Berger bullet performance

[dkhunt14]

What would happen if you put a trained sniper behind your heavy gun?

They would probably win. Quantico has at least 2 thousand yard ranges. They have multiple gunsmiths. There snipers use all custom stuff and they are always shooting. I have been to Quantico and shot there range and shot with the snipers. They shake there heads when they see the groups the benchrest guys shoot. This is also In the 17 pound class almost identical to their Heavy barreled remingtons. The Quantico range 4 was probably the nicest range I ever shot on and I shot at every range East of the Mississsippi and 2 on the other side. A couple of years ago they decided civilians couldn't come on the range and shoot anymore. Matt

 

[MudRunner2005]

Yes I agree with you Mudrunner and bullet selection is important. I haven't seen where you couldn't get a pass through on deer. I believe there are other factors involved including shot replacement. I don't believe a gut shot deer would not have a pass through. I could see a bear or elk if you hit shoulder. I know none of what I heard matches what I see. My 338 shoots through 3/4 steel at 1000 yards. The guy where I go shoot has targets and steel to 1000 and he wont let any 338 shoot steel. I think he doesn't allow the 30 to shoot at 600 either. He says the steel costs too much to shoot through and make the big dents in. We all shoot Bergers in hunting and competition. Matt

If he owns a range that alot of people pay good money to use, then the steel is not as expensive as one would think. We have owned a steel fabrication business for over 20 years. If he buys his steel directly from a mill and in large sheets, then cuts it himself with a plasma cutter (or has someone cut it for him to spec), then it would be alot cheaper than buying plates from companies that already produce the pre-cut plates.

Also, to add structural rigidity to help eliminate pass-throughs, try welding 2 individual pieces of ½" plate together all the way around the edges. The 2 individual pieces will not allow for as much penetration because with 2 individual plates, the shock will be absorbed and distributed between the 2.

 

[Mxracer532]

Yes I agree with you Mudrunner and bullet selection is important. I haven't seen where you couldn't get a pass through on deer. I believe there are other factors involved including shot replacement. I don't believe a gut shot deer would not have a pass through. I could see a bear or elk if you hit shoulder. I know none of what I heard matches what I see. My 338 shoots through 3/4 steel at 1000 yards. The guy where I go shoot has targets and steel to 1000 and he wont let any 338 shoot steel. I think he doesn't allow the 30 to shoot at 600 either. He says the steel costs too much to shoot through and make the big dents in. We all shoot Bergers in hunting and competition. Matt

Matt I agree, a 338 at less than 200 yards WOULD pass through. But in my sisters instance were not talking a 338. Were talking about a .243 with a 95gn VLD at 3136fps. They GRENADE on (some) of those close shots at that speed.

 

[dkhunt14]

Its a private range where a few of us test at and they practice for long range hunting. Its nothing for money. I have shot a lot of 243, 6 Dasher and 6MM REM. I hunted deer with 85 Grain HPBT and very seldom does a bullet stay in a deer. I have shot through two standing side by side and my cousin shot one on the brisket and it exited out the rear. I have shot 1000 yard BR with 30 inch barrels and 3143 feet per second out of a 243 is Too fast. I would have to see the Chrono to believe it. Anything slower then 4350 isn't good in a 243 and even with the slow powders and 30 inch barrels it would be tough to make. Matt

 

[Canadian Bushman]

They would probably win. Quantico has at least 2 thousand yard ranges. They have multiple gunsmiths. There snipers use all custom stuff and they are always shooting. I have been to Quantico and shot there range and shot with the snipers. They shake there heads when they see the groups the benchrest guys shoot. This is also In the 17 pound class almost identical to their Heavy barreled remingtons. The Quantico range 4 was probably the nicest range I ever shot on and I shot at every range East of the Mississsippi and 2 on the other side. A couple of years ago they decided civilians couldn't come on the range and shoot anymore. Matt

Im not trying to rob validity from your statement. I just dont agree with the way some of us view our country's marksmen.
Some think that because the are professionally instructed they are the best there are, and some feel they should be the best there are.

These guys are trained to do a job in wartime and shooting is part of that job.
Im not in the military but i dont think hunting bears and shooting world record groups are part of their job requirements.
They are still humans, some are probably remarkable marksmen and some maybe not so much. Just because they are military doesnt mean we can lump them all into this elite group of riflemen who are masters in every discipline.

 

[Korhil78]

Im not trying to rob validity from your statement. I just dont agree with the way some of us view our country's marksmen.
Some think that because the are professionally instructed they are the best there are, and some feel they should be the best there are.

These guys are trained to do a job in wartime and shooting is part of that job.
Im not in the military but i dont think hunting bears and shooting world record groups are part of their job requirements.
They are still humans, some are probably remarkable marksmen and some maybe not so much. Just because they are military doesnt mean we can lump them all into this elite group of riflemen who are masters in every discipline.

It's a totally different beast than hunting. You can't even compare the two really even though it's people hunting people. It changes everything when you can be shot back at.

 

[adam32]

It's a totally different beast than hunting. You can't even compare the two really even though it's people hunting people. It changes everything when you can be shot back at.

Nobody is shooting back at a private range...if they can't hit the target in calm conditions then how are they going to hit something that's shooting back?

As far as the Bergers, it really does sound like a yellow box vs orange box issue. Maybe Berger dumped the bullets in the wrong boxes...

 

[Korhil78]

Nobody is shooting back at a private range...if they can't hit the target in calm conditions then how are they going to hit something that's shooting back?

As far as the Bergers, it really does sound like a yellow box vs orange box issue. Maybe Berger dumped the bullets in the wrong boxes...

Who said that they couldn't make a hit? This is getting off topic so I won't say anymore.

 

[NONYA]

My buddy shot a small bull Tues.,210 gr bergers,they both came apart,300 yards,hes switching to Barnes TSX.

 

[adam32]

My buddy shot a small bull Tues.,210 gr bergers,they both came apart,300 yards,hes switching to Barnes TSX.

Define "came apart"...

Did the bull die quickly?

Where was the bullet placement?

 

[Jluck]

My buddy shot a small bull Tues.,210 gr bergers,they both came apart,300 yards,hes switching to Barnes TSX.

That's what they are designed to do. Barnes is a great idea if you want bullet retention.

 

[NONYA]

They are designed to fragment and not exit at 300 yards out of an ultra mag?no thanx And no it didn't die quickly,required a total of 3 rounds.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Sounds like ****-poor shot placement to me...

And if it went down, you should have jumped up and put one in it's head to be humane instead of letting it suffer.

 

[johnhhernan]

I have shot at least 3 bull elk, 2 cows, 3-4 blacktail deer all have not ran more than 15 feet.

I have shot nothing but bergers for all of them.

I used to use, before I got into reloading, remington core-lokt, cheap-cheap-cheap same result they didn't run 15 feet.

I'm with mudrunner=poor shot placement.

I think some of these people get so excited they forget the fundamentals of shooting a rifle:

BRASS
B=BREATH
R=RELAX
A=AIM
S=STOP
S=SQUEEZE THE TRIGGER.