Does a gunsmith know when a barrel will shoot?

[Taj]

Besides being competent and confident, is there something in the process of barrel lets a smith know if a barrel is going to be a 1/4" gun or a 1" gun?

Don't I wish!!

 

[Playtimefun]

I can't say for all the various manufacturers... but the local gunsmith here in Saskatoon told me one time that if it's a Remington with the serial numbers starting with A, B, C or D, that it took him half as much work to turn them into a good shooter then the guys with serial numbers after that.

Secondly, a local barrel guy here in Saskatchewan was known internationally for his barrels (not sure if he is still alive... if he is I need a new barrel or 2 for projects yet to be dreamed of) but I will never forget his words about how you break in a barrel. If it's a good barrel, you shoot it... PERIOD. All to do with barrel quality and workmanship.

In the end both guys were basically saying the same thing... good materials... good workmanship... some time and patience... and you get a dang good rifle in the end!!!

 

[Frank in the Laurels]

NO NO NO...only a sheet of paper knows..

 

[Playtimefun]

Lmao... just thinking back to one guy I know who shoots a really nice... expensive... semi custom made rifle. I don't think the paper he shoots at has ANYTHING to worry about.

 

[RichCoyle]

I took one of my rifles to the gunsmith because it was maybe a minute and a half rifle. He switched to his stock. He fired two groups. One was 3/8" and one was 1/8" so I tried to buy the stock. Not for sale!

So I bought one like it.

 

[Phil Rizzo]

I can't say for all the various manufacturers... but the local gunsmith here in Saskatoon told me one time that if it's a Remington with the serial numbers starting with A, B, C or D, that it took him half as much work to turn them into a good shooter then the guys with serial numbers after that.

Secondly, a local barrel guy here in Saskatchewan was known internationally for his barrels (not sure if he is still alive... if he is I need a new barrel or 2 for projects yet to be dreamed of) but I will never forget his words about how you break in a barrel. If it's a good barrel, you shoot it... PERIOD. All to do with barrel quality and workmanship.

In the end both guys were basically saying the same thing... good materials... good workmanship... some time and patience... and you get a dang good rifle in the end!!!

There was a long time period when m700's were 99.9%
Free float the barrel, lighten the trigger and find good loads. Go kill.
Most of the problems I saw with them was eventually found to be the scopes…. I won't name em but we all know who was popular or not during these decades.
Of course we didn't demand quite as much performance as we do today, but still, some things you could count on.

 

[Muddybuddy]

I took one of my rifles to the gunsmith because it was maybe a minute and a half rifle. He switched to his stock. He fired two groups. One was 3/8" and one was 1/8" so I tried to buy the stock. Not for sale!

So I bought one like it.

I thought you were going to say it was the Indian and not the arrow!

 

[VinceMule]

There was also a time when some of the scope base makers were issuing screws too long for the front screw in the base. The screw would dig into the barrel tenon thread, and the gun would not shoot well at all. When some of the screw was ground off, accuracy issue was fixed.

Also, for a while, Remington was supplying a washer to go under the BDL floor plate, which allowed the magazine box to float, not putting the action in a bind.

 

[Trm82]

1/4" or 1" gun is what exactly? 3 shot group? 5 shot? 30 shot?

1/4 or 1/2 inch 3 shot groups aren't very impressive

They impress me !!
I've never shot any more than 3 shot groups .
It's a waste of components and barrel life.
My rifles all maintain 1/4-1/2 moa along ways out so what would 5 shot groups get me when I'm developing a load ?
I know what it gets me ! Absolutely nothing.

 

[VinceMule]

Multiple three shot groups saves a lot of throat wear as the fourth and fifth shots really heat the barrel up, not to mention copper issues. The first three shot group is just getting started.

If you get groups where the group is vertical, then add .2-.3g more powder, if they are horizontal, then adjust seating depth in .003 increments. Don't be surprised if you start shooting single bullet hole groups.

 

[Playtimefun]

1/4" or 1" gun is what exactly? 3 shot group? 5 shot? 30 shot?

1/4 or 1/2 inch 3 shot groups aren't very impressive

I think that I have to respectfully disagree now... which is a change from years ago. I used to live by the "5 shot group" and I got very spoilt as a teenager as the first rifle I purchased (and still own) is a Remington 700 BDL in 300 Win Mag that consistently shot 5 shot - 1/2" groups with 165 and 180 grain Hornady Interlok bullets. 3/4 - 7/8" with 200 grain nosler Partitions.

Then I realized over the years that 5 shot groups don't mean much when it's a hunting rifle because by the 5th shot that animal is FLYING!!! But I think the gun that set the bar for me in understanding what accuracy I need is a custom built Sako in 300 RUM that i bought used. The first 2 shots are within 1/2" or less. BUT... that 3rd shot... wowsers... it's 6" high. The gun has a 26" PENCIL THIN barrel that if you need to light a fire in the bush if your stranded just fire 3 shots fast and push the barrel against a tree/bush and it will be on fire. But the confidence I have in that gun when elk hunting is phenomenal because it points beautifully and it's dropped running bull elk at 250 yards faster then being hit with a train. (Maybe not as fast as a 6.5 Creedmoor can but the Creedmoor cuts and wraps the mest before it hits the ground lol)

In the end, I love doing bedding and trigger jobs on my guns. I want them to shoot tiny tiny groups but if they don't.... somehow I still keep the gun anyways and somehow they still wind up shooting something.

The latest crazy thought that keeps running through my head with the potential selling of the house and moving to a condo in 5 years to maybe retire (doubtful) is do I build a gun with a titanium action... the lightest carbon stock... but the absolute LIGHTEST pencil thin barrel possible as one of my final guns. (This is based on the fact that I won't have room for 90+ guns in the condo). Yes... i know that they dont necessairly pojnt the greatest and have experiebced that with a wby ultralight. My expected/hopeful accuracy for this combo... a 2 shot 1/3-1/2" max group. All because after 2 shots it's either on the ground... in the bush... or in the next province/state!!!

 

[VinceMule]

Warning, those ultra light rifles with pencil barrels are hard to tune and more difficult(not as much fun) to shoot.

I have three model 7s in 243, 7/08, and 308. It took us a while to figure out the winning combo for 1/2" accuracy and less. In the end, we outsmarted ourselves going ultra light.

 

[Playtimefun]

@VinceMule Yep... I agree totally. However, the Browning Mountain Ti's that I have are teaching me that it's not always the case and that's what got me thinking about it. Don't ask me what it is but the one in 7 WSM, you can fire all day and you swear the barrel isn't even warm. And it's ACCURATE. The 325 WSM after a couple of shots is hot... but it still shots a tight group.

I don't own a model 7 but have the 673 in 6.5 Rem Mag but there's chamber issues with that gun. Be interesting to see how old school compares... just mounted a 2.5-8x36 Leup on a Rem 660 in 6.5 RM last night.

 

[HARPERC]

I took one of my rifles to the gunsmith because it was maybe a minute and a half rifle. He switched to his stock. He fired two groups. One was 3/8" and one was 1/8" so I tried to buy the stock. Not for sale!.

It all has to work together.