Checking Headspace Question

[gohring3006]

I would just take it to a smith or THE smith who built it and see what his excuse is.

 

[shortgrass]

I would just take it to a smith or THE smith who built it and see what his excuse is.

Of course mistakes happen, but excessive headspace is one mistake that should never leave a gunsmiths' shop. A person that can not stay within .004" (I'm thinking 1.630" GO to 1.634" NO-GO, FIELD would be 1.640") on chamber depth is NOT a gunsmith. That term/title "gunsmith" gets thrown around quit liberally these days. Just because a person has a lathe and a chamber reamer doesn't make him a "gunsmith". Take it back to where it was made. He should have no problem allowing you to watch as he gauges the headspace on the rifle.

 

[gohring3006]

Of course mistakes happen, but excessive headspace is one mistake that should never leave a gunsmiths' shop. A person that can not stay within .004" (I'm thinking 1.630" GO to 1.634" NO-GO, FIELD would be 1.640") on chamber depth is NOT a gunsmith. That term/title "gunsmith" gets thrown around quit liberally these days. Just because a person has a lathe and a chamber reamer doesn't make him a "gunsmith". Take it back to where it was made. He should have no problem allowing you to watch as he gauges the headspace on the rifle.

Good point, just take it back where it was made.

 

[CadillacCowboy]

Good point, just take it back where it was made.

So, what is the repair for this? Set back and ream? Wouldn't that throw the stock inletting off? How about the lug that isn't pinned? Would that create a bedding issue? Would the baked-on finish be damaged? If the SAAMI Max is Field gauge, which won't "go", would I even have a fair complaint? SAAMI range appears to be .012 over go. The field gauge is only .010. Is that just a safety factor the gauge maker uses? This seems like a lot of trouble to go through when the brass is basically fire formed on the first firing then .002 bump and everything should be good. Still within SAAMI spec, right? (Assuming I have a chamber .002 over no go).

Reason I am ballz deep in this thought process in the first place was factory ammo flattened primers and flow back into fire pin hole.

 

[gohring3006]

So, what is the repair for this? Set back and ream? Wouldn't that throw the stock inletting off? How about the lug that isn't pinned? Would that create a bedding issue? Would the baked-on finish be damaged? If the SAAMI Max is Field gauge, which won't "go", would I even have a fair complaint? SAAMI range appears to be .012 over go. The field gauge is only .010. Is that just a safety factor the gauge maker uses? This seems like a lot of trouble to go through when the brass is basically fire formed on the first firing then .002 bump and everything should be good. Still within SAAMI spec, right? (Assuming I have a chamber .002 over no go).

Reason I am ballz deep in this thought process in the first place was factory ammo flattened primers and flow back into fire pin hole.

With that much headspace, it is not surprising that you would have flat primers on factory ammo. The firing pin slams the case forward then pressure slightly ejects the primer out of the case and then it slams into the bolt face flattening it.

If it was me, and I had a "custom" rifle built, I would want headspace set to a minimum and **** sure would want a no go to not chamber. You are setting up a potential problem with brass stretching. If you ever decide to sell that rifle and someone doesn't know about the excessive headspace, they are going to be on one of these forums asking questions about case separations on a faulty rifle.

As for the bedding, coating and finish. The smith should be more than happy to fix all that if he made a mistake.

 

[J E Custom]

So, what is the repair for this? Set back and ream? Wouldn't that throw the stock inletting off? How about the lug that isn't pinned? Would that create a bedding issue? Would the baked-on finish be damaged? If the SAAMI Max is Field gauge, which won't "go", would I even have a fair complaint? SAAMI range appears to be .012 over go. The field gauge is only .010. Is that just a safety factor the gauge maker uses? This seems like a lot of trouble to go through when the brass is basically fire formed on the first firing then .002 bump and everything should be good. Still within SAAMI spec, right? (Assuming I have a chamber .002 over no go).

Reason I am ballz deep in this thought process in the first place was factory ammo flattened primers and flow back into fire pin hole.

It could change everything if repaired correctly.

The brass is already damaged if there is excessive head space from the first firing. Also if you want to shoot factory ammo the problem will still exist. fire forming would work for one or two firings but failure would come early (Probably case head separation).

We would all like to be able to solve your problem, but with excessive head space there is only one cure, A barrel set back and re chamber + all the things that go with it.

As one of the members says, "You cant make a silk purse out of a sows ear" have it fixed and enjoy shooting.

J E CUSTOM

 

[bigngreen]

Where there any other pressure signs like heavy bolt lift or ejector mark?

 

[CadillacCowboy]

Where there any other pressure signs like heavy bolt lift or ejector mark?

Not at all.

 

[bigngreen]

Adjust your dies and go on with life, your brass if fine, the primers are flat which happens with a little jump and we see it all the time for various reasons but the cratering is likely from a larger firing pin and would be solved with having the firing pin bushed which is common enough guys make a living doing it.
Firing out a case a few thou will do nothing bad as long as you adjust your dies to push the shoulder back correctly.
If it bugs you just talk to the smith, setting it back .002 which it sounds would put it under the no go is nothing and would not need hardly any work to do not requiring any major set back or rechamber or anything of consequence. Who knows why it's a little long, there could be a little spot somewhere that he didn't see that gave him just a touch tighter feel, he may have a little longer gauge which I have seen between manufactures, call the smith and talk to him before listening to the sky is falling scenarios or load it and see how it measures up and rock on!

 

[Longrang3r]

Jesus, Bigngreen nailed it on the absolute freaking head. Why anyone would waste time on here instead of going to a gunsmith is beyond me. Stop wasting your time asking what anyone online would do, and go talk to your smith. It's really that simple.

 

[FURMAN]

bigngreen nailed it. I would not waste any time with a smith. Shoot is as is. Set your dies up for a .002 bump and be happy.

 

[Bullet bumper]

I agree with J E Custom and gohring3006 . It's not fine and dandy to just shoot it it as is , it needs to be checked properly . Case life will be shortened if there is an initial excessive stretch . Accuracy also at least on first firing . It does not sound like a precision chamber job so take it back .

 

[CadillacCowboy]

Well, I had some brand new gauges and tools rush shipped and was able to properly check headspace. It is exactly as my initial test revealed. Close on a no go, no close on a no go plus scotch tape (calipers read .002" longer with tape). Obviously no close on a field, but I bought one and tried it for fun. Builder says it's not a big deal. Build sheet says "match chamber" and cut to "benchrest tolerances". Now I can't get the roll pin back in for the ejector. Not gonna beat it to death, so I stopped. Any suggestion on how to get it in? I have the Sinclair ejector tool a 1/16 punch and the bench block. The ejector slot was situated correctly. Not gonna take it to the same guy who messed it up the first time - he and I aren't seeing eye to eye right now. Other gunsmith options around here are non-existent, so I need to get the pin in myself and go on with life.

Thanks.

 

[bigngreen]

If you set back the barrel .002 what will it change?