Which is better and why? Direct Impingement Gas or Piston Operated?

[crashlanding]

This has been a very interesting read, thanks for more knowledge in this area

 

[hunter0528]

Perhaps you need to read more. Direct impimchment is more prone to malfunction due to dirt, dirty powder, infrequent cleaning. That is why the "forward assist" was added after the problems in Vietnam and the "cleaning" kits and training that came after the disaster. Just talk early Vietnam verterans.
Piston, like the M1, FN-FAL, G3, G5, M249 light machinegun (HK 91, 93 for civiallian) and the Sig like SG550 of the Swiss Army and the AK47, AK74, just take more dirt and abuse. Not an opinion, but a fact.
Piston also tend to be heavier.
But like I said above, DI, easier to find parts and accessories here! Easier to build!

How do you consider the G3/ HK 91 and 93, Piston driven? They are both delayed roller back?

 

[asd9055]

You are absolutely right!

 

[D2wing]

Does anyone believe DI would provide better accuracy or smaller groups than a piston system,?

If so, is my decision then a trade off in reliability vs. accuracy?

Can I get both?

Yes, contrary to piston lovers any advantage to a piston is a myth. Numerous gun ranges, military contractors and the US government have run tests. No advantage of the piston system. Also it is a detriment to accuracy due to the reciprocating mass. It is just adding useless weight and complications. If it was better the top competitive shooters, military and most commercial would have them. Clearly a myth. The gun was designed to not have a piston. If you want one, get one. You probably won't notice any difference. Gun boards thrive on mythology.

 

[asd9055]

And yet the US miliatary in 2022 is selecting a Piston to replace the DI

 

[D2wing]

I am thinking of buying or building a .308 AR10. I want a 24 inch barrel on it. So, one decision I need to weigh is if I want it to be reliable and
operate smoothly even under rapid, repeated firing, AND I want to be able to shoot small groups with accuracy of at least 1 MOA preferably
a half or 3/4 MOA, should I go for gas impingement operation or some type of piston system?

What should I do and why?

Numerous tests have shown no advantage to a piston system. If they are better top competition shooters, the military and most comercial ARs would have them. Pistons just ad weight and useless complications. You will here all kinds of things like they are cleaner or more accurate. Gun boards thrive on mythology. For normal use you probably won't notice any difference at all.

 

[D2wing]

Does anyone believe DI would provide better accuracy or smaller groups than a piston system,?

If so, is my decision then a trade off in reliability vs. accuracy?

Can I get both?

You get both with DI. Pistons are less accurate do to more reciprocating weight. Check top competition. No Pistons. Numerous tests show no difference or slightly more reliability with DI.

 

[Mark37082]

So you and the competition shooters know more than the US military? I believe they do a little more intensive testing than the average gun enthusiast. I am not a big fan of cleaning rifles or having gas blow back in my face. It takes a little of the fun out of shooting. Get what you want and enjoy.

 

[Deleted member 115360]

 

[asd9055]

I own 5 piston, not sure how many DI and 5 blowback (these are 5.7x28, talking about fun). I love them all. Each has it +/-. Try then and decide.

 

[asd9055]

How do you consider the G3/ HK 91 and 93, Piston driven? They are both delayed roller back?

You are absoilutely right. Last time I picked a G3 was in bootcamp, longer than I care to remember. I forgot the top tube is not a piston.

 

[DoneNOut]

I haven't had an issue with any DI AR15, M4, M16A2, in regard to performance. This is based upon a very large sample size on the range, hunting, and in combat. I would never be like, "Oh I got to go to war with a DI, welp I'm a gonner!" (Napoleon Dynamite voice) GOSH!

 

[Danehunter]

Think about it: Why has NO other military used Direct Impingement in their service rifles (other than AR rifles they may have)?
Because DI is dirty, hot and non-adjustable for various types of ammo.

Let DI AR rifles die a slow death. Consider WHY other militaries only want gas piston rifles and why H&K and SIG make gas piston ARs - and RUGER too, for that matter.

Despite the loyalty of former service members to DI AR type rifles it is a dying system. Will the Army's NEW 6.8 mm rifle have DI? NOPE, no matter which rifle they chose it will most definitely NOT be a DI operating system.

 

[DoneNOut]

Think about it: Why has NO other military used Direct Impingement in their service rifles (other than AR rifles they may have)?
Because DI is dirty, hot and non-adjustable for various types of ammo.

Let DI AR rifles die a slow death. Consider WHY other militaries only want gas piston rifles and why H&K and SIG make gas piston ARs - and RUGER too, for that matter.

Despite the loyalty of former service members to DI AR type rifles it is a dying system. Will the Army's NEW 6.8 mm rifle have DI? NOPE, no matter which rifle they chose it will most definitely NOT be a DI operating system.

Let's play Hunger Games. I'll have my DI and you can have your piston.