7MM Rem Mag vs 6.5 CM at 600 yards on cow elk

[RebelGuard]

Wow, there are a lot of comments here. Let me try to address most of these in one post. Let me just state that only 2 elk were shot as we had 2 tags. The first elk was shot a total of two times and the second one once. We waited several minutes before firing, deciding what we would do. There was no hurried shooting into the hillside blindly. This was my first time taking the 6.5 elk hunting. I love that gun for plinking and deer hunting. I have learned my lesson and will likely grab the tried and true "elk" guns in the safe from now on. I am aware of the ethical debates that can go on forever, however like i said it was the last day and i needed meat in the freezer. Lesson learned from this one haha, sorry to get some of you fired up. I had no previous reference for how the 6.5 was going to perform on the elk with these loads. Both guns had handloads. 7mm was cruising out at about 3050-3100 fps and the 6.5 was coming out about 2650-2700 fps. Using the velocities and our exact bullets and loads, both of my calculators put both rounds at approx 1800 fps +-100 and 1200 ft/lbs +-100. The 7mm obviously has a lot more potential with bigger and better BC bullets, but that is just what my buddy is running in his. The only info I was talking about with damage on the animal came from the elk we recovered. Lesson learned, I will admit there was some poor judgement but I had to at least try the 6.5cm for elk hunting. I am confident with our shot placement as we had a third member of the group who was calling ranges and watching with spotting scope. However, I concede that you guys are right and i royally messed up this time around ha. Thanks for all of the interest and input. Moral of the story here, not enough firepower for that much animal at that range. I regret losing the second elk and wished i could have spent another day looking had it not been past end of season.

 

[josip89]

In my opinion ,You cant put in same sentence 6.5 creed and elk and definitely not long range

 

[rcol317]

As The Oregonian pointed out the issue is ENERGY, at 600 yds the energy is not sufficient for a good kill based on the information provided. Energy is the key at long distance, along with shot placement.

 

[Ranger Rick]

At that range even the 7 mag is marginal.

Marginal?? Or, did you mean manageable?
I agree with The Oregonian and CanHunter 35 (above). The ballistics of a 7mm mag trump a 6.5 Creedmoor and more via physics & energy.
I have both calibers, and I'd never try a 6.5 CM on an elk period. Whitetail, yes. 600+ yards for a 7mm mag is fine for elk with the right ammo and an ethical hunter.

 

[rustyshackleford]

Three things…

I think something is very off in your calculation for 7rm and 6.5cr if you have them at the same energy. Or one is shooting extremely light loads. My 280ai has almost 500 ft/lbs more energy than my 6.5cr at 600 yards, and my 6.5 shoots the 140 VLD's at 2900 fps so it is no slouch.

To me, a better description of the 6.5cr and elk is that it is a little on the light side at most ranges and not nearly enough at 600.

If you knew going in that your gun was 'a little on the light side', then saw the first cow basically ignore getting hit by your bullet and walk away, why did your shoot the second one with the same round?

I am not a 6.5cr hater as I have one and love it, but the reason you lost the second elk (and the reason you would have lost the first elk if not for your friend) is that you used a cartridge inadequate for the game and distance you were shooting.

High form factor, high drag bullet in the 7 mag. If it had been a 180 berger it wouldn't have been close. A 156 EOL in a CM would likely have more energy remaining that the 7 mag with the 150 gameking.

 

[Ucsdryder]

This has been beat pretty well. Only thing I keep coming back to "is it was the last day so we figured we should try". It almost sounds like you knew better but somehow since it was the last day it's time to start flinging lead and see what dies, and what wonders off to die.

 

[huntinfool18]

My opinion is people need to have a little respect for they animals they hunt. A 6.5 creed or any 6.5 for that matter should NOT be used for elk. They are a big animal and can take a lot of lead. I have a friend who owns and elk ranch and he has all but banned the use of the 6.5 creed on his ranch. Can it get the job done? Yes it can but it dosnt mean it's the right thing to do. I have taken 28-30 elk personally using guns ranging from a 270 win up to a 338 rum. A 7mag is the smallest cartridge I will even think about shooting an elk with. The 338 is the best option in my eyes.

 

[bsnyder]

Well after reading it. Then reading it again.I then read it to my wife and few things come to mind. First this is why I do not like the 6.5 creed and or the 143 eldx and hornday marketing it gives people this false sense of power. Second please don't hunt elk in the states that I do because I'd like to find elk alive not dead and left to rot because it's some last day of season. Third we as hunters have a responsibility to the animals and conversation this is none of the above. Sorry to be harsh and I wasn't going to respond. The only good to come of this is it sounds as if you may have learned your lesson. Unfortunately it's a day late and dollar short.

 

[HangNail]

I have killed 2 elk with .270 win and 7mm rem mag. The .270 gave me a quicker kills. The reason was bullet expansion. The 7mm took two shots. Granted the 7mm was lung shots and I clipped the heart with .270. My Nosler ballistic tips in the 7mm did not expand as well. Clean through. Not an expert but would still choose the 7mm but with a different bullet.

 

[dogz]

Just a thunk for all to consider with this, we're all trying to referee a game we didn't see. Anyone who hasn't messed up is either a liar and or they haven't gone to the plate very often and taken many cuts....

IMO the 6.5 CM is plenty of an elk gun and I would absolutely run it on elk to 600 with the right circumstance. As well, there are plenty of circumstances where I wouldn't take the shot at 600 whether I was using a 6.5 CM or my .340 Wby!

Just depends on the circumstance and set up and the longer one goes the thought that need go into the choice to shoot or not.

Just my 3 cents

 

[bsnyder]

Having killed elk with a 6.5-300 wby, 300 rum, 257, wby, 7stw, 270 wby, I have no issues with the 6.5mm bullet diameter. It's more bullet construction. My last elk I shot was with the 6.5-300 wby and it was a very dramatic light switch. Behind the shoulder mid way up the body and the elk folded up and never twitched.

 

[dogz]

and placement, I'm thinking if the round from the 6.5 on the OP's elk would of been better placed that critter wouldn't of gone anywhere. Angles, pressure can get us and I'd bet the placement wasn't as good as one would wish for.

Plus, if he had time he should of hammered it 2 or 3 more times before it got out of sight. If.........

 

[Reelamin]

Based on what infor you posted I hope you learned a lot about the 6.5 CM in situations like that.

 

[Mike Matteson]

My personal feeling is a (CM) Slow More is light to start with for elk. The last day of hunting! I have passed up more shots, because of either not sure or not what I was looking for. Just to shot doesn't cut it. (Sorry I being hard, but that me) Now animal is left in the forest to rot. You have shot one. Why did you or did you have second cow tag? Otherwise you are not allowed to take or shot a second animal. Poor judgement in my estimate. I have spent all day tracking other people missed or wounded animals. I have two friend that came across blood trails and tract the animal and put them down. They took them home. Both had cow tags. So the animal didn't go to waste. I did one time put a bullet through an elk and wounded another one behind it. Some other people were there. So they finish off the elk, but didn't have an elk tag. I had friends in camp that had cow tags. So the animal was kept and taken home with them. I still ponder the shot I made and what I didn't see the cow I hit. In thinking what I should have done better. I did come into a shooting problem in Africa a few years back with another animal behind the one I was going to shoot. The guide was after me to shoot, but I held until the animals moved so it was a clear shot. At 30yds with a 338 WM and a 200gr bullet (@ 3200fps) would have gone through a few animals. Every time I make a shot, I ponder what I did and what I could have possible do better.