6.5 build for 140 Bergers at 2900-3000?

[Doug Herold]

A 6.5 SAUM (6.5 Gap 4S) can run a 140 VLD or hybrid at 3,000 with about 58 grains of R26, and you'll likely get at least 2,500 rounds on your barrel before needing a setback.
See where others are getting 3,000 out of the PRC with 56-57 grains R26.

6.5Gap4s shooting 59.6gr of H1000 at 3080 fps measured by Magneto Speed

 

[Deleted member 103481]

Don't use the .188 reamer.

GAP, who developed it doesn't even use the .188.

Use a .130.

My factory loads are 2.945-2.95 and are just jammed like 10 thousandths with a .130 freebore and fit in my accurate mag

 

[L.Sherm]

.188 is the saami freebore, .130 on the first ones were a screw up.

 

[Deleted member 103481]

Call George Gardner and ask. He uses a .13_ pretty sure it's .135 straight jacket uses a .130. I doubt anyone in the country has built more than those 2 shops and George made the cartridge.

 

[L.Sherm]

I'm not talking about factory if you run the correct saami freebore and want the heavier bullets and not have a bunch of the bearing surface jammed in the case you need longer than a 3.00 mag box

 

[Deleted member 103481]

I'm saying Run the freebore the inventor runs and not what hornadys lawyers and talking heads submitted.

Or don't I don't care lol

But you are right if you use the saami reamer you're not going to get there.

 

[alf]

PSA concerning throating, freebore, & OAL's on the PRC from a year ago:




The original reamer spec that most folks have been using to chamber PRC barrels is likely not going to natively work with the recently launched hornady factory ammo. This came to light due to the recently released Hornady reamer spec which JGS has as of just a few days ago. On that print, the freebore is indicated as .1882". The reamer that Travis presently has matches the spec PT&G had on file for the PRC which puts the freebore at .1302".


I've worked with chambers on that original PT&G reamer as seen here: https://forums.gunhive.com/topic/167...and-ts-customs


You'll notice in that write-up I was using a berger 140 hybrid and ended up ten thousandths off the lands with an OAL of 2.940". Hornady factory ammo is measuring 2.945 for both the 143ELDX and 147ELDM. Based on tip to ogive measurements, this would put hornady factory ammo jammed into the lands on the original PT&G reamer spec about ten thousandths. On the new reamer with the .1882 freebore, you'd be looking at approx 50 thousandths jump. Tip to ogive measurement on a 140 berger hybrid is about 20 thousandths longer than a 147 hornady... so you can plainly see what this differing spec can mean for those looking to shoot factory ammo in their "old" chambers.


Some obvious things about that situation are that if you have an "old" PRC chamber, factory ammo will be jammed... while if you have a "new" PRC chamber, you'll never be able to get closer than 40 thousandths or so from the lands in max strapless AICS format magazines like Accuratemag.


I do not know where the PT&G original spec came from, but it's clear that the hornady spec reamer print from JGS would indicate the future direction of the design and this is further supported by the fact their current factory ammo will certainly work fine in their new spec. It does present a dilemma for handloaders or custom builders however. On one spec you can run a short freebore and be able to approach the lands at mag length. On the other spec you'd never be able to approach the lands in a short action with the longest mags available for it. A mid or long action with associated mags would be the only way to get into the lands with the "new" spec.


Both Travis and I felt it prudent to do a little PSA about this situation, as it's likely there are more than a couple rifles out there with short PRC chambers that will result in factory ammo being jammed to the tune of 10 thousandths or better.

 

[alf]

BTW, I've built a couple on 700 L/A's and went with a .200" freebore on my reamer.

OAL of dummy rounds about .020" in the lands.

(L) 140 VLD - 2.995"

(M) 147 ELD - 3.010"

(R) 150 SMK - 3.090"

 

[Deleted member 103481]

Yep, if you want to touch the lands in a wsm mag then you don't use the saami reamer. It's pretty much that simple. Not only is factory ammo in the .130 a non issue, it shoots well and will have you in the exact velocity range OP wants, with the bullet OP wants.

 

[keithcandler]

Thanks for your reply, Alf and Sherm!!!

 

[L.Sherm]

JM go back to the OP's original question, he wanted to shoot the 140VLD at 3000fps so what does that mean. He doesnt want to shoot factory ammo so hes probably gonna reload would be my guess. So your trying to make the .130 freebore and factory ammo fit not what he was asking. I'm simply pointing out situations he was asking and what he would run into if he used a saami reamer with a Rem SA and try to chase the lands to get his best accuracy which most handloader do.

 

[Deleted member 103481]

I'm using it as an example that you can be at the lands in a magazine.

My last comment about factory working well was only to add to alfs statements about factory ammo being jammed in the short chamber. The last sentence reads poorly, I was speaking to the .130 working well with both factory and the OPs needs. I should have worded it better.

 

[Santiam338]

Put me in the 260ai crowd... 2960 with H8731 or 3030 using Re 26 with 140's.. Some think that fireforming may be a problem,but brass lasts so long that it is a non issue... I run right on the heels of the PRC and 6.5-284 guys with a lot less powder,which has to help in the barrel wear department...

I am a BIG fan of the 260ai..

 

[harps]

If you reload, the best barrel life that will consistently get you to that velocity is a .260 Ackley Improved. Some will argue 6.5 creed, but its simply not practical to expect a 140 at 2900-3000 with a 6.5 creed, simply put, not every 6.5 creed can do that. A 6.5x284, 6.5 prc, 6.5 WSM and 6.5 saum will get you 2950-3100, maybe a touch more, but a couple of those would really need to be in a long action, and your using mid 50's to 65ish grains of powder, where as with a .260 AI your doing it with 45-50 grains of powder depending on powder choice.

In my Remington 700 semi custom .260 AI I was running the 140 VLD's at 3070 fps with 49.1 grains of Reloder 26, and have also ran HBN coated 147 ELD-M's at 3050 fps with 50.3 grains of Reloder 26, also had a stupid accurate load of 48.7 grains of H4831sc under the 140 VLD at 2930 fps, would cloverleaf at 200 yards. I have a 29" barrel, with a 26" expect to loose about 50-70 fps from that.

Hi like the info I got my 260 in 2006 and I've thought about going to the 260AI I just was wondering has anyone tried to make a 6.5 Creedmoor AI if this was done what kind of gains might we find any ideas ???
Thanks