Christensen Arms 16” 308 load data

I think the largest problem most people think when it comes to guns. Is chasing accuracy. If it's a shooter, it's a shooter. Reloading or different loads will shrink groups but not fix 2" grouping out of the box! Trash the barrel and buy a new one. Again if it shoots it will shoot right out of the box.
CA, Fierce, etc have had major QA issues once they made a public offering to the masses
 
waveslayer said:
I think the largest problem most people think when it comes to guns. Is chasing accuracy. If it's a shooter, it's a shooter. Reloading or different loads will shrink groups but not fix 2" grouping out of the box! Trash the barrel and buy a new one. Again if it shoots it will shoot right out of the box.
CA, Fierce, etc have had major QA issues once they made a public offering to the masses
Click to expand...
I agree.
I picked up a Weatherby 270 at a pawn shop that shot horrible and went to sub-moa after a good JB & Kroil scrub.
Besides that rare case…I've never seen a 2"'er go down to 1/2".
I was only hoping .
 
Not much personal experience loading for .308, though I shoot with a couple of avid .308 loaders. I do however, have experience with carbon barrels. I have several Proof and a couple of Bartleins.

In my experience carbon barrels can be a bit more finicky to load for. This has made me change my reloading practices and testing methodology.

Before conducting any testing, one should check that their action is properly seated in the stock and torqued both to the proper torque and in the proper sequence. Then ensure your scope base/s are properly torqued and Purple thread locker is used, followed by ensuring your scope rings are properly set to the base and aligned. Lastly, that your scopes diopter and eye relief are properly adjusted and the rings and bases are torqued and thread locked.

I've seen at least half a dozen people last month alone at the range struggling because of improper scope mounting and loose components. It has happened to me early on in my journey with rifles purchased at a store with a scope already mounted.


seating depth testing

First, start with a projectile and a middle of the road charge. Ensure the headapace, brass brand, lot, neck length, number of firings are the same. Document the headapace value.

Second, find the cartridge base to ogive measurement for " touch" by removing any plunger style ejector and firing pin from your bolt. Then seat a the intended bullet long and incrementally seat it shorter until the bolt closes and the handle drops freely. Then pull the bullet and reseat 5 thousands longer and check that the handle falls freely. Adjust by 1 thousandth until it does. Document that CBTO. This is the time to check any bullets you want to try and get the read out and document it. I usually run all the different brand and style bullets I have for the caliber just for reference.

Third, cook up a batch of cartridges for seating depth testing. Seat them all at the touch length. I have a Lee Handloader I got at a garage sale that I like to use for this. I seat bullets in a minimum of 20 rds. I try for 30. Set up your seating test target, I buy them off Amazon, they're cheap.

Fourth, Make sure if your barrel is clean, you foul it with several rounds first, it's good to have cheap factory or short headspace or round specifically for fouling. Allow the barrel and suppressor to cool to the touch. Or better yet, use an infrared thermometer and set a temp you will shoot at.

Fifth, shoot 2 shots at touch length, letting the barrel cool between shots. For me at 70ish Fahrenheit thats about 7 minutes. If the bullets aren't touching at the target push them in 6 thou, repeat until you have bullets on target touching. Each shot should be from a natural point of aim and you should exercise all the fundamentals of marksmanship when placing the shots. Also, it is advisable to set your scope off on windage from your aim point. Your groups grow as your aimpoint grows. A crisp, repeatable aimpoint will help, so not shooting out the center and instead, shooting an inch to one side or the other.

Now here is the goal, you want 2 shots touching or on top of each other. If you get that, then you set a 3rd round to that depth and shoot. If you get all 3 in a tight group, verify that group with a second group. If you can't shrink your groups down, find the smallest group and work 3 thousandths to either side.

I have found that on most of my carbon barrels, the seating depth node is narrow. I have several stainless Proof competition contour barrels in various chamberings, the seating depth nodes tend to be 6-8 thousandths wide. At least one is around 12 thousandths. Yet most of the carbons, for whatever reason, are 3-4 thousandths.

After the seating depth test, adjust your powder charge as normal, and if things open up, run the seating depth test a couple thou either longer or shorter and see if it closes up. For the most part the groups stay pretty consistent at the right depth regardless of charge. The main difference being elevation shift.

Having a testing methodology and ensuring you're not adding more input into the testing through poor marksmanship practices is essential. YMMV, but my experience over several Carbon barrels says they can be slightly more finicky than solid steel/stainless. Mind you, I have more than a few of both in Proof Brand. Be unrelentingly methodical and see if things improve.

I didn't write this as an end all be all or the only/best way to do things. This is just what I've adopted that seems to work best for me. The main difference being, for the most part, when finding CBTO for different bullets, I do it using the "plunk" method with the barrel removed whenever possible. I do have a couple of rifles on blueprinted remington 700 actions that I do not have multiple barrels for. While my custom actions have a gob of prefits.
 
Sdvldog1371 said:
Not much personal experience loading for .308, though I shoot with a couple of avid .308 loaders. I do however, have experience with carbon barrels. I have several Proof and a couple of Bartleins.

In my experience carbon barrels can be a bit more finicky to load for. This has made me change my reloading practices and testing methodology.

Before conducting any testing, one should check that their action is properly seated in the stock and torqued both to the proper torque and in the proper sequence. Then ensure your scope base/s are properly torqued and Purple thread locker is used, followed by ensuring your scope rings are properly set to the base and aligned. Lastly, that your scopes diopter and eye relief are properly adjusted and the rings and bases are torqued and thread locked.

I've seen at least half a dozen people last month alone at the range struggling because of improper scope mounting and loose components. It has happened to me early on in my journey with rifles purchased at a store with a scope already mounted.


seating depth testing

First, start with a projectile and a middle of the road charge. Ensure the headapace, brass brand, lot, neck length, number of firings are the same. Document the headapace value.

Second, find the cartridge base to ogive measurement for " touch" by removing any plunger style ejector and firing pin from your bolt. Then seat a the intended bullet long and incrementally seat it shorter until the bolt closes and the handle drops freely. Then pull the bullet and reseat 5 thousands longer and check that the handle falls freely. Adjust by 1 thousandth until it does. Document that CBTO. This is the time to check any bullets you want to try and get the read out and document it. I usually run all the different brand and style bullets I have for the caliber just for reference.

Third, cook up a batch of cartridges for seating depth testing. Seat them all at the touch length. I have a Lee Handloader I got at a garage sale that I like to use for this. I seat bullets in a minimum of 20 rds. I try for 30. Set up your seating test target, I buy them off Amazon, they're cheap.

Fourth, Make sure if your barrel is clean, you foul it with several rounds first, it's good to have cheap factory or short headspace or round specifically for fouling. Allow the barrel and suppressor to cool to the touch. Or better yet, use an infrared thermometer and set a temp you will shoot at.

Fifth, shoot 2 shots at touch length, letting the barrel cool between shots. For me at 70ish Fahrenheit thats about 7 minutes. If the bullets aren't touching at the target push them in 6 thou, repeat until you have bullets on target touching. Each shot should be from a natural point of aim and you should exercise all the fundamentals of marksmanship when placing the shots. Also, it is advisable to set your scope off on windage from your aim point. Your groups grow as your aimpoint grows. A crisp, repeatable aimpoint will help, so not shooting out the center and instead, shooting an inch to one side or the other.

Now here is the goal, you want 2 shots touching or on top of each other. If you get that, then you set a 3rd round to that depth and shoot. If you get all 3 in a tight group, verify that group with a second group. If you can't shrink your groups down, find the smallest group and work 3 thousandths to either side.

I have found that on most of my carbon barrels, the seating depth node is narrow. I have several stainless Proof competition contour barrels in various chamberings, the seating depth nodes tend to be 6-8 thousandths wide. At least one is around 12 thousandths. Yet most of the carbons, for whatever reason, are 3-4 thousandths.

After the seating depth test, adjust your powder charge as normal, and if things open up, run the seating depth test a couple thou either longer or shorter and see if it closes up. For the most part the groups stay pretty consistent at the right depth regardless of charge. The main difference being elevation shift.

Having a testing methodology and ensuring you're not adding more input into the testing through poor marksmanship practices is essential. YMMV, but my experience over several Carbon barrels says they can be slightly more finicky than solid steel/stainless. Mind you, I have more than a few of both in Proof Brand. Be unrelentingly methodical and see if things improve.

I didn't write this as an end all be all or the only/best way to do things. This is just what I've adopted that seems to work best for me. The main difference being, for the most part, when finding CBTO for different bullets, I do it using the "plunk" method with the barrel removed whenever possible. I do have a couple of rifles on blueprinted remington 700 actions that I do not have multiple barrels for. While my custom actions have a gob of prefits.
Click to expand...
Again, a lot of wasted time and money. A barrel is a shooter it's a shooter. If it's not it's not. As for removing firing pin and ejector, more work then necessary. Get a OAL case guage and it does the same thing, send in your once fired. Bass and have it drilled and taped to get a good fitting if you want, i do both and the results are .003" variance.
 
skipglo said:
Explain....lightly used...and do you know who actually Lightly used it....or out of a classified ad? .... probably why a LIGHTLY USED BARREL was for sale would be my guess.
Click to expand...
Came from a gunsmith who claimed the customer hardly shot it and wanted to switch calibers.
But, although we tend to trust a gunsmith, they sometimes dump parts not knowing the true history.
 
waveslayer said:
Again, a lot of wasted time and money. A barrel is a shooter it's a shooter. If it's not it's not. As for removing firing pin and ejector, more work then necessary. Get a OAL case guage and it does the same thing, send in your once fired. Bass and have it drilled and taped to get a good fitting if you want, i do both and the results are .003" variance.
Click to expand...
Agree to disagree, while you cannot fix a bad barrel through reloading, you can certainly squeeze a great deal of performance from a Mediocre barrel someone thinks isn't a shooter.

I've shot many different brands/types and bullet weights through individual rifles that wouldn't group less than 1.5-2" at 100 but were tuned to quarter MOA or less through proper load development. I load 20- 30 rounds for seating depth because I don't want to have to make more trips to the range than necessary, it doesn't mean I shoot 20 or 30 for a test. I've found I can usually fire under 20 and have 2 good starting depths. You're only shooting 2 rounds and moving in if they don't touch.

Once fired brass often isn't fully formed brass, so using 1x brass without first ensuring it is properly formed and of the required headspace is lazy. One of the best methods for finding that proper headspace involves stripping the bolt and sizing until the bolt JUST falls freely. That's not my opinion, that is the method many shooters and reloaders more experienced than I use.

I have an OAL gauge and modified cases, they collect dust. The amount of work you want to put into it is dictated by you, I'm not afraid of putting in extra work to get the most out. I'm not an "Easy Button" person. To me it's all part of the journey and learning and refusing to be married to one practice or another. I use many different methods now than I did when I started, I have removed steps and processes that gained me little to no performance from certain cartridges. Rifles and Barrels, like people, are all slightly different, and every now and then, you run into defective one.
 
Shane Lindsey said:
May even try a flat based bullet like a Pro Hunter/Partition. May seal it up good an provide you something. At the ranges a shorty 308 will give you, bullet type don't matter much.
Click to expand...
YEP,. This ^^^ The 165 grain, NBT's, Horn interLock's or Flat Based, Pro Hunters, HAVE Always, worked WELL, in Our, 1-10 Tw .30-06's with 4895 Powder
Next Time, Skip the 16 inch Barrel,.. go 20 inches, Minimum and Buy, a Shorter Suppressor.
 
Last edited:
Again guys, this is a CA... No disrespect, they are good, if you get one made on a Wednesday! ha ha ha

The experience we have with testing multiple CA rifles are poor results 80% of the time. Change the barrel and you are doing great! Also, this isn't a custom chamber, so who knows how well it's lined up to the barrel
 

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