Eradicate the Wolf???!

The problem with the wolves is they didn't reintroduce the native wolf they are bigger and more aggressive they kill for sport our area elk were 5000 + numbers now I think it's below 1000 and it's not because of hunters if people and wolves could live together they would still be here so I don't see the need for wolves hardly ever see them all they do is kill the game that many people rely on for food and income there was a study a few years ago where they found like 40 wolf killed cow elk only 3 of them were fully consumed the rest had the calf pulled from mother and very minimal eaten of both so was basically a sport kill also anyone that lives in wolf country can't have outside pets cuz they come in at night and kill them some places parents can't let there children play outside because wolves have been seen stocking children just my 2 cents

I have to disagree on the contention that the wolves introduced are larger and more aggressive than the "NATIVE" wolf that had been reduced to number that could no longer support a viable breeding stock...they are the same wolf as was found historically even from the same subspecies...the data is there for the asking or google and some of the white papers are available for free.

Cougar has been known to "sport" kill so have Grizzly and herds of sheep have been severely savaged by Coyotes...no one predation species has the corner on this type of activity....

From the youngest age I have lived in wolf country and at no time were we out unsupervised because predators are opportunists and as far as killing dogs/cats ...sorry to say that is normal activity...Wolves are extremely territorial and will do their level best to remove competition...its a instinctual imperative...no competition for resources...never mind the Coyotes that share the same territory....

Go to Africa...lions are known to stalk people out and about....Arctic..Polar bears consider "Everything" to be on the menu and will actively hunt man...India Tigers have been know to follow individuals....and on and and on...every region has or had a major predator and interactions with man can go either way....

HARPERC said:

) An area in Wyoming was closed this week as there were grizzlies feeding in the area. If you're late to the party it's not about balance, it's about forcing people off of "public land". The Endangered Species Act is the modern equivalent of decimating the bison to force the natives onto reservations. It's about a few people wanting to play God without the requisite wisdom, or long term view.

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Since I retired in 1998 I've spent much of my time in the fight against the animal rights agenda. Harperc is right, it's about forcing people off the land. The introduction of the wolf was pushed by animal rights (AR) groups, such as the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS) which, among other negative things, is an extremist anti-hunting group! As was mentioned by another poster -- the levels have been reached, which were previously agreed upon -- but now the AR groups say we still shouldn't be allowed to manage wolves! The intent by the AR groups, is to allow wolves to continue to expand until they decimate as many of our deer, elk and moose herds as possible! That will give us fewer hunting opportunities which will result in fewer hunters!

The extremist AR groups (and extremist environmental groups) are essentially made up of people with a misanthropic personality – they hate humankind far more than they love animals!

Those of us deeply involved in this fight also want to know why the AR groups think like they think. We've long recognized it's about forcing people off the land because the extremist AR suffers from a human self-loathing – a personality defect. It's not necessarily a mental illness but can be a symptom of a mental illness!

That being said – that doesn't mean the AR's aren't intelligent because many times the leaders of the extremist groups are very intelligent and use arguments that seem to make sense. However, they do have an agenda – so be careful not to buy into that agenda!

I once read that the NPS is an embedded foreign organization within the United States government. It sounded pretty extremist to me, but the claim is not without evidence. I believe we have a similar situation here in Canada.

The wolf-sheep-shepherd analogy is working on a lot of levels here..!

I don't see why we can't treat them the same way we treat coyotes. We're never going to eradicate them completely, because Canada has tons of them, so they'll always come back. I think there are plenty of people on this forum who would agree with me that we are far more interested in maintaining healthy game populations than we are in predators that most of us will never see.

Matno said:

I don't see why we can't treat them the same way we treat coyotes. We're never going to eradicate them completely, because Canada has tons of them, so they'll always come back. I think there are plenty of people on this forum who would agree with me that we are far more interested in maintaining healthy game populations than we are in predators that most of us will never see.

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That would be nice, but wolves are capable of causing real economic loss.

The Selkirk Caribou (Woodland) herd (last remaining herd in the Rocky Mountains, is eradicated now at this point. I used to cut their tracks often in the Yaak area of Montana, which is on the east side of the Idaho Ho panhandle. I have only seen them once, I was a teenager then. It's my belief that the wolf was the main contributor to there demise.
https://species.idaho.gov/woodland-caribou/

It's a tough situation you have the Majestic Wolf..El Lobo Solo and all that.
But then you have the Rancher with the bank note and Kids that like to eat/stay warm.
Plus the loss of lease money.
The Guide looking for work. All the others that really need the hunting income
from gas stations to restaurants? ....In my world Humans trump Animals!

Hol

TG-5150 said:

The Selkirk Caribou (Woodland) herd (last remaining herd in the Rocky Mountains, is eradicated now at this point. I used to cut their tracks often in the Yaak area of Montana, which is on the east side of the Idaho Ho panhandle. I have only seen them once, I was a teenager then. It's my belief that the wolf was the main contributor to there demise.
https://species.idaho.gov/woodland-caribou/

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Sad.

Here's the thing you can believe what you want but when they first introduced the wolves they showed the difference in size and it was considerably bigger and we had a very few of the wolves that were native to our state now there gone because the new wolves killed them there is absolutely no reason to have wolves when there done exterminating all the wild animals where do you think they are going to eat ranchers live stock do you want your stake to triple in price we'll thats what will happen all because of a mut besides if things didn't go extinct we would still have dinosaurs wouldn't be any oil to fuel your luxury vehicles either if we need wolves turn them loose in central park

I'm no expert on all this for sure, but when the wolf population exploded and we were allowed to hunt/trap them in Montana, I jumped in with both feet. Studied all I could. Went to special trapping classes(state of Montana brought in some famous wolf trappers from Alaska and I think the Yukon). Anyway, I looked up everything I could find on record about size and such, male and female. Back then the transportation stunk at best. Many carcasses were left, only brining out the skins. The carcasses that did make it out could have been old enough that dehydration took a toll on the true live weight. At least that's what was formulating in head.
One of the main reasons wanting to look up the weights is because non of the old photos of wolves trapped seemed to match the giants that were and still are being photoed in Canada and now the U.S.
I was always taught we had Timberwolves in the Rockies and there were prairie wolves east of the divide and in southern extreames of the country. And the Gray Wolf was in the Canada's.
I can't remember the exact highest weight recorded in Montana back in the day for sure, but 147 lbs. seems to strike a bell.
I still don't fully believe they are all Grays in one breed, but more like elk, the Roosevelt dwarfs the Rocky Mountain. And the Tule is altogether different.
I wish I had the time or finances to trap and hunt them full time. If I win the Lotto, I just might.

yoteslayer said:

Here's the thing you can believe what you want but when they first introduced the wolves they showed the difference in size and it was considerably bigger and we had a very few of the wolves that were native to our state now there gone because the new wolves killed them there is absolutely no reason to have wolves when there done exterminating all the wild animals where do you think they are going to eat ranchers live stock do you want your stake to triple in price we'll thats what will happen all because of a mut besides if things didn't go extinct we would still have dinosaurs wouldn't be any oil to fuel your luxury vehicles either if we need wolves turn them loose in central park

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Huh? mtmuley

I talked with a game official a while back....seems the herds of elk around Jackson are down......but herds to the south are up....do people really not see what is happening....elk have been forced out of what has been traditional territories into others....
Dispersing herds does not quantify as fewer animals...just migrated away animals....
The predator/prey relationship is not perfect....in this case the prey figured out it had to move.....the predators just followed...thats the way man came to the new country...across the frozen ocean...and followed prey on down the line.......they say that those same individuals wiped out the wooly mammoth.....did tbey actually kill every one of fhe mammoths....hell no...
But chasing and dividing herds caused less and less breeding..then the woolies just couldn't come back....
The Wolf won't kill every elk...but it is chasing them from past habitat...
The Wolf doesnt just feed on elk, deer and bison.....there are lots of other little critters that are being decimated too....rabbits for one....wheres the fish and game counts on our furry little friends......surprise...they don't care about our little bunnies......
Wolves have their place.....or had their place.......now they have become the unregulated predator....24/7/365......
Severe regulation is going to be the only way to keep not only their numbers in check..but also their roaming.......they can't go unregulated

middleofnowhere said:

With the amount of people we have now encroaching in the wilderness, it would be impossible to go back to a completely "natural" and balanced ecosystem. That said, there is a place for wolves and they need to be in our environment. They need to be managed, and if done properly, the management can provide valuable recreation and economic benefit.

Prediction: this thread will melt down pretty quickly when the wolf "exterminationst" jump on board LOL.

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Yes and we need rattlesnakes and sharks also! sarcasm...