700 Barrel Removal at Standstill

[ntsqd]

When I looked up the Lock-tite product, the amazon price was substantial. I still want some, but I'm going to be saving my pennies for a bit first.

EDIT: ran the search again and found it for a far better price from an unexpected source: https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecID=32182 Not unusual for Pegasus to carry something like that, just unusual that their price is a leader.

 

[Muddyboots]

FWIW - I used a muzzleloader CO2 pressure unloader that you use a CO2 cartridge into a gizmo that snaps onto the ML nipple, then you pressure handle to discharge CO2 through the nipple to push the load out. Actually worked decent if it was a fresh load. I just took the system to different level by adding tygon tubing so I could blow CO2 right into the chamber of the barrel hoping I could cause the adhesion to "break down". Unfortunately, it did not, but do not believe anything would have except higher heat.

 

[Susquatch]

FWIW - I used a muzzleloader CO2 pressure unloader that you use a CO2 cartridge into a gizmo that snaps onto the ML nipple, then you pressure handle to discharge CO2 through the nipple to push the load out. Actually worked decent if it was a fresh load. I just took the system to different level by adding tygon tubing so I could blow CO2 right into the chamber of the barrel hoping I could cause the adhesion to "break down". Unfortunately, it did not, but do not believe anything would have except higher heat.

I'm not sure I understand this one Muddyboots. What were you expecting this to do and how do think it would it work?

You are making a point of this one so I'd like to understand it.

 

[Muddyboots]

The CO2 discharge is extremely cold and I was attempting to "freeze" the chamber area with some hope of metal contraction thus help break adhesion. Simultaneously I took Thor's hammer to action wrench. Did not work though it left frost in chamber!

 

[new2mud]

Muddy—congratulations on the removal, although many of us are sad to see the saga end. Haha.

would you mind showing your barrel blocks situated in the barrel vice for those of us wanting to replicate your learnings on making a better block/shim?

maybe I'm misunderstanding—I thought you made shims to place inside a barrel vice, but from your prior photo it looks they are flat-backed blocks with a barrel channel cut out to insert in a standard bench-top vice?

 

[Susquatch]

Ahhhh, I see!

It was a good thought muddy boots, but it's important to understand that those cylinders are filled with compressed gas. Not liquid or solid. All gases when decompressed or depressurized will get cold according to the universal gas law PV=nRT. This will create frost on surfaces. However, it isn't anywhere near the cooling effect associated with a change of state (liquid to gas or solid to liquid or even sublimation (solid directly to gas) as in dry ice. It's that change of state that releases or absorbs so much heat. Think of it like adding an ice cube to a bowl of hot soup. That ice cube will cool the soup WAY MORE than an equivalent quantity of freezing cold water. The change of state is also the magic BEHIND how air conditioners and heat pumps work.

Yes, the expanding gas cooled the chamber, but even cold water would have been more effective because of the increased heat transfer of liquids VS gasses.

That's why I really liked your idea of using dry ice. It's also why the propane or Loktite Butane were good ideas just too dangerous inside the house (in my opinion).

That said, I think they were ALL doomed to fail against that Red Loktite you were confronted with. Using that stuff was just as mean as cutting left hand threads!

 

[Muddyboots]

The CO2 was pure desperation on my part, it cooled down pretty good but not like being in freezer. I was doing the proverbial long reach!

 

[Muddyboots]

Interesting thought is one of those freeze wart aerosols that use nitrogen?

 

[Susquatch]

The CO2 was pure desperation on my part, it cooled down pretty good but not like being in freezer. I was doing the proverbial long reach!

Yup, I get it!

Good stuff!

 

[Muddyboots]

Muddy—congratulations on the removal, although many of us are sad to see the saga end. Haha.

would you mind showing your barrel blocks situated in the barrel vice for those of us wanting to replicate your learnings on making a better block/shim?

maybe I'm misunderstanding—I thought you made shims to place inside a barrel vice, but from your prior photo it looks they are flat-backed blocks with a barrel channel cut out to insert in a standard bench-top vice?

The "shims" were small hickory flooring strips that I placed on bottom and on top of the oak blocks. When I get home later I will post up a pic of the hickory flooring.

 

[Muddyboots]

The block in pic was the last set that I used. The hickory is so hard there is no deflection from it under compression.

 

[Susquatch]

The block in pic was the last set that I used. The hickory is so hard there is no deflection from it under compression.View attachment 257487

Seeing is believing. It's amazing what 30,000 psi Bending Resistance will do for you! I have a whole new appreciation for Hickory. I wonder what it would have done if the oak blocks were a few inches longer. Also wonder why nobody makes gunstocks out of hickory. Or at the very least laminated stocks.

 

[new2mud]

The block in pic was the last set that I used. The hickory is so hard there is no deflection from it under compression.View attachment 257487

All makes sense now. Thank you!

 

[Susquatch]

Two cans of Loktite Freeze are on the way. One review said it works great on small fasteners but didn't touch large ones. Not sure the reviewer understood the underlying principles to use it correctly. Anyway, I want it for both, so it will be interesting to see how well it works. Too bad I didn't get it sooner - my neighbour had some u-bolts on a farm sprayer that would not budge with a 1500 lbft air gun. He torched them off last night. After he torched them he discovered that replacement bolts were $80 each (4 needed) so he asked me to make some new ones for him instead.

I'll add to this post whenever I get to use the stuff.