375/408 CT- Looking at this seriously.

[Down Under Hunter]

Looking for some brain storming on parts for a possible new rifle.

Probably go with the new manners GAT stock when it comes out in a few weeks. Now large enough in the tang to take the LAwton or BAT action for the 408 case.

Looking at BAT, Lawton or maybe Barnard for the action.

Not sure what to look at as far as the twist rate or brand of barrel. Either std bore or LR design ?

Have heard no feedback from anyone on solid projos with performance on game. I suspect they would be terrible ? I have a friend that has a 375/408 std with Barnard, LAwton 32" barrel shooting the 350 GRN Predator Aussie bullets at 3150 fps. Shoots in the .2 range at 100M and sometimes around one inch at 500 ? Thats decent.

This gun would be used strictly as Long range Sambar deer rifle with long range steel as secondary. Looking at a halfway round between the EDGE and 50 BMG thats shootable, has ELR capability, is accurate as hell and has a quality projo that could be used on game.

Probably go with a single shot and look at an overall weight of around 20 lbs kitted up.

MAy yet fall back to the 338 AM because of projos but the 375 in king of the hill down range !

Do you guys have any suggestions.

Much appreciated all

DUH

 

[JUDD]

I also would be very interested to hear some positive/negative on this caliber...

 

[eddybo]

Those 375gr rocky mountain bullets at 3100 fps amaze me. A buddy of mine recently got a 375/408 and we have taken it out a couple of times. We are still playing with the load and accuracy has not impressed me yet, but then again my 338AM did not shoot much better Saturday. Load problems can mask the accuracy of any gun. I had loaded up with the wrong lot of H50BMG and thirty inches of vertical at 1400 is not very good. Maybe we will get back out there next weekend.
We found a load that shot perfectly flat at 800 yards in his gun but kept getting horizontal stringing of about 4 inches. I thought we were onto something because of the lack of vertical. When we moved out to 1400 he got the same issues as I was having bad vertical. I am not sure how picky that round is going to be only playing with it a little more will tell.
We have not tried any of the lathe turned bullets yet, but he has some to try. I think he is loading 132gr of retumbo under that 375 and if nothing else impresses you about that round the concussion created will impress you.

 

[GLZ]

Projectiles are the only problem, but being hard headed I just shipped a BAT reciever and a 375 cal 1 in 10 twist Brux barrel to Kirby to build a 375 AM. I have a McMillian A-5 and 1000 350 SMK's here waiting. The barrel is a consumable anyway so if it won't shoot I will rebarrel as a 338.

 

[eddybo]

I suspect that they are going to shoot fine and suspect barrel life should exceed the 338AM by a good bit. Some guns just do not like what you are feeding them and I suspect that may be the case with the gun we have been working with. Hopefully we will get it sorted out soon.

I am wanting to try another powder and think that may be the answer, but some are having great luck with retumbo.

 

[noel carlson]

DUH,

It would be easy enough to produce a six-caliber hunting version of the ZA375, but how big does a wound channel really have to be on anything smaller than a Cape Buffalo?

I am not well versed on terminal ballistics (yet), but this does seem excessive.

Can you guys educate me please?

Best,
Noel

 

[Down Under Hunter]

DUH,

It would be easy enough to produce a six-caliber hunting version of the ZA375, but how big does a wound channel really have to be on anything smaller than a Cape Buffalo?

I am not well versed on terminal ballistics (yet), but this does seem excessive.

Can you guys educate me please?

Best,
Noel

Noel,

Thanks for the feedback. I have only heard from guys saying that if the solids dont hit bone and hook their nose in and tumble the wound channel will be very small ? I am wanting something that will put some more hurt on them downrange than the current 300 smk.

I have seen damage to game done by a 50 so I am looking for an inbetween. 375/ 408 maybe it. Bigger wound channel, should expand bullets better with more speed etc.This wont make up for poor bullet placement though.

Very interested in chewing the fat over this round. I worry about consistant supply of bullets, especially if your chamber and barrel design are specific for it. And many are..

Aprreciate your input as you have a vast knowledge of what makes them tick.

Cheers

DUH

 

[noel carlson]

DUH,

Consistency of supply has been the bain of all the recent solid designs. I am in contact with one of your countrymen to circumvent this obstacle, and may simply license domestic manufacture if the bureaucratic hurdles become too costly, or inconveinient.

I have chosen the six-caliber as a hunting projectile specifically because it is just the right length to use interchangeably in barrels cut for jacketed bullets, but still long enough to retain a slight aeroballistic advantage over conventional projectiles. In a 9.93" twist, the ZA375/6.0-M has a Sg of 1.4.

I believe there are already 1: 10" twist 375 barrels already out there, so the compatibility/interchangeability issue should be moot (?).

I acquired a great deal of information, on terminal performance, from members of this site in an earlier thread. Some of the theories were much more compelling to me than others, but my preference is, of necessity, based on speculation. For this reason, I am now experimenting with three different expansion biased projectiles in 338. The results will be independently published at Sniper's Hide in the next 2-3 weeks. Chances are that all three will be offered to the public as options, and I will just allow the Market to decide what works best.

I am open for imput.

Best,
Noel

 

[LR3]

Down Under,

I have two 375/408, one single shot and lighter and shorter and the other a longer heavier 7 shot magazine. Both are great and kick less than my 30-378 because of very good brakes. The lighter groups 2.25 at 510 yards and I can hand hold it. The heavier one is a Allen Magnum and its the one that Kirby had a 3 shot grouping of 5" at one mile (see guns for sale).

The 350 gr SMK s will penetrate 20mm / .75" steel plate. With a GS solid, it wont go through the steel plate but buckles it and does not break up. Makes a perfect little brass flower. The 350 SMKs are very comfortable to shoot. For whatever reason the GS round kicks slightly more.

If you are looking for something between 338 and 50, it s a great round

 

[Down Under Hunter]

Down Under,

I have two 375/408, one single shot and lighter and shorter and the other a longer heavier 7 shot magazine. Both are great and kick less than my 30-378 because of very good brakes. The lighter groups 2.25 at 510 yards and I can hand hold it. The heavier one is a Allen Magnum and its the one that Kirby had a 3 shot grouping of 5" at one mile (see guns for sale).

The 350 gr SMK s will penetrate 20mm / .75" steel plate. With a GS solid, it wont go through the steel plate but buckles it and does not break up. Makes a perfect little brass flower. The 350 SMKs are very comfortable to shoot. For whatever reason the GS round kicks slightly more.

If you are looking for something between 338 and 50, it s a great round

LR3,

Thanks for your thoughts. I think I am looking not so muchfor more range but better wind bucking ability and larger wound channels.

Even std 408 CT maybe. Just a widen wound channel and I aint going to be shooting at big game at stupid distances. About 1200 M is where I am at with the EDGE in great conditions.

Just trying to put a bigger hole in 'em and still need to pack it. MAybe the 338 AM would be the common sense choice ?

I loved that big gun of Kirbys mate. Very impressive indeed. And very BAD *** indeed !

Cheers

DUH

 

[LR3]

Down Under,

I would say for sambar a 338 would be an excellent choice. The 375s I have certainly weight more (about 16 lbs and 20lbs) and not the kind of weight you want to carry too much. Also, even the single shot is difficult to keep on target free hand because of the barrel lenght and weight.

Good luck

 

[Kiwi Greg]

DUH
My 416 B project has stalled at the moment due to issues with the brass projo's & I probably have a Brake problem as well.
I am very reluctant to use a brass projo on an animal as well.
The 400 tsx shoots fabulously in my 416 without the brake best yet is 3 shot 10.5mm @ 220 yard, not so good with the brake though, shame thier BC is mud.
I have another brake coming to compare to see if I do indeed have a brake issue.
I have been trying to get some Rocky Mountain projo's.
I had it all sorted, but then the supplier had more issues with export permits and gave up, hopefully George can get another exporter or sort it somehow.
His projo's would make a massive difference in the .416 & the .338 when he starts building them.
So I guess you would have to make sure you could get his or similar bullets on this side of the world before you go to far down the track.
I am in the process of building an Edge, yours and other stories have inspired me, as cool as the .416 B is @ 30 lbs its not a carry rifle for more than 200 ish metres, unless I go to the gym 24-7 which isn't gunna happen.
Cheers Greg.

 

[Down Under Hunter]

Greg,

The edge is a great round and it would take an Allen Mag to make me change over too.

I have friends who are in the armoury bus in Aus who have fireformed 416 brass.

They are the importers in Aus of Mcmillan Tactical and have the TAC 50 in 416 Barrett in a test rifle currently. They are using the Predator brass solid through a 32 " lilja barrel.

To justify the change I would need to see big jumps in performance. The 408 based rounds give this. I am really trying to improve projo performance out of the big sierra with more leg speed.. if you get my drift. Also the HEnson 264 AL tipped 338 pills have arrived in country and I plan on loading a batch to shoot from the EDGE in the next week.

My friend tried them out of his STD MLR rem LAP on the weekend and had about 200 fps more speed out of the 26 " barrel over the SMK. ABout 3010 fps. Accuracy was average though and I think we didn't get the correct length right. I am sure with that tip they will open way up on Sambar hit at range.

If they shoot they might give 3100 fps from a 30 " edge with a big, big BC of as much as over .9 ? This BC is a quess from talking to guys shooting them currently and they all run over .9 on exbal. Imagine that ..3100,.. .9 BC. if accurate... Ooouch !

So many guns.... Not enough time , hey !

DUH