Are We More Temp Sensitive Than Powders?

[birddog 68]

I try to do my load work when it's warm out that way I know it's safe at normal hunting temperature. Most of my wt deer hunting shot's are under 300 yards and just don't see a reason to change powder if I'm only losing 50-75 fps when it's cold. If it ain't broke don't fix it!

 

[Beluebow]

Temp stability should be a consideration if you plan to travel to hunt/shoot longrange. Traveling from one extreme to another matters.

If you stick around close to home and develop loads that are ballpark to the temps you plan on hunting/shooting in that works out great also.

Blanket statements are like temp sensitive powders, neither covers all situations.

 

[lancetkenyon]

I hunt in AZ and NM. Temps can range from 4 to 115+ easily throughout the year. You need a stable powder in a rifle that can see hunting in all 4 seasons here. Over 85 can be seen from early March to late November in AZ depending on what unit you are hunting in. And pretty much statewide from May to October. So yeah, a temperature stable powder is pretty much a requirement. Which is why I do not use RL26 in anything that is not strictly a late season high country rifle.

And no, I still won't sell you my 13+ pounds of RL26.....

 

[coop2564]

Risk what? I do not conduct my load development in the summertime and expect it to perform the same in fall. I finalize my load in Sep for a Oct/Nov hunt. I was told RL17 is temp sensitive. I have been using it for a few years now with very good success in MT weather.

Even MT weather can get warm early season. Or you might suddenly get invited to TX for a whitetail hunt. Things come up. Using a component that YOU KNOW has limits when YOU CAN use components that are less limited and WILL HELP YOU be more accurate, is a risk!

 

[FEENIX]

Even MT weather can get warm early season. Or you might suddenly get invited to TX for a whitetail hunt. Things come up. Using a component that YOU KNOW has limits when YOU CAN use components that are less limited and WILL HELP YOU be more accurate, is a risk!

Yes, I know the Iimitation of the powders I use for my hunting situation/environment. I load for the environment that I hunt, just like when I lived and hunted AZ, NM, CA, and SC.

 

[LVJ76]

Over 85 can be seen from early March to late November in AZ depending on what unit you are hunting in. And pretty much statewide from May to October. So yeah, a temperature stable powder is pretty much a requirement.

I'd say from February to November, you might remember the 2016 February Javelina Hunt, it was 90° on Saturday just south of Tucson. I remember my brother and I just melting out there.


Before temp stable powders were available we just knew how to use the older powders, like IMR-4350, which is still used by many. I've mentioned a couple of times before how the heat affects the POI in this powder which I used for many years in temps above 100°. These loads were developed in high temps. Now the POI change wasn't only over 85°, if I sighted in at 8 am at say 55°, in the afternoon at 75° there was still a POI change.

Now the reason you develop these loads in the summer is so you don't have pressure issues later on, but it will still have an effect on POI.

Now I am using for IMR-4451 and don't have to worry about changes in pressure or POI.

 

[Muddyboots]

And no, I still won't sell you my 13+ pounds of RL26

Awwwww gee whiz, you're no fun!

 

[Earnhardt]

Maybe minute-of-pie-plate hunters popping does under a feeder that have been using the same 5 boxes of Core-Lokts they bought at K-Mart in 1994 can get away with that, but knowing temp stability of a powder to avoid checking zero is not a serious argument.


I agree, if 200 more FPS is just non-negotiable and absolutely critical to a shot, then step up the case to get it instead of pushing something outside it's envelope. Why overpressure the heck out of a 300 WM when there are a half dozen 30 cal options that could hit that speed without pushing the case past the point of sanity.

Seems like the more casual side of this sport is stuck in the "faster is better" magnum mentality. Putting something smaller and slower through the boiler room is always better than missing, no matter how fast the bullet you missed with was going.

??? I think you read my statement wrong...

I always check to temp instability and velocity at all temp ranges....

I do not, or ever will hunt in Texas...when it's t-shirt weather...and your spiders are too big for my liking

So therefore, I always have to check load velocities at various temps

With max temp ranges of 140*F, throughout the year up here, we are forced to do that

 

[Earnhardt]

Risk what? I do not conduct my load development in the summertime and expect it to perform the same in fall. I finalize my load in Sep for a Oct/Nov hunt. I was told RL17 is temp sensitive. I have been using it for a few years now with very good success in MT weather.

For anyone going on a hog hunt...Set up a chronograph and try loading up some RL-17 loads for light bullets in a 6.5CM AR...please report back with your findings.

Or how about IMR 3031 in a 6.5 Grendel, please let us know how that goes.

We are only talking about hot chambers on this example, not ambient air temp

Velocity numbers don't lie...what are they?

 

[cjuve]

When you you can have temp swings over 40 degrees in one day it's best to stay with the powders that are most stable. I quit using all but those which are known performers unless it's blasting ammo. I would rather be hunting than screwing around with load development all the time.
It also helps to find the most forgiving powder charge range so that a few FPS one way or another really does not change anything.

 

[FEENIX]

For anyone going on a hog hunt...Set up a chronograph and try loading up some RL-17 loads for light bullets in a 6.5CM AR...please report back with your findings.

Or how about IMR 3031 in a 6.5 Grendel, please let us know how that goes.

We are only talking about hot chambers on this example, not ambient air temp

Velocity numbers don't lie...what are they?

Use the right powder for your intended purpose/application.

 

[QuietTexan]

??? I think you read my statement wrong...

I always check to temp instability and velocity at all temp ranges....

Fair enough, I'll admit I thought y said uou sight in hot and shoot cold, that's just asking for a bad time all around. All good

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

Outside of the obvious availability issues, why shoot temp sensitive powders in this era? The hodgdon extreme line as well as many recently introduced viht powders seem to be very stable across large swings in temperature.

An issue more prevalent than running poor powders, improperly bedded action/stock interfaces. As a typical fall day can produce a 60° air temp swing from morning to afternoon... peoples rifles tend not to be correctly constructed to allow consistent POI across such a swing.


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The only H smokeless powders I actually use are h4350 and h50bmg, and they are spendy and rare lately. I have h4895 and Retumbo also, but those rarely get burned. I'm not sure I even have a retumbo load at present for any of my rifles. I tend to do my load development in both hot and cold weather before I call the load good, and I don't usually push hard enough that a couple % extra pressure makes a difference. I'm much more fond of rl powder, but they have also gotten rare lately.
The last powder order I made (last month) was actually for a few kegs of mil-surp powder. I've got a few rifles that can easily use the wc872 I bought (basically us869, aa8700) but I've never worked with I 7383 powder. It seems to not like being pushed, so it'll prolly be a paper punching powder in my 30-06 and I'll pull down the few # of I 4350 I have loaded for it and use it in my kid's 6.5 creed. I'm not really interested in $50 a # powder or $100/ brick primers.

 

[Csbc4fun]

All I read constantly is how temp sensitive certain powders are and stay away! So for a gazillion years we shot knowing that and shot fine for majority of HUNTING of big game. Temp sensitivity I have read, seems to kick in around 85 for most powders which is way above temps I hunt at in the fall. If you know you are going to hunt above temps that can affect the powder you are using, don't use it! If you are reloading, you need to be aware of all powders characteristics whether burn rate or temp range.

So those who are truly concerned over this, I will take ALL of your RL26 off your hands to protect you!! Just in case you have ANY RL26 that is.

My PSA for the day.

Muddy,
I totally agree and thank you for being so caring as to offer to take that nasty RL26. Federal 210M primers are also temp sensitive and I will dispose of them for any other temp sensitive individuals out there!