.270 whitetail bullet shopping again, for the last time.

[Stgraves260]

Wow there is a lot to unravel here but I'll only comment on the copper pills that you loathe. I'm not sure Y. if your hitting critters at over 3000 FPS with monos and being dissatisfied, then your not understanding wounds and ballistics well despite looking at some innerds. Your copper was flying to fast, they'll pass through without much expansion. Same holds true for say a traditional Berger, If it's over 3000fps it wont act as described and designed; it will grenade within 2" of entering an animal and dump it's energy before they get to the vitals. If you look at LR bullets; their not only designed to have a high BC but also to mushroom at lowered velocity. They too will grenade if too high velocity. Now...I'm certainly not saying a deer of any size can't be taken with a high or low velocity projectile. I'm saying if you don't understand how a cartridge is designed to work then you shouldn't be disappointed at its performance if you don't get an expectant outcome.
Just my 2c

Yes sir. I thank thats why Berger says not intended for 300 yards or less. When I shot whitetail deer under 300 yards I just shoot them in the neck. That or I'll shoot them where the bone is in the shoulder. Heart shot is all ways good.

 

[BoomFlop]

Where does Berger state that they are not intended for shots under 300 yards?

Steve

 

[Starlite]

Wait what?
So your saying that if a copper is driven too fast, it does not expand and just pencils through. BUT a cup and core hollow point driven to fast expands too quickly? That doesn't make sense.

A copper bullet should be driven as fast as possible to initiate expansion.

I would agree that a cup and core if driven too fast will expand too quickly.

Have a great evening.
Steve

Steve,
Before I clarify my post let me say I completely agree that maximum velocity equals immediate expansion Of the projectile. However, Let me clarify my statement. I was referring to the expansion of the wound cavity What I've experienced is that a mono, (especially the Barnes TTSX) if travelling to fast 3000fps will not expand tissue correctly. As they start to peel back, (mushroom) they can loose their petals within 2-3" and it continues to pass thru the vitals sometimes like a pencil... I'll assume, as there is minimal disruption inside. Although it's been stated in previous literature of energy on exit is only ~250ft lbs it seems to be a significant factor with whitetail deer and monos travelling at higher velocity. Especially broadside shots. Shot placement is key at longer distance too. Sometimes it'll just drop one petal and Nosedive or veer sideways. A number of years ago I shot a WT when it was quartering towards me. The deer died but it was 300M in the bushwacker zone (Murphy's law right). The bullet had passed thru the ribs, caught some lung and exited just in front of the hind leg on the opposite side. I found one petal in the deer. This has been my experience in the past.
All bullets and tissue will certainly expand better; if traveling say faster then 1800 FPS. (Other then a VLD hunting projectile I'll assume). Some guys love Berger's as they like to tumble inside at those slow velocity and grenade at velocity above 3000 FPS.
For me I like monos as I don't like eating lead. I don't like the birds eating it either. From what I understand it has / had critically endangered condors in some US states. There is a reason why we don't shoot waterfowl with lead. Lead in other birds and fish and frogs etc;
Anyhow in my passion to support the monos (And birds) and without having a in-depth discussion about California or ....mass or any other state / province's banning of lead ammo, I didn't explain the expansion appropriately. For that I apologize. There is a proper velocity for all ammo and an appropriate shot placement For a given distance, cartridge, velo, environmental factors, animal being hunted etc;
The person who posted their comments is certainly entitled and I'm sure had some valid points.
For the record In the past 3 years; I now shoot all my animals in the head neck area. Especially at longer distance. It's either a clean kill or a clean miss. 9/10 times. If I don't feel confident that I can do my part, that cartridge stays in the rifle. I owe that much to the animal.
again sorry for the confusion

 

[The Old Hunter]

Ok, so many years ago when I first started handloading I started off with the Nosler ballistic tip. I shot my nice buck with it perfectly broadside at 110 yards and the bullet completely exploded, it literally just made it to the vitals and that's it, the BT in my book was a varmint round, never shot another one since. I am told they made some changes to them but with all the nice bullets out there I won't give them another chance. Next up, for many years I shot the Nosler Partition. I loved the killing of that round, however I never could get it to shoot accurately out of my rifle, somewhere around 2-3 inch groups at 100 yards no matter what I tried. Next up, Speer Grand Slam. Shot many deer with great success, better accuracy, however I'm not of fan of the soft blunt lead nose that gets damaged and my hunting spots have changed over the years and I am reaching out to longer distances. Next up, the Barnes triple shock, unbelievable accuracy, honest 1 inch groups at 200 yards off a bench. Shot around 4 nice bucks with them, lost one. I will no longer shoot a solid copper. The picture perfect mushrooms in gel are all cute and all, but they don't kill deer the way the others do, some will argue but that's just the facts. I have hit deer perfectly with the Barnes and got little to no blood, deer have run off almost like they were not even hit, only to see them tip over 50-100 yards later. So, no more Barnes, and here I am now, looking again. I have thoughts on trying these options. Federal Trophy bonded tip, Hornady INTERBOND, not interlock, Nosler Accubond, and maybe even the Swift Scirocco 2. Again, this would be in the .270 Winchester round, in WI deer at ranges of 0-450 yards. I only want to do this one last time, enlighten me, give me advice, give me horror stories, tell me what to do..

When I used the 270 Win. the old school 130 Sierra Game King pushed by 60 grs H4831 killed every one DRT that I shot with it. Probably the Nosler Accubond will fill what you described you want. I have only used the 130 Accubond in my 264 Win mag at 3350 fps and it exhibits the same performance from 25 to a touch over 500 yards for me. It is a very accurate bullet with very good ballistics. It goes in expands and takes out the vitals and exits with about a thumb size hole. I have killed 25+ deer with this combo and all have been DRT.

Try Remington Core-Lokt 130gr SP. Been shooting them for over 55yrs. Never lost a deer, never tore up a deer and 99% of them dropped in their tracks. Family favorite for our Rem 700 270cal is 58gr H-4831 w/ standard CCI or Rem primer. Always sub MOA @ 100yds. As my beloved father always said, "if it isn't broke, don't fix it"! Works great in all our .270s, 2-Rem 700s and my brother's 721.

 

[Goldengun]

Hornady design the SST Built for lite thin skin game animals. The inter bond are for heavy thick skin animals. So if I used those 2 bullets it would depend on what I was hunting and how far my shot was. Depending on the caliber rifle I was shooting would make a big difference also. With my 260 Rem a 140 grain SST pretty much Disintegrates under 300 yards. So on deer I shoot them in the neck. So at 300 yards or less I would choose the Inter-bond. After 500 yards my 260 don't mushroom the inter-bonds to my licking, but the SSTs will. A lot of people have had great success with the SSTs so I know they work. I just can't keep switching back and forth from the SST to the Inter-bond do to the ranges I shoot. That's why I chose the Berger VLDs. Shot placement to me is more important than anything.

I like the way you think. Been shooting 130 VLD's in my 260AI since it's inception and I can't imagine something working better. I would shoot VLD's in anything and feel confident. I also shoot them in my 243W(95gr). Having said that, I see the SST/Interbond(never shot them) issue to be similiar to that of the BT/AB. You may know this, but many of the BT/AB bullets of same caliber/weight have the same BC. I have shot both BT/AB in my 300WSM with great results, but never both of same weight. I'm going to try this and see if I can get same point of impact, so I can change them out depending on game/hunting situation. Alas, since you've discovered the 130 VLD, no sense in changing now.

 

[six pack]

"Partitions" absolutely need to be loaded close to maximum for your rifle!They like near max velocity and seem to shoot more accurately that way !

Yep.....I'll bet the best load for a Partition will be at or near max. Depending on what powder you're using, you may even want to refer to an older manual to see what max was few decades ago.

 

[Huntz]

I have probably shot more game with ballistic tips then any other bullet.When they first came out they would open up like crazy,but that has been rectified many moons ago.I have used them on moose,big bear and elk with no problems.Accubonds had a bad rep when they first came out also.They were often called Accubombs.Nosler does not sit on their hands when they have a problem.They solve it.There are many good bullets made by different Companies right now.You could probably buy any of them and kill what you are hunting.I don`t know what you are expecting,but if you shot the animal and it dies the bullet has done its job.However if a bad shot is made it really does not matter what the brand name is because none will make up for a misplaced shot.JMHO,Huntz

 

[del2les]

While I enjoy using several of the modern higher BC bullet designs and makes in my 270's, over the many decades of shooting deer sized and larger game, I cannot count the numbers I have taken with the Sierra Game King BT. I cannot recall ever having one fail to bring home the meat, and I have used them from near point blank to 700 or so.

There are several good .277 deer bullets out there, and sometimes, I feel we over complicate things. YMMV

 

[Montana'eer]

I kind of stumbled onto this thread by seeing it on the 'trending threads'. I can offer no advice on which to use- I don't own a .270. However I bought a lot sale of reloading equipment from a friend, and there was quite a bit of .270 'stuff in it'. I've got some Sierra GK's 130 and 140gr variety and some tsx 130gr

If you want to test some of them I could send a few of them to you.

 

[Stammster]

Pm sent

 

[aushunter1]

tell me what to do..

Aim for the head

 

[Montana'eer]

Pm sent

I wanted to see if the OP wanted to try some out. I'll wait a bit first.

 

[ZAK13]

I would give the Nosler BT's another try, depending on how long ago you tried them, the BT's now have a slightly thicker jacket and hold together better than the ones from the past did. Also some have mentioned the Hornady SST's, another great bullet, which I have used with great success. Truthfully, I would have to agree with the few that have stated that every animal is different in their response to being struck by a bullet. Some will drop immediately, and some won't, every animal is different. Shot placement is important, but again results may vary. I was in SC a few years back on a hog hunt with some friends, on the second day of our hunt, I hit a hog with using my 270 and a 130gr SST, and the boar dropped immediately, the bullet travelled thru his lungs and heart, 2 days later I had repeat success, except this second hog acted differently, he walked away at the sound of the shot, acted as if I missed, only to recover him 50yds away. Both boars were the same average weight, (one was 156lbs, the second 168lbs.), both were shot broadside at the pretty much the same distance of 180yds., both had the heart and lungs destroyed. Did the bullet do its job in both cases? Yes they did, the only difference was the animals reaction to being struck. Since that hunt, I have switched bullets many times and settled on using Barnes TTSX, and still had and have the same results today.

 

[wwbrown]

I used to shoot a lot of crop damage deer sometimes up to 15 in a night, all does at ranges up to 300 yards. Given the little light and time we had I wanted to shoot the deer and have them drop within a few steps. It is hard to start tracking multiple deer at night that may be using the same trails. We only took broadside shots and I used 130 Core-Lokts out of my 270 Win as I got the fastest and most consistent bang flops from that combination.

Advance the calendar a few months forward and now I am hunting deer looking for large bucks, I have a lot of deer in the freezer. I would shoot Barnes or Accubonds out of 270 or 30-06, reason being I knew I would not have my choice of a bunch of deer that were standing broadside to me. Using bullets of heavier construction gave me the ability to take shots that required them to get through more bone and meat to get to the boiler room.

Explosive and controlled expansion bullets (and bulelts in between) all have their place, it all depends on situation.