Shooting 100 yds vs. 400 yds

[gohring3006]

As a fairly ignorant hack of a shooter who's trying to learn, this is the most helpful and succinct explanation of parrallax (and how/why to adjust the knob) that I've come across.

Thanks.

Go to the video library of this forum go to the long range pursuit/gunwerks look for there parralax video its very helpful to see this demonstrated....

 

[PokealypseNow]

Go to the video library of this forum go to the long range pursuit/gunwerks look for there parralax video its very helpful to see this demonstrated....

I'll go check that out this week. Thanks for the tip. Lots and lots to learn.

 

[Brad615]

Ridgerunner I will have to try that paralex adjustment you explained as I didn't know that, I would always set mine to the best clarity and although my groups would stay the same at 400 yds I did notice my poi would sometimes differ from where my 400 mark is set for. This seems to be an issue for me only on humid days though? To the gentlemen that mentioned your upcoming dall sheep hunt I will have to agree that you should try and reload if your looking for consistent groups vs factory ammo. I have tried every factory ammo under the sun and nothing compares to reloads. I'm currently shooting hole in a hole at 200 yds (1/4 inch group) & a 3/4-1 inch group at 400 yds using rl 22 with a 180 gr berger. Good luck to ya.
Ridgerunner please feel free to give me more insight on the paralex if you could! Thx

 

[lonzonoscar]

I appreciate everyone's comments to my original Thread. I am no expert, but based upon everyone's comments I would say I have three things to concentrate on: Parallax, reloading instead of factory ammo and possibly replacing my scope. My Leopold VX-6 2x-12x scope is a great scope, but it has no parallax adjustment. Also, the cross-hairs are a little large when trying to center on a 400 yard target. Brad615-You mentioned that you are shooting 3/4-1 inch groups at 400 yards. This seems almost super-human. What kind of scope are you using?

 

[Brad615]

Ionzonoscar
Im using a swarovski Z5 5-25x52 & I will say it is my favorite scope that I have ever used! Clarity is second to none, & in my opinion a scope is just if not more important than the gun it is mounted to. My set up is a remington model 700 sendero sfII in a 7mm rem mag with the sawrovski z5 mentioned above. I should also mention that I just started getting those superhuman groups (lol) once I switched to the rl22 powder as before I was using retumbo which was giving me 1-3 inch group at 200 & 3-4 inch group at 400 yds, which in my opinion was ok at 400 yds but I wasn't happy at 200 yds also it just didn't seem consistent to me at 200 yds as it would throw a bullet here & there at 200 yds. As my good friend who reloads reminds me once you find the harmonics of your gun it's lights out. gun)

 

[lonegunman762x51]

A 9" group at 400yds will still hit vitals. Recoil and a hot barrel might have something to do with your groups. I'd work on cold barrel 400yd shooting and shooting from off of a backpack, sticks or kneeling and prone supported.

Since you are shooting factory ammo and high quality ammo is expensive, I'd work on setting up and firing a three shot group from various positions with a cold gun and my hunting gear. Learning reloading from the ground up and developing a sub-moa load before you go on this trip might be a little tough.

When you mention the crosshairs being a bit large for your target, is the target you are shooting at similar in size to Dahl sheep vitals or a 2" spotter? I have a couple of different Leupold scopes and they all work fine and have nice clear optics.

Everybody on the internet shoots 1" groups at 400yds and reloads with a standard deviation of 5 or less FPS. Consider it the 9" wanger of shooting. My all time favorite from LRH is someone's comment that a 250gr bullet going 2850fps from a 338 Lapua has far better ballistics and drops far less than the exact same bullet going the exact same speed from a gun with the exact same twist barrel from the exact same builder only chambered in 338 RUM.


Just my opinion.

 

[ShootnMathews]

Everybody on the internet shoots 1" groups at 400yds and reloads with a standard deviation of 5 or less FPS.

And I always wonder how many of those shoot that group everytime or once. Pretty much most of my hunting guns shoot 1/2 Moa reliably. Yeah I have shot better groups with them but I don't call it a .1 Moa gun because it shot a group that size once. I once shot a 1 7/8" group at 750 yards with my mosin nagant. But I don't call it a 1/4 Moa gun. It only shoots 5/8-3/4 Moa reliably at that range. When shooting at something with lungs big enough to hide a basketball in you don't need to be able to hit a thumbtack at that range.

 

[varmintH8R]

I'd work on cold barrel 400yd shooting and shooting from off of a backpack, sticks or kneeling and prone supported.

I think this is excellent advice. Practice in a way that will replicate how you will shoot in the field. My personal experience has been that prone/field shooting is a whole different skill than bench shooting. Anymore I only bench shoot to prove out a load, after that it is 100% field positions. My max hunting range for each rifle own is based on that criteria.

Groups also mean much less than a accurate first shot when you are talking about a huge hike to drop a Dall!

Good luck

Brandon

 

[ShootnMathews]

I think this is excellent advice. Practice in a way that will replicate how you will shoot in the field. My personal experience has been that prone/field shooting is a whole different skill than bench shooting. Anymore I only bench shoot to prove out a load, after that it is 100% field positions. My max hunting range for each rifle own is based on that criteria.

Groups also mean much less than a accurate first shot when you are talking about a huge hike to drop a Dall!

Good luck

Brandon

+1. After load work is done I zero them off a bipod and shoot that way from then on. The length of the bipod so far does not seem to change poi. I have them from 9" to 30". One for any occasion

 

[CogburnR]

Things like grip on the stock, thumbing the stock , stock pressure, etc. will change bullet impact.

Try to develop a consistent form for each first shot. Practice for hunting is hitting the target with the first shot from a typical hunting position. A good hunting group might be shot over a period of days.

 

[WildRose]

You've gotten some good advice here.

Mirage should not be a problem with that scope.

Parallax is most likely the primary issue along with driver error.

Make sure you have a good, consistent mount each and every time with the rifle whether you are shooting from the bench, prone, kneeling, or any other position you are in.

Also the suggestion about your trigger is sound. Set it as light as you feel comfortable ad safe with.

Every shooter related type of error you an make is magnified greatly as the range increases. As a rule you can figure driver related errors double every hundred yards.

 

[budlight]

The majority of my hunting rifles have Harris tall bipods and slings because prone is rarely an option in grass and weeds. Prone bipods are pretty worthless in western sage brush. So I practice sitting and sling shooting...... This past weekend was varmint abatement for 4 days. Off the quad, sitting, freehand /sling or over a big rock. I even made a rock pile rest in preparation for an evening watering hole.

So I develop rounds with a chrono at the local bench rest range and then off to the real world

 

[bootsking]

Associated with parallax, if you do not have a consistent cheek weld this will still be a problem. You may need to build up a cheek-rest so when you mount the rifle you are always looking perfectly through the scope; use dense foam, etc and then cover it with a stock pack. As mentioned, practice shooting like you will hunt; I prefer prone with a bipod. And finally don't clean the barrel before your hunt or the clean-bore shot will not likely be on target; leave it fouled after you spend the time to get it sighted in perfectly.

 

[stanley52]

And I always wonder how many of those shoot that group everytime or once. Pretty much most of my hunting guns shoot 1/2 Moa reliably. Yeah I have shot better groups with them but I don't call it a .1 Moa gun because it shot a group that size once. I once shot a 1 7/8" group at 750 yards with my mosin nagant. But I don't call it a 1/4 Moa gun. It only shoots 5/8-3/4 Moa reliably at that range. When shooting at something with lungs big enough to hide a basketball in you don't need to be able to hit a thumbtack at that range.

This contradicts everything I know about mosins, which is limited I'll admit, but 5/8-3/4 MOA seems to be on the legendary side of the house when accuracy is concerned with that particular rifle. New trigger, new stock/bedded, sawed off barrel, drilled/tapped, etc? Or a brand new aftermarket barrel?