Sig wins contract with the 277 fury

[340Wby-4-everything]

The 277 bi-metal case is rated at 80,000 psi.
Couldn't get a 277 fury. So I used the case necked down to 6.5 Creedmoor, with a donor rifle to sacrifice. Been checking for lug set back, and barrel wear. But this case really improves the velocities of the 6.5 Creedmoor and 308. A dangerous endeavor, and do not do it, according to the manufacturers, the bi-metal cases are not to reloaded. But I did for this experiment. The 6.5 ,Creedmoor will run 150 SMK at 3050 fps...backed off to 3000 fps and ran a bunch...reloaded them 3 times, so far no lose primer pockets no case head swipes. Fireformed a bunch more today with 140 gr averaged around 3124 fps for all 15 rds. 147 eldm were runing 3039 average fps on fireforming. Much faster than the brass cases 6.5 Creedmoor at 2600 fps...to maybe 2800 with the right powders. In the same barrel. Bi- metal cases at high pressure add performance...but at what cost. This is my personal experiment, not recommended by any manufacturer. But I hope they the bugs worked out of the accidental discharge, trigger problem, and longer barrels available. Although a 16" light 277 hunting rifle would be a nice back country hunting tool.

So am I to read from what you wrote that this 277 Sig case is exactly the same dimensions as a 6.5 needmore? It is not. Or did you mean you necked it down to a 6.5 Fury and then rechamber a donor needmore to fit the 51mm case? Needmore is a cartridge, not a caliber just the same as a .264WM and a 6.5PRC are cartridges, not calibers. So unless you somehow found some .277x 48s or you were able to squeeze a steel, brass and aluminum case body down from 51mm to 48mm, then you didn't neck it down to a 6.5, you necked a 277 Fury down to a 6.5 Fury. Please clue me in if I am wrong with this assertion.

 

[VinceMule]

A reamer print would be a good thing to see!

 

[44-40]

So am I to read from what you wrote that this 277 Sig case is exactly the same dimensions as a 6.5 needmore? It is not. Or did you mean you necked it down to a 6.5 Fury and then rechamber a donor needmore to fit the 51mm case? Needmore is a cartridge, not a caliber just the same as a .264WM and a 6.5PRC are cartridges, not calibers. So unless you somehow found some .277x 48s or you were able to squeeze a steel, brass and aluminum case body down from 51mm to 48mm, then you didn't neck it down to a 6.5, you necked a 277 Fury down to a 6.5 Fury. Please clue me in if I am wrong with this assertion.

They are not the same, the 6.8X 51 has to be reformed into the smaller 6.5 Creedmoor. I like the 6.8 X 51 mm case better than the Creedmoor case, it has more capacity and just necking it down to 6.5 mm with the orginial case is the best option, and have a reamer made by PT&G.
This would allow even more velocity. But even reformed to the smaller 6.5 Creedmoor, fireforming cases with chosen powder #2 hit a top velocity of 3156 fps with a 140 gr Nosler RDF in a 24" factory barreled 6.5 Creedmoor chamber. Remember these cases have Stainless steel heads, no brass case will take the pressure. The 277 fury has a low velocity factory brass case available also, but it's velocity is way down to standard 6.5 Creedmoor velocities..no advantage to there. Remember manufacturers do not recommend reloading these cases, only factory ammo is to be used, in factory chambered 277 Fury rifles.

 

[340Wby-4-everything]

They are not the same, the 6.8X 51 has to be reformed into the smaller 6.5 Creedmoor. I like the 6.8 X 51 mm case better than the Creedmoor case, it has more capacity and just necking it down to 6.5 mm with the orginial case is the best option, and have a reamer made by PT&G.
This would allow even more velocity. But even reformed to the smaller 6.5 Creedmoor, fireforming cases with chosen powder #2 hit a top velocity of 3156 fps with a 140 gr Nosler RDF in a 24" factory barreled 6.5 Creedmoor chamber. Remember these cases have Stainless steel heads, no brass case will take the pressure. The 277 fury has a low velocity factory brass case available also, but it's velocity is way down to standard 6.5 Creedmoor velocities..no advantage to there. Remember manufacturers do not recommend reloading these cases, only factory ammo is to be used, in factory chambered 277 Fury rifles.

Interesting. Thanks for the explanation. So it would be easy to turn it into a .308 case. That would be my pref, but that's cause I love the .308 Win and the .308 class of bullets in general (300 win and wby in particular) and I have not drank any needmore koolaid thus far. However, I will admit they have a place and I have a cousin that has a factory Tikka that shoots .20 MOA and better 100yd groups all day, so it is hard to argue with that kind of performance.

 

[cvixx]

I concur 100%, I have no interest in it what so ever

Think I will stick with my .270s. Already deaf.

 

[akmtnhnt]

Interesting. Thanks for the explanation. So it would be easy to turn it into a .308 case. That would be my pref, but that's cause I love the .308 Win and the .308 class of bullets in general (300 win and wby in particular) and I have not drank any needmore koolaid thus far. However, I will admit they have a place and I have a cousin that has a factory Tikka that shoots .20 MOA and better 100yd groups all day, so it is hard to argue with that kind of performance.

All you have to do to turn 277 fury into 308 is neck it to 308.

Of any of the easy wildcats you could make from this, I feel like 7mm would be the one of the best having some of the best bullet options out there without getting really heavy.

 

[lyle2231]

One thing always remember, "Your weapon was made by the low bidder " Something to think about. Just saying…

 

[44-40]

Interesting. Thanks for the explanation. So it would be easy to turn it into a .308 case. That would be my pref, but that's cause I love the .308 Win and the .308 class of bullets in general (300 win and wby in particular) and I have not drank any needmore koolaid thus far. However, I will admit they have a place and I have a cousin that has a factory Tikka that shoots .20 MOA and better 100yd groups all day, so it is hard to argue with that kind of performance.

Yes, the 308 from the 6.8x 51 is easy. Mandrel up run through 308 die, check COAL. Done ...
I am a 308 fan and have atleast 6 to choose from 18" to 30" barrels AR10 or bolt, with 12 to 8 twist...the #1 rifle and #1 load in the Krestrel is 200 gr SMK .715 bc g1 or .360 g7 2856 fps for the 308 Win and I have a bunch of capable cartridges, but the 308 win has done it for me for over 25 yrs of LR shooting, new components have improved its position. I only have 2 Creedmoors, and have used both cartridges in this experiment...but concentrating on the Creedmoor as a doner rifle, for the bulk of the experiment to check for accelerated barrel wear, as this has the only factory barrel, the rest have Bartlein and Proof barrels. This bi metal case improves the 6.5 Creedmoors position...alot...but at what cost...is it for me. I had actually given up on the 6.5 caliber as soon as the barrels and components are gone ...then I came across this new case development. I was personally going to cut calibers, 7mm is gone, 6.5 was next. I like the 6mm Dasher & 308 Win for most of the moderate LR shooting then the 300 RUM and 250 Atips for the rare extreme distances ...or the 50BMG for fun. Just ordered a 26" 7.5 twist 6.5 Bartlein barrel ..do I go 6.5 Creedmoor or get a PT&G reamer for a 6.5 Furry based on the bi-metal case. Should get 150 gr SMK 6.5 mm bullets .713 BC to 3200 fps.

 

[Brad Norman]

I'll keep my 260 and my barrel life. Thanks

It seems the .260 has fallen out of favor only because advertising hype has illuminated and glorified the 6.5 CM. In a properly-chambered rifle the .260 has a slight edge in performance but the two are essentially identical. I love my rifles chambered in .260 Rem and 6.5 Swede so haven't ever felt the need for a Creedmoor. Will this new Fury cartridge actually offer a significant increase in performance over them? I doubt it. The .277 Fury is certainly interesting but honestly, it has the same ballistics as a .270 Winchester, only in a shorter case with a shorter barrel. That's totally NOT a big deal to me. Time will tell if this technology develops into something with the non-military market. I agree with you Stilts!

 

[Lenny Foffa]

I agree with the question of will makers of sporting rifles make a special, actions and recoil lugs, and bolts to withstand the 80,000 pounds of pressure, repeatedly. I think that Throat and Barrel life will be somewhat reduced until the Rifle makers develop a steel that will withstand that new higher level of pressure, for at least 2000 rounds or hopefully more. On the other hand, if the ammo makers offer a reduced pressure and velocity "Sporting Load ", then that might detract from the desire to own one. If you own a .270 Weatherby Mag, or a .270 Win Short mag, and the new Fury Sporting Ammo ends up being 150 fps faster with 150 grn bullets , is that enough to make you run out and buy one?? Maybe!! Will the faster twist mean that the 170 grn class of . 277 bullets will be the choice?? Again, Maybe. Very Interesting new round . Exciting New Technology!!! In the Orthopedic implant industry, we would sometimes say we had a "Product in search of a Use" Perhaps what the 220 Swift was in 1960, the 277 Fury will be in 2023!! We will watch with great interest and learn!!

 

[akmtnhnt]

It seems the .260 has fallen out of favor only because advertising hype has illuminated and glorified the 6.5 CM. In a properly-chambered rifle the .260 has a slight edge in performance but the two are essentially identical. I love my rifles chambered in .260 Rem and 6.5 Swede so haven't ever felt the need for a Creedmoor. Will this new Fury cartridge actually offer a significant increase in performance over them? I doubt it. The .277 Fury is certainly interesting but honestly, it has the same ballistics as a .270 Winchester, only in a shorter case with a shorter barrel. That's totally NOT a big deal to me. Time will tell if this technology develops into something with the non-military market. I agree with you Stilts!

The 6.5CM has a 1-8 twist barrel. The 260 rems are 1-9. That's why the creedmore wins. Custom barrel and twist rate, then ya 260 rem. Though at this point why when creedmore barrels and brass are everywhere?
The 277 fury hybrid case mimics the 270wsm given equal barrel lengths. Just with a lot less powder and recoil. It outperforms the 270win by a good bit.

 

[akmtnhnt]

I agree with the question of will makers of sporting rifles make a special, actions and recoil lugs, and bolts to withstand the 80,000 pounds of pressure, repeatedly. I think that Throat and Barrel life will be somewhat reduced until the Rifle makers develop a steel that will withstand that new higher level of pressure, for at least 2000 rounds or hopefully more. On the other hand, if the ammo makers offer a reduced pressure and velocity "Sporting Load ", then that might detract from the desire to own one. If you own a .270 Weatherby Mag, or a .270 Win Short mag, and the new Fury Sporting Ammo ends up being 150 fps faster with 150 grn bullets , is that enough to make you run out and buy one?? Maybe!! Will the faster twist mean that the 170 grn class of . 277 bullets will be the choice?? Again, Maybe. Very Interesting new round . Exciting New Technology!!! In the Orthopedic implant industry, we would sometimes say we had a "Product in search of a Use" Perhaps what the 220 Swift was in 1960, the 277 Fury will be in 2023!! We will watch with great interest and learn!!

I just posted this 20 posts ago... but here goes again.

There's not a bolt action currently in production that can't handle this round from the action's perspective. If it couldn't, it wouldn't handle anything in a magnum bolt face.

Here's why that's true and how to calculate it. https://riflebarrels.com/a-look-at-bolt-lug-strength/

Also you don't have to guess on performance. It's published. Fast twist 270wsm in a 308 case.

I really don't get why people still think this thing is a mystery. You can buy the hybrid brass, the dies, a chambered pre-fit barrel from just about anyone or the reamer from the usual suspects. You can buy the loaded ammo from sig in hybrid or all brass. And this has all been true for a year or better now. You can go on youtube and see people shoot it through custom bolt guns and the spear. Through cronos. Out to 1k or more. FMJs through armor.

 

[DavidA]

Is there something wrong with 277 bullets haha? Most places have the reamers these days. Unless you already have a 260 rem...

I already have a 260 rem and a 308. I could just neck it up to 308. That would really wake up my 308 rounds as well.

 

[DavidA]

My 260 rem is a 1-8 twist 26" barrel on a Defiance Mach Deviant Tact action . It would be a hoot. Probably get 3,150 out of a 150 Sierra SMK