338 SS split dies and fired ADG brass measuring .006 at the web
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I wish it were not true - feel free to call Derek, (Greg at ADG) or Rich to confirm.
couesaddict
Well-Known Member
I stand by my previous statement and on that note, I'm out….
Clown
I'm not trying to lecture you and at this point I couldn't care less about your problem. I think it's comical that you are unwilling to draw any correlation from other people who have had similar issues but in different cartridges. I think you are just trying to cover your tracks in hunting down a scapegoat by asking a very direct question and refusing to answer most of subsequent questions from the members here.
I have not had a 338SS experience your problems. And I don't know of anyone who's had an SS of any caliber experience the problems you are having. I have however seen this problem in a 6.5 Grendel but beings that it is not a 338SS I will spare you the time of reading how the problem was fixed. Good luck
The search for co-plaintiffs…..14 days and counting.
lancetkenyon
Well-Known Member
Have you cracked more than one FL die?
Trying to help here, but without answers to questions, we are all just throwing out possibilities with no real data to help us make informed responses.
It wasn't my personal rifle, but I did work with a 24" 338 SS for a short period of time. I never saw a cracked die, but there was significant case expansion (.005") and lower than expected velocity (2730 fps) with a 225gr bullet.
The owner of the rifle gave me the gun, his loaded ammo using 1x fired ADG bras, his 2x fired ADG brass, 10xunfired pieces of ADG brass, and a set of Hornady dies. He complained that he wasn't getting the velocity he though he should get, and that he was getting hard extraction before he thought he should. He asked me to look at it because I have pretty extensive experience working with high performance wildcats of my own designs as well as others.
I fired his loads and I experienced what I would consider heavy bolt lift and excessive muzzle blast, indicating high pressure based on my experience. I measured the case expansion and got .005" over the measurement for unfired brass. I was able to size the brass without significant issues other than requiring significant effort to run the brass into the die.
I believe he was loading ammunition to excessive pressures trying to reach unrealistic velocities for a case that size. I told him to reduce his loads and be happy with closer to 2675 fps with a 225gr bullet. He chose to keep his loads the same because he believed 2800 fps was the performance he should have seen.
I believe that a lot of the velocities posted for the Sherman Wildcats are a result of running at very high pressures. Some combinations of components can pull it off, others can't. I've ordered 2 identical barrels from the same manufacturer, had them chambered by the same smith, with the same reamer, at the same time, and one showed max pressure at 80 fps lower velocity when using the same components from the same lot.
If you're seeing .006" case expansion you either have excessive pressure, or a sloppy chamber. You're confident that the chamber is accurate, so that really just leaves excessive pressure. It sounds like your loads have exceed the safe working pressures for your system. Sometimes it just works out that way. You either accept the performance you're getting, or you scrap the project and try again.
Good luck
The owner of the rifle gave me the gun, his loaded ammo using 1x fired ADG bras, his 2x fired ADG brass, 10xunfired pieces of ADG brass, and a set of Hornady dies. He complained that he wasn't getting the velocity he though he should get, and that he was getting hard extraction before he thought he should. He asked me to look at it because I have pretty extensive experience working with high performance wildcats of my own designs as well as others.
I fired his loads and I experienced what I would consider heavy bolt lift and excessive muzzle blast, indicating high pressure based on my experience. I measured the case expansion and got .005" over the measurement for unfired brass. I was able to size the brass without significant issues other than requiring significant effort to run the brass into the die.
I believe he was loading ammunition to excessive pressures trying to reach unrealistic velocities for a case that size. I told him to reduce his loads and be happy with closer to 2675 fps with a 225gr bullet. He chose to keep his loads the same because he believed 2800 fps was the performance he should have seen.
I believe that a lot of the velocities posted for the Sherman Wildcats are a result of running at very high pressures. Some combinations of components can pull it off, others can't. I've ordered 2 identical barrels from the same manufacturer, had them chambered by the same smith, with the same reamer, at the same time, and one showed max pressure at 80 fps lower velocity when using the same components from the same lot.
If you're seeing .006" case expansion you either have excessive pressure, or a sloppy chamber. You're confident that the chamber is accurate, so that really just leaves excessive pressure. It sounds like your loads have exceed the safe working pressures for your system. Sometimes it just works out that way. You either accept the performance you're getting, or you scrap the project and try again.
Good luck
Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
It's kinda crazy that this wildcat can't keep up with my lowly 338win. I'm at 2900 fps with a 225 ab outta the 26" bbl. on my #1 and I'm not really stepping on the gas that hard.
For one thing the case is smaller, than a WM.
Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
What's the base case? I've always thought the 338win is already a bit starved on capacity and I should step up a bit, but with a couple 300rums in the safe I never have...
The SS case is an improved saum. Saum is the parent case
SAUM, shortened about .100"
About .565 shorter than 338WM, the SS on the far right.
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About .565 shorter than 338WM, the SS on the far right.
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You can not test loads with cases you have already blown the web out by overpressuring. They will always expand after that as you past the yield point far enough the web is now thinned and weakened. I very much doubt with a new fireformed case loaded to 2600 fps with varget rl17 etc your expanding remotely close to 0.006 at the web. More like 0.0015. If you are then something is serious out of spec with the barrel.
There is always some variation in vel from different barrels. A simple search of this site will show with same barrel length case powder bullet with spreads of 120fps+ between different barrels.
Lija's are a barrel maker known to run a slower then others but can give excellent accuracy.
I can not see anything productive coming from this thread beyond this.
There is always some variation in vel from different barrels. A simple search of this site will show with same barrel length case powder bullet with spreads of 120fps+ between different barrels.
Lija's are a barrel maker known to run a slower then others but can give excellent accuracy.
I can not see anything productive coming from this thread beyond this.
