“Stop the Hammering!”

Right so what I get from this is he was overloading ("53.5 grain charge of H4831sc" against 51.5 published max load) to chase the velocity, when velocity was probably being knocked-down by the moly not the load.

Pressure came from the overload then, maybe, along with throat?
No the Molly has nothing to do with pressure because you would add more powder to get to the same velocity which equals the same pressure of a lesser load with more friction From my take on the earlier post it was due mostly to a short throat
 
Right so what I get from this is he was overloading ("53.5 grain charge of H4831sc" against 51.5 published max load) to chase the velocity, when velocity was probably being knocked-down by the moly not the load.

Pressure came from the overload then, maybe, along with throat?
Yes, but, I don't use book data, for this cartridge. I did that once, from Hornady with RL26, with a starting charge and a 140 ELDM and could've blew my face off! New extractor, plunger & spring and all is better.
 
No the Molly has nothing to do with pressure because you would add more powder to get to the same velocity which equals the same pressure of a lesser load with more friction From my take on the earlier post it was due mostly to a short throat

Yeah but that only works to a point right? Because if the round can't clear the force out of the barrel in the time-frame, the cartridge will expand to expend that energy. I mean theoretically what could be happening here is the round speed coupled with the overload is hampering the ability to expend all of the energy out of the barrel so in the interim the cartridge expands.

Possible? I'm a newbie to reloading just trying to walk the physics.
 
Yeah but that only works to a point right? Because if the round can't clear the force out of the barrel in the time-frame, the cartridge will expand to expend that energy. I mean theoretically what could be happening here is the round speed coupled with the overload is hampering the ability to expend all of the energy out of the barrel so in the interim the cartridge expands.

Possible? I'm a newbie to reloading just trying to walk the physics.
The Molly has very little to do with anything I believe it is more the speed or volume of powder plus the short throat just like when you jam a bullet it will raise pressures compared to jumping a bullet
 
The Molly has very little to do with anything I believe it is more the speed or volume of powder plus the short throat just like when you jam a bullet it will raise pressures compared to jumping a bullet

Right. I think what I'm saying is the same thing, but that the Molly is acting like a bullet "Jam" (slower velocity as compared to what it should be) so that it's not exiting the barrel quickly enough, which in concert with the overload, raises he pressure.

But I 100% yield to your experience here.
 
If you have a shave load and Molly coat your bullets you can add a touch more powder and it will still be safe if you were
Right. I think what I'm saying is the same thing, but that the Molly is acting like a bullet "Jam" (slower velocity as compared to what it should be) so that it's not exiting the barrel quickly enough, which in concert with the overload, raises he pressure.

But I 100% yield to your experience here.
Just my opinion take it for what you paid for it but the way I am trying to understand what you were saying yes the Bullet is traveling slower but the reason it is doing that is because of less pressure due to less friction
 
If you have a shave load and Molly coat your bullets you can add a touch more powder and it will still be safe if you were

Just my opinion take it for what you paid for it but the way I am trying to understand what you were saying yes the Bullet is traveling slower but the reason it is doing that is because of less pressure due to less friction

Just to explain what I'm talking about -- three cases:

1. There's nothing in the barrel at all and there's a slight overload. At this point, assuming it's slight, the energy can probably exit the barrel without case expansion. Clear channel to exit.

2. There's a bullet in the barrel that responds to increase in load (slight overload) at a non-impeded ratio/speed (non-Molly). At this point, with a slight overload, the bullet would move out of the barrel fast enough to let the energy escape without case expansion.

3. There's a bullet in the barrel that responds to increase in load (slight overload) at an impeded ratio/speed (Molly). At this point, which a slight overload, the bullet can't move fast enough out of the barrel to let the energy escape without case expansion.

I was saying, "Maybe it's #3".
 
Just to explain what I'm talking about -- three cases:

1. There's nothing in the barrel at all and there's a slight overload. At this point, assuming it's slight, the energy can probably exit the barrel without case expansion. Clear channel to exit.

2. There's a bullet in the barrel that responds to increase in load (slight overload) at a non-impeded ratio/speed (non-Molly). At this point, with a slight overload, the bullet would move out of the barrel fast enough to let the energy escape without case expansion.

3. There's a bullet in the barrel that responds to increase in load (slight overload) at an impeded ratio/speed (Molly). At this point, which a slight overload, the bullet can't move fast enough out of the barrel to let the energy escape without case expansion.

I was saying, "Maybe it's #3".
Let me try to say it this way the bullet travels out the barrel before pressure can build because of less friction The Molly does not impede the bullet it actually lubricates between the bullet and barrel
 
Lawrence O'Donnell would not have been happy if he were at my house tonight. I just got done pulling 27 6.5-284 rounds with the kinetic hammer. Seems I had them loaded a bit hot. Had a moderately stiff bolt lift and looks like some pancakes and ejector marks. This was a 53.5 grain charge of H4831sc under a 130 Accubond. Does that seem hot to you guys in a 6.5 Norma? I was getting 3,082 FPS out of it (SD 10; ES 31). See pic of the cases. I'm kind of bummed out about it cause it was looking very promising. Any suggestions on a charge I might back off to?View attachment 193648
There are definite ejector Mark's on some of the cases indicating pressure ! You're probably experiencing hard bolt lift too ! If it were me I would back off my powder charge 1 grain of powder and recheck for pressure and chronograph to check fps
 
I didn't read through this whole thread but I have built quite a few 6.5-284s. I have used (in recent years) 130, 140, 142 and 143 grain bullets. I have tried many powders. It has been my experience that getting 3000 fps with a a 26" or shorter barrel is not easy to do. Some barrels will do it. I can do it with R17 and MagPro.; neither of which are particularly temperature stable compared to really good powders. Right now I am using R26 and I am right around 2950. When I was shooting 1000 BR there were quite a few of us shooting 6.5s. NOBODY was much over 2900 even with 29-30 inch barrels. Best ES and accuracy nodes seemed to be in the 2900s. I ran VV N160 myself. Don't get hunt up on 3000 fps.
 
Warning! This thread is more than 5 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.
Top