Caliber size or Velocity and Energy?

[FEENIX]

HmmmView attachment 437934 what's wrong with this picture? I have been using this range card. Elevation should not make that big a difference ...if so the other direction.

"IF" you believe elevation should not make that big of a difference, then go with that mindset.

 

[laker]

HmmmView attachment 437934 what's wrong with this picture? I have been using this range card. Elevation should not make that big a difference ...if so the other direction.

I think he put the 156 Berger g7 number in as g1

 

[laker]

Here's the 156 grain with the g7

 

[dogz]

I have been told that my 6.5 PRC is too light for elk and I am sure many of you on here will agree. But I when I look at the ballistics, my 156gr Berger with H1000 have more energy and velocity after 400yds than my buddy's 300wm with 180gr ABs. which is an acceptable elk cartridge. Since hunting bullets are made to expand why is initial bullet size important?

Anyone who tells you that the 6.5 PRC is too light for elk is either incredibly inexperienced at killing elk and or has never shot an elk with said round before.

Freaking nutjobs!

As for energy smenergy...........you need a bullet and speed to tear up the lung tissue and viola dead elk!

 

[FEENIX]

I think he put the 156 Berger g7 number in as g1

.347 is G7, and when you select 156 it automatically takes you to G7.

 

[memtb]

I have been told that my 6.5 PRC is too light for elk and I am sure many of you on here will agree. But I when I look at the ballistics, my 156gr Berger with H1000 have more energy and velocity after 400yds than my buddy's 300wm with 180gr ABs. which is an acceptable elk cartridge. Since hunting bullets are made to expand why is initial bullet size important?

Personally, I believe that ft/lbs energy is way overrated …..especially in larger big game. Yes, with violently expanding, placed broadside into the lungs, or a properly placed head or neck shot can have impressive results. I have seen large big game animals hit with 4K + ft/lbs energy (at impact), bullet placed into the lungs with a broadside hit….yet the animal shows zero visible evidence of being hit! Other times, very noticeable response with the same hit. Perhaps it depends upon the state of the heart beat at the exact moment of impact!

Therefore, in my opinion……bullet diameter, bullet weight, bullet design, and bullet velocity combined, improve the kill factor (my term) for/on large big game!

Does bigger, faster, harder (integrity), heavier guarantee success …..NO! But those things combined certainly do not hurt…..well, except the animal you've just hit with that combination!

Oh, one things that many folks can't seem to fathom…..all shots are not perfectly placed, due to factors beyond the shooter's control at sear break! If the shot must be taken at an extreme angle intensionally, or inadvertently…..the larger, heavier, better constructed, higher velocity bullet offers greater positives than negatives! memtb

 

[FEENIX]

Here's the 156 grain with the g7 View attachment 437958

Change your zero to 200Y and see what you get.

 

[laker]

Change your zero to 200Y and see what you get.

I was just looking at your energy and velocity numbers being way off

 

[laker]

Change your zero to 200Y and see what you get.

Here's what numbers look like with g7 number as the g1. Identical to your first table

 

[FEENIX]

Here's what numbers look like with g7 number as the g1. Identical to your first table
View attachment 437984

It is not, your zero range is at 100Y and mine is 200Y.

 

[laker]

It is not, your zero range is at 100Y and mine is 200Y.

Again I'm just looking at energy and velocity. You have the g7 156 Berger in as a g1

 

[laker]

It is not, your zero range is at 100Y and mine is 200Y.

Here's 200 zero with the g7 in as a g1

 

[bomberodevil]

I have been told that my 6.5 PRC is too light for elk and I am sure many of you on here will agree. But I when I look at the ballistics, my 156gr Berger with H1000 have more energy and velocity after 400yds than my buddy's 300wm with 180gr ABs. which is an acceptable elk cartridge. Since hunting bullets are made to expand why is initial bullet size important?

Many of the folks on here are really experienced and smart regarding terminal performance, a lot more so than me. But… here's my thoughts.

There's many other that believe kinetic energy is a good indicator for sizing up the combination of bullet size, bullet speed and distance to limit the shot. Some folks will use a rough estimate of a minimum KE of 1500 ft/lbs for elk, and 1000 ft/lbs for deer. If you're a hunter that follows this guideline, then energy is critical to your selection of loads for a specific animal.

SAAMI (and many others) calculate energy by using only two factors, bullet mass and velocity. So if you consider energy to be a factor, mass and speed are important.

KINETIC ENERGY (FORMULA) - SAAMI

Based on the general equation for kinetic energy, Ek=½mv2, which directly uses mass (m) and velocity (v), the following formula is used to calculate the kinetic energy of a projectile (expressed in foot-pounds): E=(W*V2)/(14000*gc). In this formula, W = weight of projectile, in grains; V =...

saami.org

 

[Muddyboots]

Actually (apples to oranges) my handloaded 156 Bergers : mv 2920 ft/sec and 2954 ft/lbs @ 500yds 2271 ft/sec and 1787 ft/lbs compared to factory 300wm accubond trophy grade: mv 2950 ft/sec and 3477 ft/lbs @ 500yds 2089 ft/sec and1745 ft/lbs The 6.5 PRC has better ballistics, in this case beyond 475 yds.

To be "apples to apples" both hand loaded, using standard published Alliant RL26 data with 180 Partition is 3130 but the 180AB is 3150 at muzzle in my Sendero 300WM which is substantial difference to a factory box of ammo. Run numbers with a handload for 300WM.