Usually on the giving end of advice...need help

[Bang4theBuck]

If you take the expander out how much you got, I would be afraid to try. 005

Sherm, you're saying remove the expander ball from the decapper and size like that and see how much neck tension I get?

 

[L.Sherm]

Sherm, you're saying remove the expander ball from the decapper and size like that and see how much neck tension I get?

Yes sir.

 

[L.Sherm]

Try to pick out some brass that has uniform thickness.

 

[Jester896]

could it be the inside of the neck? I often get a little donut necking .270WSM to 6.5. An expanding mandral and an inside reamer takes care of it for me.

 

[Dmagna]

I ran into the same issues with RL26 in the 6.5x284 Norma. It didn't like that powder, I had a lot better numbers with retumbo and rl23. Seems like 26 always has a flier too, I use a 210 with 58 grains of retumbo and it doesn't have an issue with es or sd. But I also didn't have issues with a 215 either.

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

I'd think about rl22 or h4831 with a wlr or 215... Bullet choice shouldn't matter much as long as she's accurate for ya. I'd either not neck turn or skim turn for consistency. You are right at 6-06/ 240 Roy capacity... A mild lr primer like the br2 and slow powder will not be the best for getting things going, especially in cold temps.. Heck, I've loaded thousands of 243's with 215's. I use standard primers too, but I'm not shy at all about flipping to a wlrm or 215 if the situation seems to need it.

 

[Bang4theBuck]

I definitely got some good feedback from the group, as usual. And we even avoided that one person who couldn't resist telling me that my cartridge choice was poor and that his was better, so a definite win. I am going to do the following:
1. Using one of the middle of the road loads that shot decently accurate, I am going to load a couple strings with 215s (don't have 210s) just to shake up the combination and see if that was the issue.
2. I am going to find a way to load a couple strings with increased neck tension (.005-.006" total neck tension) definately going to try using the dienwithout the expander ball first to achieve that.
3. I'm going to load a couple of strings of H1000 with 215s
4. I'm going to check the local gun store for some other primer choices (bracing for impact on price).
5. Going to report back on my results.

Thanks for the feedback so far.

 

[AZShooter]

I have had five 6mm-284s in various configurations.

Own a reamer that has a .277" chamber neck. I turn the necks for a .006" total neck release clearance. (.003" per side) The brass is 6.5-284 Lapua turned neck wall thickness is .014" Loaded brass neck OD is .271"

I use Fed 210 match primers with all of those 6mm-284s

As for powder with 105-107 gr bullets I had my best results with Retumbo and RL-33.

===========================

Randy Derks set a world record many years ago. (certain he has been beaten but at the time iw was remarkable) He was using RL-22!
54 grains of Reloader 22 - Federal 210m primer - Sierra 107 grain Match King bullet - 3425 fps

===================

I agree you turned your lapua neck wall thicknesses too thin. Large difference between chamber and loaded neck OD which would result in over working the brass, requiring frequent annealing or they would crack prematurely. Neck tension can't be increased much as thin brass doesn't have much tensile strength.

Did you also turn the Pederson brass? If so, to what dimension? Do you know size of the chamber neck? Trying to give you some things to consider.


What velocity are you getting with your 26" barrel with each bullet? There isn't much load data out the maybe you are over the top?

Now you have more things to consider.

Maybe ignore the ES spread and shoot the rifle at 600 yards and see how it does.

 

[Lee7588]

So, I built a custom 6x284 with a 26' carbon barrel. The rifle is showing lots of promise on the accuracy front with the reloads, but I am getting velocity spreads that are well outside the norm as compared to all of my other reloads. I have tried 3 different bullets, and two different batches of brass. Looking for the "smoking gun' reason why the spreads are so high.
Started with Lapua 6.5x284 brass necked down to 6x284, then neck turned. While I was trying to just skim turn them, I managed to reduce the neck thickness to .011". After firing, the necks had expanded around .010" over the loaded outside dimension. Assuming that was my problem with velocity consistency, I canned that brass and bought new petersen brass and necked it down to 6x284. Still I am getting some very high extreme spreads (40-65 fps).
I am using RL26, BR2 primers and I've shot Berger Hunting Hybrids, Hornady ELDX and Hammer hunters. All with the same high extreme spreads. I've meticulously checked and rechecked my powder weights, checked all the necks for concentricity, verified good primer seating, etc.

I am wondering if this charge of powder and primer combo are a little incompatible? Woukd moving up to a magnum primer help? Is this common woth the first firing of a necked down case to be this way?

Thoughts?

Are the speeds different from published speeds or from previous 6x284 you have built? If different from published speeds, are barrels the same length? Cooler weather can give higher speeds and elevation will play a factor? Are you see pressure signs?

 

[Bang4theBuck]

I have had five 6mm-284s in various configurations.

Own a reamer that has a .277" chamber neck. I turn the necks for a .006" total neck release clearance. (.003" per side) The brass is 6.5-284 Lapua turned neck wall thickness is .014" Loaded brass neck OD is .271"

I use Fed 210 match primers with all of those 6mm-284s

As for powder with 105-107 gr bullets I had my best results with Retumbo and RL-33.

===========================

Randy Derks set a world record many years ago. (certain he has been beaten but at the time iw was remarkable) He was using RL-22!
54 grains of Reloader 22 - Federal 210m primer - Sierra 107 grain Match King bullet - 3425 fps

===================

I agree you turned your lapua neck wall thicknesses too thin. Large difference between chamber and loaded neck OD which would result in over working the brass, requiring frequent annealing or they would crack prematurely. Neck tension can't be increased much as thin brass doesn't have much tensile strength.

Did you also turn the Pederson brass? If so, to what dimension? Do you know size of the chamber neck? Trying to give you some things to consider.


What velocity are you getting with your 26" barrel with each bullet? There isn't much load data out the maybe you are over the top?

Now you have more things to consider.

Maybe ignore the ES spread and shoot the rifle at 600 yards and see how it does.

I did not turn the necks on the peterden brass.
The chamber neck is .276" and .100 freebore.
With 108 ELDM bullet I got 3456 on the ladder with pressure signs. At 3410....no pressure.

With 88 grain hammer hunters I got 3600 on the ladder with significant spike in pressure and velocity at the top 3 charges. 3525, no pressure.

With 105 Berger Hybrid I got 3512 with mild pressure, 3450 without pressure.

Looking again at the data, it seems that each 4 or 5 shot group has a single outlier that is driving the ESs up. The attached pics show decent ESs if I delete the outlier. Not exactly the right way to do it, but might be another clue.

 

[Harry Knutz]

So, I built a custom 6x284 with a 26' carbon barrel. The rifle is showing lots of promise on the accuracy front with the reloads, but I am getting velocity spreads that are well outside the norm as compared to all of my other reloads. I have tried 3 different bullets, and two different batches of brass. Looking for the "smoking gun' reason why the spreads are so high.
Started with Lapua 6.5x284 brass necked down to 6x284, then neck turned. While I was trying to just skim turn them, I managed to reduce the neck thickness to .011". After firing, the necks had expanded around .010" over the loaded outside dimension. Assuming that was my problem with velocity consistency, I canned that brass and bought new petersen brass and necked it down to 6x284. Still I am getting some very high extreme spreads (40-65 fps).
I am using RL26, BR2 primers and I've shot Berger Hunting Hybrids, Hornady ELDX and Hammer hunters. All with the same high extreme spreads. I've meticulously checked and rechecked my powder weights, checked all the necks for concentricity, verified good primer seating, etc.

I am wondering if this charge of powder and primer combo are a little incompatible? Woukd moving up to a magnum primer help? Is this common woth the first firing of a necked down case to be this way?

Thoughts?

Did you turn the necks on the Peterson Brass? I know you said you turned them on the Lapua brass but turned to much off and threw them away. If you did not turn the peterson brass your necks are too thick and that is most likely your problem. If you cant slide a bullet inside of a fired case with no resistance your necks are too tight. When seating your bullets does it seem like it takes a lot more pressure to seat them than you are used too?

 

[Marine sniper]

In general you will find the 210 to be more consistent that the 215's as far as ES, for sure try the 215's but keep an eye out for any other large rifle primer you can find to test. Way, and I mean way too much is made out of "magnum" primers. I use 210's in my 338 Lapua Improved (98 grains of H1000) and have never had a problem- even in cold weather.

There is a lot of consistency to be found in primers.

 

[Bang4theBuck]

Did you turn the necks on the Peterson Brass? I know you said you turned them on the Lapua brass but turned to much off and threw them away. If you did not turn the peterson brass your necks are too thick and that is most likely your problem. If you cant slide a bullet inside of a fired case with no resistance your necks are too tight. When seating your bullets does it seem like it takes a lot more pressure to seat them than you are used too?

The plot thickens!

The bullets seat like butter....no issues. My loaded outside case neck dimension is .274" with the Petersen Brass. As stated above, my neck is reamed at .276", netting a .002" clearance fit. Might be low.

The lapua brass that got over-turned measures .0115 to .012.
The Petersen that is unturned measures .0155 to .016" both measured with a ball-end micrometer.

Seems possible that I am at opposite ends of the spectrum here with neck thickness. One problem is, if I turn much off of my petersen brass, the die is not going to act upon it sufficiently, using the expander ball If I go without using the expander ball it might be fine.

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

The plot thickens!

The bullets seat like butter....no issues. My loaded outside case neck dimension is .274" with the Petersen Brass. As stated above, my neck is reamed at .276", netting a .002" clearance fit. Might be low.

The lapua brass that got over-turned measures .0115 to .012.
The Petersen that is unturned measures .0155 to .016" both measured with a ball-end micrometer.

Seems possible that I am at opposite ends of the spectrum here with neck thickness. One problem is, if I turn much off of my petersen brass, the die is not going to act upon it sufficiently, using the expander ball If I go without using the expander ball it might be fine.

As far as neck thickness/ clearance, I've never worried one iota about it as long as I can put a bullet into the neck on a fired case without a seater die and it's not sloppy either... If you can get to just looser than a slip fit you should be good.