I am wondering about the effectiveness of glass bedding a Boyds stock or any other modifications I could do to lower my grouping size. Shooting 195 gr Hornady BTHP.

Yes I feel your rifle will be more consistent with a (properly) bedded action, compared with a Tupperware non accustock stock. Remember to float the tang when bedding Savage acions.
Do you reload?
Try 185 Berger Hybrid target or 180 Elite hunter with h1000 or Reloder 25.

You will do WAY more accuracy tuning on a rifle with the ammo.


Also I recommend Devcon 10110 steel for bedding.

This.

Forget the glass, buy Devcon and be sure you use enough release agent.

 

[WideEagle]

I own a Savage 116 FCSS weather warrior in 300 Win Mag and I am looking to improve my rifles accuracy. I am at around 1.25-1.5 MOA at 100 yards and the rifle is completely stock. I am wondering about the effectiveness of glass bedding a Boyds stock or any other modifications I could do to lower my grouping size. Shooting 195 gr Hornady BTHP.

Playing with action screws and getting good results can be a good sign the bedding is not so great from the start. Having used Devcon Liquid Steel many times you can get a solid bed allowing you to torque screws as tight as you would ever need. Free floating a barrel does not always work but usually is an improvement. On a Savage I would recommend a small pressure point in front of receiver as one easy check.

If you handload pay attention to bullet ogive and distance from lands. That simple step in reloading can result in incredible differences in groups. Since you are using a belted cartridge the bullet length becomes another way to get consistent pressures. If you reload there is no reason not to have a one hole group from a Savage stock barrel. Just takes time at the range. Lots of time.

 

[Justin Todd]

For what it's worth I have a few rifles and didn't start getting good accuracy until I learned to hand load my ammo and find a good bullet, brass prep and brass and powder combo. For instance I have a 7mm rem mag that wouldn't shoot better than 2 inch moa at 100 yards rifle killed a lot of deer with that under 100 yards but when I stopped hunting and could only target shoot I wanted better accuracy it's an old Savage 110 action so I bought a boyds stock and a criterion barrel and paid a good gunsmith to glass bed it and set the head space. The rifle still only shot 1.5 moa at 100 yards. After I learned to reload and started figuring out what the rifle liked I can now shoot one hole groups probably .25 moa at 100 yards and 1.5 at 400 yards with that rifle. I also shrank my groups with my rem 700 adl .308 cheap synthetic stock rifle shot 1.5 moa with box ammo and now shoots almost as good as my 7mm only thing I changed was the scope on that rifle. It shoots .5 moa at 100 and will hold 2.5 inch groups out to 400 yards. So yes a stiffer stock, glass bedding, a decent scope all make a difference but the biggest for me has been reloading to match what the rifle likes instead of being limited to factory box ammo.

 

[WideEagle]

I totally agree and know hanloading is the key.

Mark Chanlynn built a Remington 700 30-338 for me with heavy slightly tapered 26" barrel 1 1/8 inch at muzzle. He installed a Jewell trigger to top it off.

At a 500 Yard prone match it shot 10 rounds into a .342 hole. Used a Burris Blackdiamond scope. Watched every round go into thar paper target on a perfect day. Yes a moving backstop in the pits for these matches run by Jim Cloward at Machias HighPower Club.

I actually lost to a guy with a 6.5X284. That was a real disappointment.

They were handloads of course.