Springfield Waypoint bad groups troubleshoot help?

[TurboD]

Just an update. I got my rifle back the first time and it shot better. Within the 3/4 MOA guarantee when cold. BUT, the rifle would shoot 1-2 MOA after a little bit of warmth in the barrel (5-10 shots in moderate succession). I emphasize the barrel was warm, not hot.

Springfield took the rifle back and assured me that their tech fired 20 rounds through the rifle in rapid succession and their next group was within 3/4 MOA. Having shot over 100 rounds through the rifle and never having the same experience myself, I called BS.

After some back and forth with their warranty rep, they offered to send me the same rifle back with an all-steel barrel... Not acceptable given the price difference between what I bought and what they offered me. After explaining to the rep why taking a cheaper rifle back after the 3-4 months total the rifle had been in Springfield's possession was not going to work for me, I got them to agree to send me a brand new rifle in 6.5 PRC.

So now, I am in the queue for the new rifle to come off the production line. Hopefully, the third time is the charm.

 

[Quintus]

Sounds like they are working with you to make it good, but man what a hassle! I was anxious to try one of these. I have two Weatherby rifles with the BSF barrel and they are impressive. Very consistent, clean easily, and will shoot 5 rounds without starting to walk. I am interested to see how the PRC shoots. Good luck!

 

[WYMIKE]

Is there any information on the bullet/load that Springfield tech used in checking rifle.? Of all the ammo mentioned in this posting the Hornady ammunition in 143 ELD-X and 147 grain ELD-M was never tried. I would be curious to see the velocities on different load fired from this rifle. In post number one the center picture indicates a resonable group with that ammuntion. In my shooting of 6.5 PRC's and 6.5 Creedmoors which is dozens the Hornady Match ammunition is the best for MOA accuracy 75% of the time.

 

[Jon Bischof]

I just looked at the price for a 6.5 PRC Waypoint with Carbon barrel. Wow! First thought that came to my mind was "Why a Springfield?" I thought, well, since it is a carbon barrel it must be way lighter than what I have. No, 6 lbs 14 oz isn't lighter than my rifle. Plus, there are a lot of other rifles with MOA Guarantees that have a proven record. So, Why a Springfield?

I hope this new Waypoint shoots way sub sub MOA for you, TurboD. So I don't want to be a jerk, but still don't understand given the choices, Why a Springfield?

 

[Starbuck]

Glad to hear they're working with you. I've heard some good feedback from a couple of guys I know who have them. I hope you get it squared away and are happy. Thanks for updating the thread.

I feel your pain. In the end, finicky rifles suck. Years ago I'd do my best with all the usual tricks to coax accuracy from different rigs. These days I prefer to mess with set ups that aren't picky.

 

[Coldfinger]

I was loading for a Waypoint 2021 in 6.5 Creedmoor. It wouldn't shoot at all and was very erratic with grouping. I finally took the scope off and put my nightforce on there and it shot 1/2" groups. I was using a Leupold VX5HD. Sent it back to leupold and one of the lenses inside was loose and moving. They fixed it and sent it back to me on Friday. Havnt gotten to remount it yet.

I'm surprised they admitted a problem. I seem to get the note that scope tests fine and I'm an idiot for wasting their time, but the scope magically works again. Big L never again.

 

[Teri Anne]

Just an update. I got my rifle back the first time and it shot better. Within the 3/4 MOA guarantee when cold. BUT, the rifle would shoot 1-2 MOA after a little bit of warmth in the barrel (5-10 shots in moderate succession). I emphasize the barrel was warm, not hot.

Springfield took the rifle back and assured me that their tech fired 20 rounds through the rifle in rapid succession and their next group was within 3/4 MOA. Having shot over 100 rounds through the rifle and never having the same experience myself, I called BS.

After some back and forth with their warranty rep, they offered to send me the same rifle back with an all-steel barrel... Not acceptable given the price difference between what I bought and what they offered me. After explaining to the rep why taking a cheaper rifle back after the 3-4 months total the rifle had been in Springfield's possession was not going to work for me, I got them to agree to send me a brand new rifle in 6.5 PRC.

So now, I am in the queue for the new rifle to come off the production line. Hopefully, the third time is the charm.

I know that everyone here knows the importance of good ammo, especially tuned to the gun. I had, and actually still have a rifle student who is moving on to more precision target shooting as well as hunting. She is using my Winchester Model 70 (post 64) .308 . I let my students shoot my rifles so that they can get a feel for the differences between rifles when trying to choose something for themselves. This particular rifle has been shooting sub MOA groups for more years than I care to admit using my hand loads. She was buying commercial ammo of all different types from 150 to 180 to include the 165 and 168 gr that this particular rifle loves. Anyway she was having difficulty getting anywhere close to MOA with anything that she bought. I was finally able to find some IMR 4895 and loaded up some ammo using her once fired Federal Premium cases, Federal 215 primers and 40.5 gr of IMR 4895 and some Nosler 168 gr HPBT match bullets. This is something that I know that this rifle likes. We went to the range with her not being very confident in her rifle shooting abilities based on what she had been able to do with the commercial ammo. The first 3 shot group she fired with this ammo was 0.7 MOA, the second 0.8 MOA and the third group one ragged hole from 3 rounds hitting with a 0.3 MOA group essentially all three shots in the same hole. She was amazed and had gained back confidence in her ability to shoot. She also now appreciates the differences in ammo and the advantages of reloading and tuning the loads to the rifle. Yes, she is now a reloading student as well as shooting student.

I don't get excited if a rifle doesn't shoot well out of the box with commercial ammo. My Browning 300 WM was a prime example. After the first 20 rounds the inside of the barrel through the bore scope resembled a gold mine along it's entire 26 inch length. If I had been smart I would have returned the rifle to Browning in that condition. I'm pretty sure I would have got a new barrel out of it. The hangup is that I had a custom muzzle brake installed and while Browning probably would have probably replaced the barrel I doubt that they would have reinstalled the non Browning muzzle brake. Anyway it has taken over 200 rounds and a lot of cleaning before the bore got burnished in enough not to rip the copper jackets as they went down the barrel. It's a hunting rifle and currently shoots right at 1 MOA which works for me.

 

[TurboD]

For those who are curious, Springfield sent me that brand-new rifle in 6.5 PRC. The firing pin sheered off entirely by round 24. I am never buying another product from them again. They've agreed to give me my money back.

 

[Teri Anne]

For those who are curious, Springfield sent me that brand-new rifle in 6.5 PRC. The firing pin sheered off entirely by round 24. I am never buying another product from them again. They've agreed to give me my money back.View attachment 440553

While I don't know the entire story here, it seems a bit extreme to swear off a manufacturer based on one problem. If I gave up on a firearm simply based on a broken firing pin there would have been quite a few over the past 60 years that would have gone by the wayside instead of replacing a firing pin, which in most cases is pretty cheap and easy to replace I would have missed out on many years of fun shooting those firearms.

 

[Jon Bischof]

My original question was "Why a Springfield?" Never mind.

 

[M1A1ABRAMS]

For those who are curious, Springfield sent me that brand-new rifle in 6.5 PRC. The firing pin sheered off entirely by round 24. I am never buying another product from them again. They've agreed to give me my money back.View attachment 440553

Dang I just read the whole thread. It's been almost a year. At least you're getting your money back. I know it doesn't help with the cost of ammo spent & time invested. But you may still come out a happy camper with your next purchase.

 

[Starbuck]

Thanks for sharing. That's a real bummer. At least they are giving you your money back.

I had heard a few good things about them, but now I'd be a little leary.

Such as it is, they don't make them in LH, and I'm not keen on accumulating any more 700's or clones, so they weren't too high on my radar anyhoo. Been using and building on LH Tikkas for a few years now and I haven't been disappointed yet.

 

[rkwjunior]

I just got my Waypoint in 308. Carbon Barrel. Adjustable Stock.
Never shot a bolt action in my life, let alone for groupings.
First time out, these were my best groups.
Federal GMM 168gr.
You cant go wrong with the street price of little over 1900$.

 

[Jon Bischof]

For those who are curious, Springfield sent me that brand-new rifle in 6.5 PRC. The firing pin sheered off entirely by round 24. I am never buying another product from them again. They've agreed to give me my money back.View attachment 440553

I am very happy to see that you have come to the only right conclusion. Lots of companies making promises they have no intention of keeping. Truth is, you bought the wrong rifle and it is not your fault. Lots of folks encouraging bad buys.

Like every other venue or media, the internet is always behind the curve; always a year or two behind reality. Whenever I try to help folks here with what I have learned the hard way by experience, trial and error, I find it hard to overcome the avalanche of hype already out there about how this or that is great, so that folks are confused or won't listen because their are just too many voices screaming.

Some folks still believe they can't go wrong if they go with the hype and spend more money (because more expensive has to be better, right?). You can show them real groups on paper and they still won't believe it and so they throw money at the goal, hoping that will get them better performance. You buy a more expensive rifle thinking it must be better because it is more expensive. Wrong!

Marketing genuises have learned that if you can't sell a product for under a $1,000 because no one wants it; all you have to do is slap a $2500 price tag on it and people will beat your door down to buy it for $2200 and think that they are getting a bargain. It is still the same junk you couldn't sell for $1,000; all you did was up the price and fools fell over themselves trying to get it before someone else did.

Not saying Springfield is a bad company. I own a Springfield. I'm just saying that is the technique the buyer must watch out for.
Look at the freaking holes in the paper beyond 100 yards before you buy your next rifle.