Are high powered scopes really necessary for hunting?

[Ga6570]

I use 4-16 on most of my rifles. 3-12 on some. Hunting in MT I often get longer shots and I like the magnification. But when still hunting it is dialed back to 3or 4. Depends on the situation.

 

[ar10ar15man]

actually if you look at the MODERN SNIPERS they have gone to HIGH powered scopes.
over 10 years ago when the navy SEALS went to the accuracy intl 300 win mag they also did their first jump into variable high powered scopes. nightfroce 5.5-22x.
the army just followed the seals lead, have gone to the navy mk13 300 win mag sniper rifle with a top of the line nightforce . i cannot get confirmation, it is either the 7-35 or the 5-25 both on 34mm tubes. 100 /120 moa built in.
better rifles
netter ammo
better scopes
AIM SMALL MISS SMALL
"need" is a hard thing to define, but having the best often makes the job easier.
i have 2 15-55x's on comp rifles, 12-42x on one, 5.5-22x on my mk 13 clone,
a 7-35x is going on my current build, a 338 edge for 2000 yd comp.
i shoot VINTAGE sniper matches that require 4x......vintage...not modern.

The highest power scope I own is an ATACR 4-16x 44mm on my .300win, but for 44 years I carried a rem. 700 in .270 caliber. My only optic during that 44 year time frame was a 4x Leatherwood ARTII, also 44mm, or maybe 42mm-don't recall offhand. In that time frame I've taken truckloads of deer and elk, but I never had any trouble being able to see to shoot and kill what I was hunting in any light condition. The optics are so good on that scope that I've never needed or wanted more power, or bigger objective. My question to those of you with the big 56-60mm objectives, at say 6-25X or more is why do you think you need that much power? Ok, a little background, I worked at a facility for years as an Optical Parts Inspector. We made optics for all branches of the US military, and I carried the appropriate D.O.D. clearance to do this work. My job was to measure all properties associated with any optic, including prisms and infrared/other optics, and coating chart analysis, and to insure it met the required specs. Later, I moved into an area where I was involved with final/non-destructive test of laser range and FLIR systems. My point is that I know a little bit about optics, but the question was actually spawned by the fact that of all of the world's leading military snipers, I can find no higher power used than 15-16x, in calibers up to and including 50 cal. Granted, special teams may have higher power scopes, but am saying this is apparently the general rule, with most countries at 10x or under.
I will add that what the world's military snipers use had no bearing on my latest 3-15x44 purchase, however. I bought it because it's all I believe I need. Anyways, I have no desire to change anyone's mind, and you won't change mine either. Just curious what you scope you guys hunt with and why? This question is directed at long range and ELR hunting applications, not paper punching-thanks in advance for your thoughts.

 

[JemezDave]

Since this is a Long Range Hunting forum, Often, I am surprised by post from hunters who never hunt/shoot long range.

During those 44 yrs with only a 4x scope, what would you say your longest shoot on game was? Deer, coyote etc?

Going from a 4 to 15/16x is a substantial leap in mag (4x) so you are already in the high power range. However, I understand your question about 24/25x scope potential. I have shot many 1,000 yd targets with a 10x and even a 3x9 set on 9x, but why when I can turn the ring and make a more precise shot with a 16 or 24x in good glass?

After all, here we practice "long range" shooting, and for many of us, that "starts" past the half-mile mark.

Your latest scope magnification will serve you far better than 4x, but only if the ranges and game size require it. P-dogs at 400 strain single digit scopes. Enjoy

The .270 with the 4x I would cap at 600 yards for deer/antelope. Longest elk was 440 yards. Now if I had 1/8 twist barrel and was shooting 170gr Berger hybrids I would not be so limited.

 

[lancetkenyon]

actually if you look at the MODERN SNIPERS they have gone to HIGH powered scopes.
over 10 years ago when the navy SEALS went to the accuracy intl 300 win mag they also did their first jump into variable high powered scopes. nightfroce 5.5-22x.
the army just followed the seals lead, have gone to the navy mk13 300 win mag sniper rifle with a top of the line nightforce . i cannot get confirmation, it is either the 7-35 or the 5-25 both on 34mm tubes. 100 /120 moa built in.
better rifles
netter ammo
better scopes
AIM SMALL MISS SMALL
"need" is a hard thing to define, but having the best often makes the job easier.
i have 2 15-55x's on comp rifles, 12-42x on one, 5.5-22x on my mk 13 clone,
a 7-35x is going on my current build, a 338 edge for 2000 yd comp.
i shoot VINTAGE sniper matches that require 4x......vintage...not modern.

Apples to watermelon comparison.

 

[Rich Coyle]

Apples to watermelon comparison.

Why?

 

[Idaho Lefty]

Apples to watermelon comparison.

Agree with Lance,..
Because an Elk is more than, 4 Times, bigger than,.. an enemy combatant, whose trying to HIDE from, a Sniper! A little "common sense" needed, guys. IMO,.. 9X to 16 X "top end" Power, is ALL that's, "necessary" for any reasonable, distance on Big Game ! Who cares, if you wound an "enemy combatant" so shoot them, as FAR, as you can ?? But we should care about wounding, our Big Game animals!
The OP's post, pretty much sums up the answer, to his own question as,.. 16X "top end" Power,.. is more than enough for Big Game.

 

[lancetkenyon]

Military snipers usually range from 400 to 1000+ yards, in ambush, waiting for an enemy. Rarely using their service rifle for close shots on moving targets. FOV is not usually an issue, as they have spotters calling their shots.

Unless you are shooting 500-1000 yard prairie dogs over a town, there is absolutely no need for a 10-50×56 scope on a rifle for hunting. Even of you are shooting a .338 LM Imp @ 1500+ on an elk or deer, you don't need that.

 

[Rich Coyle]

Military snipers usually range from 400 to 1000+ yards, in ambush, waiting for an enemy. Rarely using their service rifle for close shots on moving targets. FOV is not usually an issue, as they have spotters calling their shots.

Unless you are shooting 500-1000 yard prairie dogs over a town, there is absolutely no need for a 10-50×56 scope on a rifle for hunting. Even of you are shooting a .338 LM Imp @ 1500+ on an elk or deer, you don't need that.

This whole conversation is silly. We don't need most of what we use. We don't need to hunt, much less long range hunt. Like one poster posted about 450-500 HP pickup. It sure is nice to have more when you want it. As for me, I need what I want; and use the full magnification range of the scope.

 

[shaughn]

Wow from lag posting to double post...Must be the cold

 

[shaughn]

Try this again...sigh!

I don't have an issue with what optics you choose to use...but I sort of wonder what issues some have with the fact that I or another may mount a truly large optic on a rifle...they aren't hunting where I am...don't subscribe to my level of perfectionism, my personal requirement to be able to precisely pick that spot on an animal or target that I want the bullet to go...they won't be carrying the rifle or shooting it or paying for the optic ...Good enough is in my opinion not!

Good enough is such a catch all....Like I said in an earlier post I can make a quality 10x42 scope work to 1100 yards and would be quite comfortable doing so...but why should/would I? when I can acquire or already have a 5-25 x50/56 or a 10-50 x 60 that will cover me from kissing distance to so far away I need to put a stamp on the bullet...we can extend the why do we need ...30 mm versus 1 inch or 34 mm tube.. tactical finger adjustable turret with 100 MOA of available adjustments or slanted scope rails....it goes on and on and it is applying an arbitrary level based on what "WE" think should be the upper level...instead of thinking about what "could" be the upper level and if it will work for us or not.

If you have the ability/capability you will use it if you need it....

 

[WildRose]

Agree with Lance,..
Because an Elk is more than, 4 Times, bigger than,.. an enemy combatant, whose trying to HIDE from, a Sniper! A little "common sense" needed, guys. IMO,.. 9X to 16 X "top end" Power, is ALL that's, "necessary" for any reasonable, distance on Big Game ! Who cares, if you wound an "enemy combatant" so shoot them, as FAR, as you can ?? But we should care about wounding, our Big Game animals!
The OP's post, pretty much sums up the answer, to his own question as,.. 16X "top end" Power,.. is more than enough for Big Game.

Exactly. Trying to find and then hit an object the size of a kid's bowling ball at long range is much more akin to prairie dog hunting than it is deer or elk hunting.

Most of a sniper's work is just in trying to find targets and that might be no more than a pair of eyeballs in a bush, a person from the shoulders up, or even just an exposed hand at 600-1000yds.

 

[del2les]

Try this again...sigh!

I don't have an issue with what optics you choose to use...but I sort of wonder what issues some have with the fact that I or another may mount a truly large optic on a rifle...they aren't hunting where I am...don't subscribe to my level of perfectionism, my personal requirement to be able to precisely pick that spot on an animal or target that I want the bullet to go...they won't be carrying the rifle or shooting it or paying for the optic ...Good enough is in my opinion not!

Good enough is such a catch all....Like I said in an earlier post I can make a quality 10x42 scope work to 1100 yards and would be quite comfortable doing so...but why should/would I? when I can acquire or already have a 5-25 x50/56 or a 10-50 x 60 that will cover me from kissing distance to so far away I need to put a stamp on the bullet...we can extend the why do we need ...30 mm versus 1 inch or 34 mm tube.. tactical finger adjustable turret with 100 MOA of available adjustments or slanted scope rails....it goes on and on and it is applying an arbitrary level based on what "WE" think should be the upper level...instead of thinking about what "could" be the upper level and if it will work for us or not.

If you have the ability/capability you will use it if you need it....

Yes. I have 2 10-40x atop a multi-purpose varmint/game/gong rifle in 260AI and 22/250 AI and a boat load of 4.5-14, 4-16, 6-24's/5-25's and one 8-32x there is a place for all of them.

It's not a hobby. It's an obsession for precision and a drive to achieve what was once unthinkable to most. Not to mention as I get older, these darn Western distances make it harder to chase down cross canyon/country game.

Can't wait for those laser or pulse rifles with flat trajectory and multi-mile ranges, but when they hit the market, I have a 40-200x telescope ready to mount on one. And a truck bed for the tripod

 

[memtb]

Yes. I have 2 10-40x atop a multi-purpose varmint/game/gong rifle in 260AI and 22/250 AI and a boat load of 4.5-14, 4-16, 6-24's/5-25's and one 8-32x there is a place for all of them.

It's not a hobby. It's an obsession for precision and a drive to achieve what was once unthinkable to most. Not to mention as I get older, these darn Western distances make it harder to chase down cross canyon/country game.

Can't wait for those laser or pulse rifles with flat trajectory and multi-mile ranges, but when they hit the market, I have a 40-200x telescope ready to mount on one. And a truck bed for the tripod

Don't forget the "outriggers" on the truck for stability! memtb

 

[del2les]

Don't forget the "outriggers" on the truck for stability! memtb

Been eying my neighbors backhoe and how to mount the hydraulic to my Ford