Win 70 & Barnes 130 TSX & 150 TTSX

Hespco said:

Trying to develop a hunting load for my Win 70 EW 30-06. Have tried the Barnes 130gr TSX ( I prefer ) with Win 748 powder & various seating depths. Can't get a reliable hunting group. Two in close, then one way out. Same with the Barnes 150gr TTSX using Win 760/H-414 powder. I have to hunt my deer & elk in the same season. The copper mono's have proved to be very effective for even the largest elk even in my 6.5's. This 30-06 is quite accurate with my old favorite, the Sierra 165gr HPBT. A bit much for deer, but very elk capable. Was wondering if any of you had a secret receipt for the mono's?

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Did you clean and remove all the copper fouling before starting load development with Barnes? Remaining Cup and Core fouling will usually create issues when trying to do load development with monos.

JMO, but the 165 Sierra HPBT has worked perfectly for me out of my REM 78 30-06 on everything from coyote, antelope, whitetail, mule deer, and elk. Even an occasional PD for fun.
My Remy does well with 130 TTSX and H414 as well as 150 TTSX using H414. According to an email with Barnes, the 150 TTSX was actually designed for the 300 WM. They load a different 150 TTSX in their own factory 30-06 ammo.


So far I have not been able to get the same small groups out of my hand loads as their factory loads even duplicating seating depth. Mine run .62-.87" 3 shot groups consistently though, so for hunting, good enough.
I've been working to get the same groups out of a well used Kimber Montana, but no luck yet.
Best of luck with your Win 70!

Hespco said:

Trying to develop a hunting load for my Win 70 EW 30-06. Have tried the Barnes 130gr TSX ( I prefer ) with Win 748 powder & various seating depths. Can't get a reliable hunting group. Two in close, then one way out. Same with the Barnes 150gr TTSX using Win 760/H-414 powder. I have to hunt my deer & elk in the same season. The copper mono's have proved to be very effective for even the largest elk even in my 6.5's. This 30-06 is quite accurate with my old favorite, the Sierra 165gr HPBT. A bit much for deer, but very elk capable. Was wondering if any of you had a secret receipt for the mono's?

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When you get a flyer, seat .005" deeper. That will pull it into the group. May need more depending on how far outside the group it is.
Lighter profile barrels need less adjustment and heavier profilis more, but .005" from a Model 70 will record a movement.

^^^

Although I would start about .025" deeper than you already are and work deeper in .010" with the solids. They are hard and are not as forgiving as cupa and core. I have found course seating experimentation works better. Then fine tune if needed.

Not a M70, but an older 700. It shot the old 130 gr. XC Barnes amazingly well. 2" 3 shot groups at 300 yards. The Barnes 150 gr. are a different ogive from all the rest. I originally was planning on shooting them in my AR-10, however because of their design, they wouldn't feed. I never did try them for accuracy in the 700.
I definitely second the bedding issue as the culprit for your issue. My theory is, even though the barrel has cooled, the stock/bedding is still heat soaked enough that it's causing the issue

azarcher10x said:

Not a M70, but an older 700. It shot the old 130 gr. XC Barnes amazingly well. 2" 3 shot groups at 300 yards. The Barnes 150 gr. are a different ogive from all the rest. I originally was planning on shooting them in my AR-10, however because of their design, they wouldn't feed. I never did try them for accuracy in the 700.
I definitely second the bedding issue as the culprit for your issue. My theory is, even though the barrel has cooled, the stock/bedding is still heat soaked enough that it's causing the issue

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I think that may be drawing a long bow, as most people bed the action and leave the barrel forward of the recoil lug free floating don't they?

Even if the bedding covered a portion of the knox form, it won't affect barrel heat and again, what bedding compound are you critiquing?

PROBLEM SOLVED!!! This morning I changed scopes. I installed a new from the box Leupold 4X12. Problem still persisted. Two shots close together, Then from a cold barrel the third shot 1" to 1 1/2" out. Went thru 20 or so bullets , two at a time , some one at a time. keeping the barrel cold. Getting ready to pull my hair out. This is an accurate rifle. Went back to my old reliable Sierra 165gr & they would not group reliably. What is going on here???. Then I noticed the scope had move ever so slightly. The high quality silver rings I was using was leaving a silver dust on the scope. ( expensive rings) Apparently leaving a slippery surface on the rings. I changed out the rings & installed a set of Burris Signature ZEE rings. The ones with the nylon inner inserts. Problem VANISHED!!! First two shots almost touching. Barrel cooled , then a third shot, snuggled right into the first two. Let the barrel cool, them two more shots right into the first three. All five shout under 3/4". The load was right from the Barnes manual. 65 grs H-414/ Win 760 with the 130gr TTSX. OAL 3.222. Cases trimmed to 2.494. Picture shows where the bullet is seated. A painful but rewarding conclusion . A mighty thanks to all for their advice. Good thing I have my own range. This would have been much more of a challenge to travel back & forth over miles...Phew!!!. Will chronograph Monday..

^^^ nice

azarcher10x said:

Not a M70, but an older 700. It shot the old 130 gr. XC Barnes amazingly well. 2" 3 shot groups at 300 yards. The Barnes 150 gr. are a different ogive from all the rest. I originally was planning on shooting them in my AR-10, however because of their design, they wouldn't feed. I never did try them for accuracy in the 700.
I definitely second the bedding issue as the culprit for your issue. My theory is, even though the barrel has cooled, the stock/bedding is still heat soaked enough that it's causing the issue

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The factory bedding on these rifles is spot on, but for me, nothing is right/correct unless I do it myself.
I have 3 of these Portuguese built rifles, 264WM, 338WM and one is a switch barrel built by me that has 264WM, 257 Weatherby & 270 Weatherby barrels, none are poor shooters and I happily shoot 3 shot groups without shifting POI. The barrels I make/use are not fluted like the factory barrel, same contour without flutes and soda blasted.

Cheers.

Hespco said:

Trying to develop a hunting load for my Win 70 EW 30-06. Have tried the Barnes 130gr TSX ( I prefer ) with Win 748 powder & various seating depths. Can't get a reliable hunting group. Two in close, then one way out. Same with the Barnes 150gr TTSX using Win 760/H-414 powder. I have to hunt my deer & elk in the same season. The copper mono's have proved to be very effective for even the largest elk even in my 6.5's. This 30-06 is quite accurate with my old favorite, the Sierra 165gr HPBT. A bit much for deer, but very elk capable. Was wondering if any of you had a secret receipt for the mono's?

Click to expand...

I use H4895 in my Rem 7600 in 06 with 150gr ttsx...get half inch groups at 2930 from 22" barrel.

maximini14 223 said:

I use H4895 in my Rem 7600 in 06 with 150gr ttsx...get half inch groups at 2930 from 22" barrel.

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That's outstanding for a 7600. Care to share the load recipe?

Choreographed my Win 70 06 with the 130gr TTSX, for those interested. The load I selected on , right out of the Barnes manual. 65grs Win 760/H-414. Barnes shows 3266fps out of a 24" Bbl. My 22" Bbl showed 3157 fps. with a 3/4" group every time. Load displayed not the slightest sigh of over pressure. Shoots so good , this is the load I will stick to.

That load sounds like it's going to be a real killer! Good luck hunting and make sure you post up your results.

Those 130TTSX are lethal. I run those out of my 308 bolt gun at 3135 with a 18" barrel.