IAHNTR
Well-Known Member
I also had Ryan at Piercision Rifles install a muscle brake on my 7 RM and love it. I have shot multiple times in a T shirt with and without the brake and I can honest say I love it.
Adding a brake
- Thread starter Blacktail
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Bud Lite,
I think I would shy away from welding as stainless likes to warp and if you are running just a couple of thousandths of clearance, you may render you gun a bomb. as a matter of fact, I don't know that I would even plug the holes. you could have swirling gas that may change the upper and lower pressures. I'd probably have another brake made if you didn't want the holes.
My $0.02 is this. there is a lot of marketing in muzzle breaks. my 300WM is now ported. let me tell you how I did it.
I threaded my barrel to 9//16x28 (cause that was the tap I had at the time)
I bought an aluminum .22LR muzzle break from Cabelas for $30. I bored it and tapped it to 9/16x28. then I reamed the muzzle to .350".
HOLY COW! what a difference it made. my groups are smaller and it kicks like a .243!
I suppose if you take really really picky scientific date, there may be some magic hole pattern or angle, but I think they just help to sell the breaks.
I think I would shy away from welding as stainless likes to warp and if you are running just a couple of thousandths of clearance, you may render you gun a bomb. as a matter of fact, I don't know that I would even plug the holes. you could have swirling gas that may change the upper and lower pressures. I'd probably have another brake made if you didn't want the holes.
My $0.02 is this. there is a lot of marketing in muzzle breaks. my 300WM is now ported. let me tell you how I did it.
I threaded my barrel to 9//16x28 (cause that was the tap I had at the time)
I bought an aluminum .22LR muzzle break from Cabelas for $30. I bored it and tapped it to 9/16x28. then I reamed the muzzle to .350".
HOLY COW! what a difference it made. my groups are smaller and it kicks like a .243!
I suppose if you take really really picky scientific date, there may be some magic hole pattern or angle, but I think they just help to sell the breaks.
JE CUSTOM - Thank you for sharing your knowledge here. This is the best way to educate all of us who have not done the extensive impartial testing like you have. Your videos are great.
I quoted the point that you make above because this is the exact reason why I finally ended up going to a brake... all guns are going to do hearing damage regardless of whether or not it has a brake.
I always hear guys complain about how brakes are too noisy and will do hearing damage, and they think that a non-braked gun is somehow quiet... We should all wear hearing protection, even when hunting, to avoid hearing damage, so why not have a brake installed?
J E Custom
Well-Known Member
Bud Lite,
I think I would shy away from welding as stainless likes to warp and if you are running just a couple of thousandths of clearance, you may render you gun a bomb. as a matter of fact, I don't know that I would even plug the holes. you could have swirling gas that may change the upper and lower pressures. I'd probably have another brake made if you didn't want the holes.
Replacing the brake is probably the best thing to do unless you are an accomplished welder, then the only thing you would/should worry about is the brake material. (Some brakes are made of free machining steels that are designed to be welded on)
My $0.02 is this. there is a lot of marketing in muzzle breaks. my 300WM is now ported. let me tell you how I did it.
There is a lot of truth in what you say, But there are some brakes that are well thought out and are worth the money because they out perform the not so well designed ones by a large margin.
I threaded my barrel to 9//16x28 (cause that was the tap I had at the time)
I bought an aluminum .22LR muzzle break from Cabelas for $30. I bored it and tapped it to 9/16x28. then I reamed the muzzle to .350".
I am a do it your self person also, but this is the worst possible way to install a brake. All brakes should be absolutely true to the bore and cutting threads by hand with a TAP or DIE is not going to do that.
By reaming the bore to .350 (It should be .328 for the 308)you have given up some of its effectiveness just to clear the bullet path from a bullet strike. Also the use of aluminum is not recommended for use in high pressure cartridges/rifles because of its yield strength and the fact that it will work harden over time and fail.
HOLY COW! what a difference it made. my groups are smaller and it kicks like a .243!
Any muzzle brake will reduce the recoil by some amount as long as the gasses are discharged any direction other than down the center line of the bore. Of the brakes I have tested the worst performing was 18% and the best was 73.4%. That is quite a difference.
I suppose if you take really really picky scientific date, there may be some magic hole pattern or angle, but I think they just help to sell the breaks.
There are many different designs of muzzle brakes some are for show, and some are for go.
and yes there is scientific Data/laws that comes into play when trying to squeeze every foot pound of recoil reduction from a muzzle brake.
I am by no means attacking you, just trying to prevent someone else from believing this is ok to do
and warning you of potential disasters with your process and use of poor materials.
Good luck and be safe
J E CUSTOM
JE, I didn't take any offence, and I didn't mean any towards you wither.Sarcasm is a part of my daily life and humor and I forget that we don't allknow each other. I in no way want to discredit anyone who makes a good break whohas done some expensive testing to find out what works best. I have just seenlots of guys make really cool looking breaks and then try selling them as the'only really good' break out there because of some obscure physical principlewhich I never learned in either semester of engineering physics!!
J E Custom
Well-Known Member
Thanks.
We try to keep this site as polite and professional as possible and sometimes people take
things wrong when we are only trying to help and keep people out of trouble.
I use to hate muzzle brakes, partly because of what I had heard and the rest because of what I though about the noise and looks.
With the advent of bigger calibers in normal and long Range hunting, the need for them grew.
After I purchased a 50 BMG the need for a "GOOD" Muzzle Brake became even more necessary.
So being a do it your self person, I though I would try to improve on the already abundant muzzle
brakes and there performance.
Like everyone else, I had all of the preconceived ideas of what makes a muzzle brake work so I set out to prove or disprove all of these Theories and perceptions one at a time. testing each was the only way to prove or disprove these things.
I researched as many books and articles that I could find and was surprised to find out that my thoughts about muzzle brakes and how they functioned was way off. so I built one to start testing.
I had already started using some other well known brakes on friends and relative's rifles so I thought that If I could not improve on the overall performance, I would just keep on using there brakes.
I do not have a business(I am retired) and have 'No Dog In The hunt' so I build a few Custom brakes for my friends on this site and family for there custom rifles, and don't have to deal with the pressure and deadlines of a business.
I don't consider my self an expert on brakes, but I have done lots of testing an have a good grasp
of what makes them work So I feel I can comment with some degree of confidence on this subject.
PS: I Posted that free machining was designed to be welded on. It should have said NOT TO BE WELDED ON. (My typing skills suck).
Thanks; I thought at least I owed you some insight to where I was coming from.
J E CUSTOM
This guy has done lots of slow motion video doing research with breaks.
High speed ballistics photography - Rifles
great pictures and research!
High speed ballistics photography - Rifles
great pictures and research!
J E Custom
Well-Known Member
+1 These are very good and interesting pictures. (Wish I had his camera).
Would like to see some real recoil numbers though to see how they compare to other brakes.
J E CUSTOM
WildRose
Well-Known Member
I would not count that as gospel. The bullet has already passed beyond the port before the gas is vented to any significant degree.
I've shot both 360 deg radial discharge brakes and side/top discharge brakes and the only time I've ever seen yaw be a problem was with a friend's brake that was not aligned properly to the bore.
To properly install and align a brake they must be indicated off of the center of the bore, not off of the outer diameter of he barrel. That is a mistake you'll see a lot of inexperienced gunsmiths make.
I completely agree that it comes down to the gunsmith installing the brake.
Curious if you are able to tell much of a difference between radial and side discharge brakes?
Varmint Hunter
Well-Known Member
I was kind of disappointed to see what a top discharge brake can actually do to a rifle. I use a well known (on this site) brake that is a side/top discharge brake. The rifle is a semi-custom and shoots incredibly well for a hunting weight rifle in 338RUM. The recoil is very manageable with the brake installed. I'm not too concerned with the flex on my McMillan stock but all that barrel flexing has got my attention.
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If your rifle continues to shoot to the same POI, then the barrel flex must be within the elastic region of the steel... It's really probably not an issue for the metal... I would tend to be more concerned with the forces exerted onto the stock. Fiberglass stocks do not have much flex and I would think the pillars holding the action into the stock are under the highest stress.
it seems that enough of the top ported style brakes exist, and at least I have never heard of any problems arising from their use, they must not put enough stress on a rifle to do damage... Does anybody have any proof or theories that would justify changing away from a top-ported brake? JE Custom's video is very convincing... But is any real damage being done?
Just to be clear, I think JE Custom's video is plenty for me to never use a top ported brake moving forward, I'm just thinking for guys that already have one installed on a rifle...
Varmint Hunter
Well-Known Member
I was originally told that large holes in the top of a brake can "actually drive a muzzle downward" but that the holes in the brake I chose were small enough to avoid that. JE's video displayed significant downward thrust with holes that didn't appear to be much larger than the holes on my brake. I've got 3 side ports on each side and 3 holes on top.
One thing is for sure - this brake did not degrade accuracy and it continues to shoot very well even after the timing got off a few degrees so that the holes are no longer perfectly straight up. That actually is my biggest complaint with these brakes; the timing gets off center even when tools are not used to tighten them.
One thing is for sure - this brake did not degrade accuracy and it continues to shoot very well even after the timing got off a few degrees so that the holes are no longer perfectly straight up. That actually is my biggest complaint with these brakes; the timing gets off center even when tools are not used to tighten them.
