Survivability of Remington ???

[Deleted member 103481]

I just hope we don't lose AAC. Having Remington and Marlin back as reasonable companies would be very nice. After looking at new 870s and dealing with current Remington customer service I have little sympathy.

 

[Pdvdh]

Other firearm manufacturers seem to be doing well. Guess that tells the story. Remington is as big as any. Yet they can't make ends meet?
Their business plan of management must really suck.

 

[werth338]

Agreed. Have to wonder how much Cerabus has to do with that? I hope Remington and all other Freedom Group companies continue on and get stronger.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

But them "continuing" on would be on the back of Government Bankruptcy protections.
Essentially washing clean all the millions and millions they owe to vendors and subcontractors.
So Remington continues because of the too big to fail mentality but the subcontracted machine shops they owe hundreds of thousands to has to close its' doors, the alloy vendor they owe millions to has to close its' doors????
At what cost do we keep companies in business at the cost of other companies just because the "Big" company employs more people?

From a business perspective..this is just the beginning of the tide.
Orbital ATK is dumping Vista Outdoors Brands...so how long before some of the companies controlled under Vista Outdoors brands go up for independent sale or bankruptcy protection?

Sincerely,
THEIS

 

[Deleted member 103481]

I'm not a fan but filing for bankruptcy does not mean they get a clean slate. Chapter 11 involves repayment of debt and/after restructure.

 

[THEIS]

I'm not a fan but filing for bankruptcy does not mean they get a clean slate. Chapter 11 involves repayment of debt and/after restructure.

Yep and that restructure will be negotiated by lawyers and legal system for long enough that the other smaller companies will be forced to closed down anyways....
Subcontracted machine shops and vendors are going to loose enough money that they would not be able to remain in business while waiting on legal system to determine how much of their money does get paid (when it gets paid).

Sincerely,
THEIS

 

[Deleted member 103481]

You are of the opinion they would get that money sooner if the company closed the doors tomorrow?

 

[werth338]

I hope people didn't take my comments as being pro Chapter 11 as that is not the case. If the services have been performed, they should be paid for no matter what. I was trying to point out that Cerabus is most likely a large part of this collapse. Too big too fail is dangerous in an part of the world.

 

[THEIS]

You are of the opinion they would get that money sooner if the company closed the doors tomorrow?

Hi,
NOPE...I am at the opinion of them continuing under the bankruptcy protection will just allow them to do it again to other vendors and subcontractors.

If the company cannot pay its rightful bills then it should close, not be protected and allowed to do it again. It should not be allowed to continue just because of the amount of people it employs.
Sincerely,
THEIS

 

[Deleted member 48126]

Hi,
NOPE...I am at the opinion of them continuing under the bankruptcy protection will just allow them to do it again to other vendors and subcontractors.

If the company cannot pay its rightful bills then it should close, not be protected and allowed to do it again. It should not be allowed to continue just because of the amount of people it employs.
Sincerely,
THEIS

Can they just sell? I'm not familiar with any of this. Someone purchases them, they take that money and pay off their contractors and suppliers? Then the company gets a fresh start with new leadership?

...I made that sound way easier than it is...gross oversimplification.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

That depends 300.....it would all depend on how and what type of sell/purchase it was.
It could be sold including its' debt or not including its' debt.
It could be sold including company assets or not including its' assets.
It could be sold with nothing more than the Brand name, trademarks, and IP rights.

Depending on how it would be sold would depend on if and how fast the contractors and suppliers could recover "some" of what is owed to them.

Sincerely,
THEIS

 

[Riflehunter1776]

cerberus and their business model destroyed Remington. You can't rape a business with a great, established name, exploit that name to sell a product which is deliberately lower quality that the same thing made 10 years before, and then hope to sell the corpse of that company after everything of value has been looted out of it. Nothing good comes of that plan, except for the looters.

 

[Riflehunter1776]

I don't want to see them go tits up , I want them to pull their heads out of each other's a-holes and realize that a wood stocked 30-06 that shoots 3 MOA isn't enough to carry the company.

I don't think that 3 moa shooting, wood stocked 30-06's were Remington's main product for many many years.

And say what you will about remington (and they are some of the most accurate production rifles ever made) but they always looked nice......imagine how ugly the world would be if the only rifles out there were Savages.

 

[re5513]

It may be that the most valuable thing Remington will be left with is their brand though there may be more equity in other names like Colt. Perhaps potential investors suspected this was a likely outcome after Cerberus pulled their money allowing them to bide their time and be able to pick and choose for pennies on the dollar.