geo4061
Well-Known Member
I doubt he was using sub sonic ammo because I have never seen any manufactured in 22 magnum.
Coyote hunting tips
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Personally I don't use anything smaller then a 223 running at 2900 fps mv . For me shot placement is important but it becomes even more so with the smaller calibers . Yes I can kill a coyote dead in it's tracks with a 22 long rifle and a head shot but if I have a side shot and put the bullet where I normally would it's going to go a ways and I will need to track it with little blood to help me . So much of it depends on what type of terrain you are hunting in . If you are out in open terrain and your shots average 100 yards and sometimes longer you don't want a 22 mag or shot gun even . If you are in brushy country and your shots are closer to 20 out to 50 or 75 yards a shot gun or even some of the 17's will work for you most of the time if you don't get excited and place your bullet where it needs to be . Shot placement means so much more in those cases . There are those of us that don't get shaken and can do it regularly and are usually at a good distance for using small caliber rifles . Again a lot depends on your normal shooting conditions . It means that you have figured out the way that the majority of the coyote will react to what you do with your calls . when you lower the volume , change the pitch , make different sounds ect. . That is one of the reasons I say that sounds are seasonal like the puppy squeals are a spring and early summer sound , the majority of the coyote will charge into it and you don't have control of them when you may want them to come in slowly for any number of reasons such as you are in a brushy area and want to see more then just a glimpse of them making a run by , or as they are in an open area and you want them to come in running only part way then you want them to slow down and stop at a certain distance you change your sounds from a dyeing rabbit to a coyote bark but you have already changed the volume of the rabbit when they were out there a long ways to a lower volume as kind of a coaxer volume to get them started coming in the first place or to bring them in closer . Maybe you have a fight sound that you know will make the majority of coyote just sneak in to see what is going on and you have a coyote that you know from past experiences with it that will just set out there and bark so you use that sound for a longer amount of time and you just want to peak it's curiosity quietly to make it think it's tricking you and being sneaky till it gets to a good shooting place and will peak around a sage bush at you . You've shot a coyote out of a pair and one is running full out away , you want to stop it you go to the hurt coyote sounds almost as soon as you made the first shot it stops and you make that shot but keep doing the hurt coyote sound and here comes one from out of the brush or a draw that you hadn't even seen before as it was being sneaky because it wasn't in it's home range as the other two were . Perusing the predators is an art and a skill that you don't often pick up and become really good at in just a few trips out or by watching others do it on TV because there is so much that goes on that you can't experience in a trip or two even with someone that is very good at it and that is another reason I keep saying to keep good notes as to what took place when you were out doing it . You may get out twenty times this winter in 3 months then you don't get out again till next fall to call so many of us will have forgotten some of what we had happen last year in that amount of lapsed time . For most of us it's about enjoying our time not being frustrated by them not being fooled by what we do or don't do .
geo4061
Well-Known Member
A lot of the ranches won't allow coyote hunting until deer season is over. Does coyote calling during deer season really hurt your chance of shooting a big buck?
It's just that they don't want too many people with guns running around at the same time for safeties sake . You want to be out there hiding and calling and the deer hunters want to be out there slipping up on a big buck hiding in the brushy draws where your trying to call even wearing hunter orange an accident can happen . So many people will just wear an orange hat and camo every where else . Not every one is as observant as they could be . Some people don't hunt all year and only get out for deer season so they might get excited and not be as careful as they otherwise would be as well . It is always best to ere on the side of safety . I learned fast that I didn't want to be calling during other hunting seasons .
Several years ago my brother and were building houses together. We were building a spec house for a man that owned several hundred acres that he ran cattle on, it was covered up with deer. I asked one day if he allowed anyone to hunt deer? He went on a five minute rave about not wanting any deer hunters on his property. Several weeks later we were talking cattle and he was telling me he had a huge problem with coyotes taking calves in the spring. It was bad enough that he had to bring springing cows to a barn lot beside his house and still had to keep an eye on them. He made this comment about the coyotes, "I wish someone would kill them". I don't have much of a filter and tend to say what's on my mind so I replied, "maybe if you'd let some one deer hunt they'd help with your coyote problem". He just looked at me for a second and walked off. That was well over 20 years ago and as far as I know he still has a coyote problem.
TRnCO
Well-Known Member
justinp61, you should've offered to go in and hunt those coyotes. Once you build up a relationship, chances are the guy would've also let you hunt deer too.
geo4061 , as we have talked about coyote have a complex set of vocalizations and I have really just kind of scratched the surface of what they say to each other . I do know that often when they are excited , scared or angry they do mostly barking . I have heard them stand and bark for 20 to 30 minutes . I was den hunting up on the mountain once and came across a dog coyote standing and barking at another coyote . Being the way that I am I wanted to know what the deal was so I got close and sat to watch the show and see if I could learn from it . I watched with my binoculars and found that there was a coyote by some rocks that had a hole under them . After a while I figured that the one barking and showing it's self was trying to lure the other coyote away from the rocks with the den under it . When I got them both shot they were both males and there was 8 pups in the hole under the rocks . he did no howls just barks and a steady stream of them as well as being in full view of the other coyote . I have seen the same behavior when calling when the coyote are not comfortable with the situation or when I am too close to their den with pups in it and they don't know that I'm not another coyote . They act like a bird and try to draw me out away from their pups . They will seldom do much if any howling in that situation if they do howl it's just short partial howls mostly like a small yodel thrown in with the barks . So to me when they are barking it's an alarm sound and thus I seldom use barks by themselves but they do have a place in the world of calling in conjunction with howls .
I seldom use an E-Call to make coyote vocalizations as I'm not skilled enough with one and I can replicate what the coyote say to me better with my hand call as that is what I had when I started calling . E-Calls have come a long ways in just a few years . I still make most of my own howlers as that is what I had to do when I started out calling . The first howler I bought was from a guy named Bill Austin and he made them by hand out of PVC pipe and a plastic note book cover . He held the reed on with a lastrator band . I have found that a good piece of walnut has the best tone for what I do .
I also noticed , a lot of years ago , that when the pups are young the female will stay with the pups all night then the male will go out hunting and to get water . When he comes back in the morning he will give a long howl from a long distance , no barks just one long howl . She will answer him with the same long howl . As he gets closer they will do the same again sometimes 3 or four times as he is coming in toward the den . Her answers are from one spot while his are moving . the male has a much lower tone to his voice and the female has a higher pitch to her voice . When they get together they will do a lot of yipping and yapping as they greet each other kind of like very short howl or yodels squeaks and some wines mixed together like your dogs will do when you have taken one hunting and bring it back to meet the other that you left home . You have just located the den within a few feet and this is because you sat and listened to them instead of trying to call them to you . You then move closer to where they are and then I use what I call an interrogation call most of the time , it's two howls of a medium length two barks and another howl of the same length . I wait a few minutes then do it again if they haven't talked to me , male or female in tone , often the female is what I like the best as it doesn't cause as much anger in the coyote they are more curious of a female in their home area . I used a long lone howl as a locator often . The length of the howl varies with the situation it seems that long howls are a form of locating other coyote while shorter howls have other uses and are often used in a series or with barks or woofs . I will start using coyote vocalizations more in the fall and then use them till early summer when the young pups are starting to venture out as they tend to not respond to them and want to run from them not to them . Breding season is a time when I like the female tones best it works for both male and female where it seems that male tones most often will get males to respond . It seems that a series of three howls of a medium length then waiting for several minutes tends to work the best at this time of the year . I have used this for 20 to 40 minutes at a stand depending on what terrain I am in . Whines and whimpers of a female work well during this season used at a lower pitch and volume in close proximity to bedding areas both male and female will respond , who's in my area and in season looking for a mate . Group howls are what I use in late spring to early summer to locate the dens as they will all answer to them . After early June they will answer but then scatter like a covey of quail after they answer group howls . group howls sometimes work in late summer and the fall of the year when you have young pups out hunting and messing around on their own and they start missing the parents and siblings . In the mid winter during the day say noon to maybe 3 in the afternoon I will use a male tone and give two short howls and two quick barks wait a few minutes and do it again like the patriarch looking to get the group together for a hunting trip . The same call in the late spring but with a female tone or a high pitched puppy tone , is used to get the pups and older coyote to answer and come in , hay guys I'm looking to visit with you where are you kind of thing like you saying honey I'M home when you walk in the front door . This is just some of what I have noticed working for me from taking the time to listen to them and being out with the coyote over the years . I don't hate anything or anyone I do have a lot of respect for the coyote and their family skills as they both take an active part in rearing the kids . They have a long list of vocalizations that we can use to our advantage but as a rule we don't need to be able to say much to them for them to respond to us . For the most part they don't talk a lot at any given time and if they do it's for a good reason , you've made me mad , you are in my area ,leave my pups and family alone ,lets get together and visit or go hunting or at the right time of the year hay I'm looking for a mate . I have found for my use less is often best when I'm talking to them and when they are talking to me I duplicate what they say to me just to make them mad and come to kick my butt the same way it gets to you if I keep saying the same thing to you every time you say something thus another reason for having and learning to use a good hand held howler or two , male and female . Puppy sounds for me are what I use in the spring to get the adults that are killing livestock so I keep them in reserve for that reason to kill the ones that are killing and I have to take them out in a hurry . For those of us that just hunt predators in the winter and for fun it's a different ball game but some of these things can be put to use by you as well stop look and listen doesn't just apply to crossing the street good luck and successful hunting for the hunters I hope this has been of interest and useful to someone .
I love the info n thanks alot
You all are welcome , It takes more time then most people have to be able to get out and be with the animals enough to learn very much from them about what they do and say . We have family and work for a living to support our families so then hunting is one of our releases and we like to make the most of that time when we can get out with them .
Thank you so much for all of your stories and useful information. I was so very excited to finally retire so i could spend all of my spare time Shooting and hunting only to find myself with a whole new set of responsabilaties . I really dont have any spare time yet.
Fed-Well
Best freaking advice I was ever given and it takes some time to see it. DO NOT SHOOT IF YOU CANT KILL IT. This is huge if calling and or they know or act suspect you are there. Anyone with any time hunting coyotes instantly can tell if they have been hunted before.
