28 nosler 195 berger RE33 testing

[cjuve]

Also shot a muley this year at 50 yds with 28 nosler /195 going 3050 acorn size entrance and it expanded perfectly with no issues. Took one step and dropped.

Same experience here

 

[Gobears16]

So I have around 100 rounds down the barrel of my new Spartan Precision built rifle. I started my load development with RL 33 at 85.5 and went up to 86.7. I started seeing ejector marks at 86.4 and didn't go higher. I was shooting with a bipod and a rear sand bag. Groups looked okay and wish I would have had a front rest as I noticed when I didn't load the bipod The impacts went low, I shot an extra at each charge because I thought I pulled the shot. I realized I wasnt loading the bipod and had a much better hold on the target while dry firing... I went back to the shop and loaded 85.1 and 85.3 as it looked like 85.5 grouped well when I loaded the bipod, I also made a smaller target as I thought it would help refine the aim point. I was glad I did because I shot my best group ever and if I stack the 85.1,85.3, 85.5 they are all nice and tight. I think I will go with 85.2. What do you guys think? I wish I could go as high as Ryan Pierce with RL33 but I'll take the accuracy and run with it.

 

[Badgerclaw]

Your measuring your best two shots from that group. Still a good group but you need to measure center to center of the two widest shots. I could shoot a one shot group and make the calipers read anything from .000 to .284. Other than that. It's an awesome group. Your probably hitting presure because you don't have as much freebore in your rifle as Peirce's rifles. I would chronograph your load, zero your scope and then let your rifle sit with a dirty barrel. Take that load on a different day with different weather conditions, and see if your cold bore shot and velocities remain consistant (with 5 shot groups). I've shot some awesome 3 shot one hole groups out of a clean barrel, only to take it out the next day and have a terrible cold bore shot, followed by 4 shots with velocities all over the place with the same load. My conclusion was that I had two lucky misses during load development that landed in my first shot hole. Long story short, if your going to stick with a load and run with it, shoot a 5-7 shot group over a chronograph and validate it

 

[Gobears16]

Your measuring your best two shots from that group. Still a good group but you need to measure center to center of the two widest shots. I could shoot a one shot group and make the calipers read anything from .000 to .284. Other than that. It's an awesome group. Your probably hitting presure because you don't have as much freebore in your rifle as Peirce's rifles. I would chronograph your load, zero your scope and then let your rifle sit with a dirty barrel. Take that load on a different day with different weather conditions, and see if your cold bore shot and velocities remain consistant (with 5 shot groups). I've shot some awesome 3 shot one hole groups out of a clean barrel, only to take it out the next day and have a terrible cold bore shot, followed by 4 shots with velocities all over the place with the same load. My conclusion was that I had two lucky misses during load development that landed in my first shot hole. Long story short, if your going to stick with a load and run with it, shoot a 5-7 shot group over a chronograph and validate it

I was measuring my best three shot group from the 85.1. At worst it's .1 three shot group. From my measurements from 85.5 (not including the pulled shots) and 85.3 all three groups basically stack on top of each other. Granted I'm very new to reloading and I was nervous as hell to pull the trigger on both 85.1 and 85.3 as the first two shots from these groups were in the same hole. The barrel hasn't been cleaned for 36 rounds before I started this test. I don't plan on cleaning it for another 30 or so rounds. I'll definitely shoot 5-10 more rounds over a magnetospeed of 85.2 and see what these velocities look like. I appreciate your detailed response. I've learned more from these threads and you guys than any book.

 

[rpierce]

Great shooting Gobears. I would recommend cleaning it every 20-30 rounds though if using reloader 33. Its a very dirty powder and in most cases your velocity will start changing as you put more rounds on it due to carbon buildup. If its carbon fouled bad accuracy will go down and youll get pressure signs. Easier to clean it when theres not much build up vs having a ton of carbon build up.

 

[Gobears16]

Ryan I appreciate the advice. You seem to be the hero of the 28 and I take your advice seriously. What's the deal with throat erosion in your experience. Should I re-measure the lands every 100 or so rounds?

 

[rpierce]

No problem at all. Not sure about hero but Ive definitely built a ton of them lol. Probably a couple hundred in the last few years. Throat erosion on the 28 with 195s is usually .007-.010 every 100 rounds. Its definitely something to keep an eye on. I would probably adjust every 50 rounds. Sooner if your seating depth node is narrow. That's one of the reasons Im really liking my two 300 norma improved rifles. My heavy rifle is for load testing/plinking. My barrel had roughly .012 erosion in 400 rounds. Im guessing the barrel will last 1000-1200 pretty easily. Throat area still looks great. Im sending a 215 berger at 3200 fps which is a cupcake load w VV N570. I had it at 3315 fps in a 26" barrel w no pressure signs. At that speed its a smidge flatter than the 28, identical wind drift and 10% more energy at 1000 vs a 195 at 3100 fps. I had a h1000 load w a 215 that averaged 3/4" at 400 yds off a bipod. However the ES wasn't as good as my n570 load. Ive had several sub inch groups at 400 w the n570 load also. The nodes on the norma improved are almost a grain wide. Now that I just finished up my lightweight hunting norma improved Ill probably push it closer to 3300 if theres a node there. Just started testing it w formed brass. I was actually surprised at the lack of recoil in my light setup. Weighs 10.0 lbs w optics. I have no problem spotting my hits at 400 yds off the bipod w the scope at 25x and a 215 @ 3200 fps. In the heavy rifle, 15 lbs, I can watch the vapor trail go to the target at 400 off the bipod. By the way. This lapua brass for the norma is some of the toughest Ive ever seen. I honestly don't think a guy could wear it out. I had a load that the chargemaster drifted 3 gr over a warm load. For some reason I didn't verify it on my sartorious. Anyways I had to hit the bolt w my hand to get it to cam over. The primer pocket on the brass was still super tight. If I would have done that in nosler brass the primer would have fallen right out lol.

 

[Kmccord]

No problem at all. Not sure about hero but Ive definitely built a ton of them lol. Probably a couple hundred in the last few years. Throat erosion on the 28 with 195s is usually .007-.010 every 100 rounds. Its definitely something to keep an eye on. I would probably adjust every 50 rounds. Sooner if your seating depth node is narrow. That's one of the reasons Im really liking my two 300 norma improved rifles. My heavy rifle is for load testing/plinking. My barrel had roughly .012 erosion in 400 rounds. Im guessing the barrel will last 1000-1200 pretty easily. Throat area still looks great. Im sending a 215 berger at 3200 fps which is a cupcake load w VV N570. I had it at 3315 fps in a 26" barrel w no pressure signs. At that speed its a smidge flatter than the 28, identical wind drift and 10% more energy at 1000 vs a 195 at 3100 fps. I had a h1000 load w a 215 that averaged 3/4" at 400 yds off a bipod. However the ES wasn't as good as my n570 load. Ive had several sub inch groups at 400 w the n570 load also. The nodes on the norma improved are almost a grain wide. Now that I just finished up my lightweight hunting norma improved Ill probably push it closer to 3300 if theres a node there. Just started testing it w formed brass. I was actually surprised at the lack of recoil in my light setup. Weighs 10.0 lbs w optics. I have no problem spotting my hits at 400 yds off the bipod w the scope at 25x and a 215 @ 3200 fps. In the heavy rifle, 15 lbs, I can watch the vapor trail go to the target at 400 off the bipod. By the way. This lapua brass for the norma is some of the toughest Ive ever seen. I honestly don't think a guy could wear it out. I had a load that the chargemaster drifted 3 gr over a warm load. For some reason I didn't verify it on my sartorious. Anyways I had to hit the bolt w my hand to get it to cam over. The primer pocket on the brass was still super tight. If I would have done that in nosler brass the primer would have fallen right out lol.

Ryan, I have a question, do you have a software program you use to locate the nodes in a given cartridge? I am curious how you locate various nodes with various powders without wearing out a barrel to settle on one or two? As of now and has been for several years N570 has been very scarce and all the big magnums love this powder, all I have able to find that is close to it velocity wise is RE33.

 

[rpierce]

Ryan, I have a question, do you have a software program you use to locate the nodes in a given cartridge? I am curious how you locate various nodes with various powders without wearing out a barrel to settle on one or two? As of now and has been for several years N570 has been very scarce and all the big magnums love this powder, all I have able to find that is close to it velocity wise is RE33.

I shoot at 400 yds for initial load testing. I do .5 gr increments in powder for 8-10 shots. Youll see the velocity flat spots on the chrono and they correspond to shot locations on target. You need either a labradar, oehler or magneto chrono for this. Others aren't accurate enough or are too sensitive to light conditions etc. Then you go and tinker in that velocity range and if need be do a seating depth test. Youll have a load in 25 rounds or less.

 

[Harvey Durham]

Well after multiple problems with my target camera not getting reception at 1000 yds for my ladder test with the 28 nosler I decided to do it at 400 yds as I could see the bullet holes through my scope. I use my NF 15-55 for all load testing. I also did all testing off a harris bipod. I was using re33 and berger 7mm 195s. I started off at 86.6 gr and went up to 89. The 88-89 load had a slight ejector mark but the case dimensions stayed the same as the 86 gr load. Pockets were still pretty tight. 88.0-88.8 is an extremely accurate node forming a .95" group at 400, .237 moa. The vertical for the 88.0-88.8 was .55" or .1375 moa. 88.4-88.8 gr formed a .55" group and 88.6-88.8 went into the same hole. I had a few rounds left over of a 86.6 charge as I used them to get on target w. Heres the 3 shot group for that, 1.250" at 400 yds off a bipod. The whole ladder test measured 3.2" for the 13 shots, .8 moa, for a 2.4 gr spread in powder. Not too shabby. Also as a side note I was only getting .5 moa at 100 yds with many diff combos for this gun. As soon as I scooted back moa wise the groups shrunk drastically. I had a hunch this would be the case w this extremely long bullet after trying as many combos at 100 as I had. I will definitely be testing 88.4-88.8 for groups in the next few days. I chronoed 88.4 last week and it was 3140 fps. I will be trying this load out in the next dozen 28 noslers Im making for customers in the next few weeks.

Ryan Pierce
Piercision Rifles
www.piercisionrifles.com
563-586-2000

What's your FPS on your load???

 

[tyler71385]

Following along.

I just loaded my ladder test for the 195s tonight. 85.4 to 89.0.

I didn't realize I had this much freebore. My COAL is 3.749" touching the lands. I backed the off .015".

I'm going to try to shoot in the next few days.

Will 300yd be enough to try them out?

 

[rpierce]

D

Following along.

I just loaded my ladder test for the 195s tonight. 85.4 to 89.0.

I didn't realize I had this much freebore. My COAL is 3.749" touching the lands. I backed the off .015".

I'm going to try to shoot in the next few days.

Will 300yd be enough to try them out?

Shoot it as far as you possibly can. 300 will work but further is better. I recently got one of the Targetvision cameras. Way easier than the previous camera I had. Did my ladder test at 1000 yds. 5 out of 7 different charges for the 300 norma improved had under an inch of vertical at 1000 yds.

 

[kthorpe]

Well after multiple problems with my target camera not getting reception at 1000 yds for my ladder test with the 28 nosler I decided to do it at 400 yds as I could see the bullet holes through my scope. I use my NF 15-55 for all load testing. I also did all testing off a harris bipod. I was using re33 and berger 7mm 195s. I started off at 86.6 gr and went up to 89. The 88-89 load had a slight ejector mark but the case dimensions stayed the same as the 86 gr load. Pockets were still pretty tight. 88.0-88.8 is an extremely accurate node forming a .95" group at 400, .237 moa. The vertical for the 88.0-88.8 was .55" or .1375 moa. 88.4-88.8 gr formed a .55" group and 88.6-88.8 went into the same hole. I had a few rounds left over of a 86.6 charge as I used them to get on target w. Heres the 3 shot group for that, 1.250" at 400 yds off a bipod. The whole ladder test measured 3.2" for the 13 shots, .8 moa, for a 2.4 gr spread in powder. Not too shabby. Also as a side note I was only getting .5 moa at 100 yds with many diff combos for this gun. As soon as I scooted back moa wise the groups shrunk drastically. I had a hunch this would be the case w this extremely long bullet after trying as many combos at 100 as I had. I will definitely be testing 88.4-88.8 for groups in the next few days. I chronoed 88.4 last week and it was 3140 fps. I will be trying this load out in the next dozen 28 noslers Im making for customers in the next few weeks.

Ryan Pierce
Piercision Rifles
www.piercisionrifles.com
563-586-2000

Have you found any temp sensitivity issue yet with rl33?

 

[rpierce]

Have you found any temp sensitivity issue yet with rl33?

Since I posted that info 5 years ago I have switched to VV N570 for magnums. Its very stable for temperature. About .1 fps per degree compared to 1 fps per degree for RL 33. But honestly i havent built a 28 nosler in a year for customers. Everyone is wanting my 30-28 nosler or 300 norma improved. They have 75% less throat erosion and are way easier to keep in tune. With the 30-28 you simply run a .306 mandrel through the 28 nosler brass. Stuff 83 gr of h1000 into a 230 berger and it bugholes. Or 86.5 gr of h1000 and a 215 berger and it bugholes also. Both those loads have shot into the .1s moa wise out to 950 yds in my setup. My 230 load is probably the most accurate combo Ive seen. 83.2 gr of h1000 will hold under an inch of vertical at 580 yds. The last two groups I shot had 1/2 inch vertical at 580. 230 berger at 2965 fps. Ive switched to the 230 bergers though in my 30 cal setups since theyre a little more optimally seated in the case for my throat setup. Also the slightly lower velocity compared to the 215 berger is an advantage at closer ranges. The 300 Norma improved starts off where the 30-28 tops out at. The lapua brass for the norma is indestructible. I put 28 WARM firings ona single piece of brass and the primer pocket feels almost brand new. Very wide powder/velocity nodes in this cartridge. Not much recoil either with my self timing 5 port brake. I can watch the vapor trail and spot hits no problem in a 10 lb w optics 300 norma improved or 30-28 nosler. The 30 cal magnums have been so popular Ive just started keeping complete rifles instock ready to ship.