Viability of 8mm Mauser (8x57) as a long range round

[westcliffe01]

The 8x57 can do anything a 30-06 can do. That said, neither of them are really long range weapons. They may be what you have, but there are without a doubt many better choices. A 308 is not a long range weapon either, unless your target is made from paper. Good practice weapon, yes. But for use on game, one should use something better.

Of course in the last 15 years some new VLD bullets have been added to the 308 lineup where no such movement is afoot with 8mm. I do have several boxes of 196gr Hornady match bullets with a BC of 0.525. Compared to a 150gr 308 Hornady IB bullet (polymer tip, boat tail) which has a BC of 0.415 the 196gr is still looking decent. But compared to a 185gr VLD on 308 cal one is back to a BC of 0.549.

Its a decent cartridge with poor component support in the US, basically no decent US factory ammo and it is hardly a good long range cartridge. But fun for training and relatively inexpensive to reload provided you stay within its limitations. Its also perfectly good as a hunting rifle, within its limitations, just like a 308 or a 30-06...

 

[gohring3006]

The 8x57 can do anything a 30-06 can do. That said, neither of them are really long range weapons. They may be what you have, but there are without a doubt many better choices. A 308 is not a long range weapon either, unless your target is made from paper. Good practice weapon, yes. But for use on game, one should use something better.

Of course in the last 15 years some new VLD bullets have been added to the 308 lineup where no such movement is afoot with 8mm. I do have several boxes of 196gr Hornady match bullets with a BC of 0.525. Compared to a 150gr 308 Hornady IB bullet (polymer tip, boat tail) which has a BC of 0.415 the 196gr is still looking decent. But compared to a 185gr VLD on 308 cal one is back to a BC of 0.549.

Its a decent cartridge with poor component support in the US, basically no decent US factory ammo and it is hardly a good long range cartridge. But fun for training and relatively inexpensive to reload provided you stay within its limitations. Its also perfectly good as a hunting rifle, within its limitations, just like a 308 or a 30-06...

All I'm am saying is there are better/higher BC bullets for the .30 vs. 8mm the hornady match bullet for the 8mm BC .525 is about the best you can get right now. But getting a 215 berger BC .696 or 208 Amax BC .648 to 2600 fps is a way better configuration for long range work. It would bust a deer at 1000yards...

 

[MudRunner2005]

I guess nobody knows squat about 1891 Mausers.......

 

[westcliffe01]

Mudrunner, it does not make financial sense building a rifle on a WW2 action anymore. It is much cheaper and you end up with a product with better resale if you build off a current Savage action. Next step up the ladder would be using a Rem 700 action without blueprinting it and after that a custom action (High quality Rem 700 clone).

The 8x57 I currently own is based on a Savage 270 Win (long action). I got a basic rifle for under $200 (used) but compared to a mauser action I did not have to forge the bolt handle to clear a scope or do any gunsmithing to fit a scope base. Needless to say, the accutrigger is a lot better than a mauser trigger too. I got an 8x57 1:10 twist Shillen barrel for the usual price ($339) varmint contour in 416 stainless with a lapped bore. Of course it shoots really nice compared to the *** Remington 700 "classic" i bought previously for quite a lot of money that was chambered in 8x57 and a total disappointment.

 

[gohring3006]

I guess nobody knows squat about 1891 Mausers.......

I think the 91 was the reason for the 98, it was a weak action so Mauser improved it with the 98.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Mudrunner, it does not make financial sense building a rifle on a WW2 action anymore. It is much cheaper and you end up with a product with better resale if you build off a current Savage action. Next step up the ladder would be using a Rem 700 action without blueprinting it and after that a custom action (High quality Rem 700 clone).

The 8x57 I currently own is based on a Savage 270 Win (long action). I got a basic rifle for under $200 (used) but compared to a mauser action I did not have to forge the bolt handle to clear a scope or do any gunsmithing to fit a scope base. Needless to say, the accutrigger is a lot better than a mauser trigger too. I got an 8x57 1:10 twist Shillen barrel for the usual price ($339) varmint contour in 416 stainless with a lapped bore. Of course it shoots really nice compared to the *** Remington 700 "classic" i bought previously for quite a lot of money that was chambered in 8x57 and a total disappointment.

Thanks, but I know the ins and outs of the modern custom rifle realm (built 6 of them in 2014). And I will never own a Savage...I'm 700 to the core. I was just curious if anyone knows if the 1891 Mauser's reputation was undeserved fear-mongering, or not. I have heard both ways. As I have never built a custom on a Mauser before, I was curious. Even Chuck Hawks seems to think the weak rumors are false. Which is what sparked my curiosity. Plus, I can probably get the action for $50.00... Which also spurred me on.

 

[morcey2]

I have more 8x57 guns than any other chambering by a LOOOOOONG shot. I think it's one of the most underrated rounds out there. SAAMI didn't do it any favors either. I have a load/rifle that shoots MOA* with 200 gr NP @ 2600 fps that I wouldn't hesitate to use on anything up to elk out to 400 yards. But that's about as far as I'd go personally, at least for hunting. The trajectory is "steep" enough that any error in range is magnified.

For paper punching, I don't see any reason an SMK, Nosler CC, or Hornady HPBT couldn't do 1000 yards. At 2600 fps muzzle velocity, they'd all remain supersonic beyond 1000 yards. I doubt it would be competition-level, but it would be fun and completely feasible to ring steel at 1000 yards from the right rifle. (I'm hoping to try it soon. )

Matt

*I realize that an MOA-shooting rifle isn't great for long range hunting, but this is in a surplus sporterized spanish M44 with the original barrel. It works for me.

 

[Jerrywoo]

I don't know but I shot a coastal brown with my gewhr 98 made in 1917 by cg hainel..400 yd head shot off the back of my house boat in Alaska..killed it no problem..I didn't have any choice in the matter..it was fixing to eat one of my buddies that couldn't get the inflatable started..the 8/57 isn't any joke if paired with a decent scope and "real" ammunition..the crap we buy in the states is lame..and for a reason..the old ww2 wildcatters had a bad taste in their mouths.. according to them the 8/57 could only approximate an 06 round when handloaded..I'm here to say..with proper bullets..decent rifilings..good glass bedded
stock..an old milsurp mouser rifle shoots just as good as any model 70 Winchester..you can probably load an 06 up a little hotter but the strength of the large ring mouser action surpasses most Americans made actions..and as far as the 308 winch..not even in the same category as an 8/57..not even close..after you fire form your shells you have a **** fine hunting companion in the 8/57..you have to order components from Europe to realize it's full potential..I've been buying military surplus ammo just for decent components..s&b has some ready fire ammo that is pretty good..but some of the guys posting on here are right about the availability of almost any kind of tailored round you want to develop with the 30 cal..can't get around that

 

[Jerrywoo]

You want something that will really reach out and touch someone..I've got a Yugo 8/57 chambered in 300 Norma mag necked to 8mm..323..I can develop hand loads in that thing that would destroy a Winchester action..that thing is by far all you would need on this continent..and it would safely take most African game..in the hands of an accomplished marksman anything in the world

 

[Frog4aday]

@Jerrywoo, that is all great info. But OP was inquiring as to suitability of the 8x57 for LONG RANGE use. Nobody is bad-mouthing the round or disagreeing that it is a fine hunting cartridge. The point being made is that there aren't high BC projectiles in the .318/.323 diameter. That limits the cartridge's long range hunting applications somewhat. Not attacking anyone's sacred cow here. Shoot what you like & like what you shoot. Namaste.

 

[Jerrywoo]

@Jerrywoo, that is all great info. But OP was inquiring as to suitability of the 8x57 for LONG RANGE use. Nobody is bad-mouthing the round or disagreeing that it is a fine hunting cartridge. The point being made is that there aren't high BC projectiles in the .318/.323 diameter. That limits the cartridge's long range hunting applications somewhat. Not attacking anyone's sacred cow here. Shoot what you like & like what you shoot. Namaste.

You are correct..the 06 is a fine round also but none of the old larger cal military rounds are all that good for long range hunting..the 8/57 is no exception..196 grain boat tail match bullet comes about the closest but it depends on whether or not your rifle can stabilize the bullet..the round itself isn't what actually impresses me it can be improved on..it's the action and workmanship of the large ring mousers..you can wildcat just about any magnum round into 8mm and not have to worry about the integrity of the mouser action or breach..very well engineered..made to last several centuries or more

 

[Jerrywoo]

The 318 has been obsolete for 50 yrs now..I haven't seen one of those in decades..my buddy accidentally bought a civilian market mouser from around ww1.5 and although it was a beautiful gun he ended up re barreling it to 338 cal because it was the 318 ..I think it was an 88-97 right before they started making 98s..