Seeking Advice on Long-Range, General-Use Binos:

[Comancheria]

Reviving my own moribund thread:

Duckhunter: Somehow, I missed your closing post on this thread. Wanted to say that I have already ordered the Alaska Guide Creations model for the el glass. But thanks anyway—as they say: "You never know."

Also, prior to cutting the final order, I whined and moaned around about weights—and came close to not buying the expensive and rather heavy fluid head. But in the final analysis, I decided it was the best option for my 12-plus pound .300 RUM. I did shave a little weight (and cost) by deselecting the machined Hog Saddle—which tips the scales at about a pound—and picking the plastic Triclawps. I know that almost always, fine machining is our friend—and plastic is not. We shall see.

Best regards,

Russ

 

[dfanonymous]

Folks,

Let me begin with the parameters of how I will be using the binoculars:
(1) They will be used for backpack hunting and/or hunting with a guide--all in the mountain
west
for mule deer, elk, and pronghorn.

(2) I will not be carrying a spotting scope or big spotting binoculars. I will be after a quality
buck, bull, or goat, but I am not going to be particularly picky--and couldn't handle the
weight anyway.

(3) The scope on my rifle will be a 5X25 power. I realize this is not intended for spotting, but
the top end is available in a pinch.

(4) I will be limiting my shots to an absolute maximum of 1,000 yards--and possibly "down" to
800 or even 600, depending on my experience with myself and my abilities as I get more
into long-range shooting and range practice.

I currently have two hunting binoculars:

(1) Swarovski 10X by 20 mm. Ultra-Light (10 oz)

(2) Leica 8X by 42 mm. (2 lbs 4 oz) (chosen as a compromise between western hunting and
seeing through the thick brush here in South Texas.)

I have used both out west and of course, my experience has been, as you might expect:

That while the little Swaros are a dream to carry, with excellent glass, the exit pupil makes
very difficult to glass for long periods.

The Leicas, though heavy--especially for an old fart that isn't getting any younger, are
magnificent beyond belief, and you can glass with them for hours.

I realize and accept that long-glassing will require more weight.

I have never experienced any known difficulty locating game with the 8 power Leicas--but
then, I have always limited my shots to 300 yards or so, with limited stalk distances at that. I
am interested in the opinions of those with a lot more experience.

So here are my questions:

(1) Given the parameters I have set forth, and focusing only on magnification, and given the price of adding another pair of high-end 10X or 12X glasses to the mix, how comfortable would you be with the 8X Leicas as a general glassing binocular for my purposes?

(2) Would any of you consider going with the 8-power a virtual show-stopper?

Thanks, as always for your advice and best regards,

Russ

It's not as simple as just focusing on magnification. To get better exit pupil you'll want to increase your objective size. I use 50mm, it's more weight than the usual 42mm but they are much more comfortable to look through with a wider field of view usually and better exit pupil. Helps especially in that first and last half hour of the hunt.

A 10x is all you need. Anything more gets to shaky in my opinion.

I use a bino harness from horn hunter and I hardly feel them on me.

 

[Horrible]

Folks,

Let me begin with the parameters of how I will be using the binoculars:
(1) They will be used for backpack hunting and/or hunting with a guide--all in the mountain
west
for mule deer, elk, and pronghorn.

(2) I will not be carrying a spotting scope or big spotting binoculars. I will be after a quality
buck, bull, or goat, but I am not going to be particularly picky--and couldn't handle the
weight anyway.

(3) The scope on my rifle will be a 5X25 power. I realize this is not intended for spotting, but
the top end is available in a pinch.

(4) I will be limiting my shots to an absolute maximum of 1,000 yards--and possibly "down" to
800 or even 600, depending on my experience with myself and my abilities as I get more
into long-range shooting and range practice.

I currently have two hunting binoculars:

(1) Swarovski 10X by 20 mm. Ultra-Light (10 oz)

(2) Leica 8X by 42 mm. (2 lbs 4 oz) (chosen as a compromise between western hunting and
seeing through the thick brush here in South Texas.)

I have used both out west and of course, my experience has been, as you might expect:

That while the little Swaros are a dream to carry, with excellent glass, the exit pupil makes
very difficult to glass for long periods.

The Leicas, though heavy--especially for an old fart that isn't getting any younger, are
magnificent beyond belief, and you can glass with them for hours.

I realize and accept that long-glassing will require more weight.

I have never experienced any known difficulty locating game with the 8 power Leicas--but
then, I have always limited my shots to 300 yards or so, with limited stalk distances at that. I
am interested in the opinions of those with a lot more experience.

So here are my questions:

(1) Given the parameters I have set forth, and focusing only on magnification, and given the price of adding another pair of high-end 10X or 12X glasses to the mix, how comfortable would you be with the 8X Leicas as a general glassing binocular for my purposes?

(2) Would any of you consider going with the 8-power a virtual show-stopper?

Thanks, as always for your advice and best regards,

Russ

I have a pair of Vortex Diamond Back 10x42 my son bought me 11years ago. I've never needed anything else. They're lite but not too lite, armored and easy on the eyes.

 

[Droppndrakes]

I have the swaro EL 10x50 and they are amazing. The other option I would consider is the EL 12x50 and that comes down to whether you will be using a tripod and how comfortable you are hand holding 10 vs 12.

 

[JTB]

I have been hunting the mountain west all my life and would not go out without a good light-weight tripod and good 15x glass (Leica or Swarovski are my go-to's). I generally carry Swaro 8x32 for quick viewing but the rewards of using 15x Swaros on a tripod for hours/day are worth any minor inconvenience of carrying them in your pack. When I was younger I could use lower quality glass but not anymore and I simply spot more game with 15x vs 10x (I pack Leica Duovid 10+15x50). My son-in-laws still do great with less expensive glass but when I look through their binos I am baffled at how well the do. Much of the enjoyment I get out of hunting is looking through beautiful glass at beautiful country. Money well spent in my book.

 

[lancetkenyon]

Hunting out west=need for GOOD binos.
I carry 10x42s in a chest harness, and 15x56s in my pack. I have thousands of hours behind them. Usually 8-10 hours a day behind them.
10s for out to a mile, 15s out to 2+ miles.

GET A GOOD, LIGHT TRIPOD. Manfrotto, Slik, Outdoorsmans, etc. I like carbon fiber to shave weight.

 

[zog]

A 10x is all you need. Anything more gets to shaky in my opinion.

how comfortable you are hand holding 10 vs 12.

Since the thread starter got his answers I want to side-track a little and talk handheld max power. I am salivating at some 12x50's.

I have been using Swaro 10x42 for years and of course I love them but just want to see how much better my 61 year old eyes can see with 12x. However several have commented on shakiness without a tripod. Several say that 10x with tripod easily beats handheld 12x. It makes sense to me; sometimes without using a solid elbow rest in wind, even 10x can be shaky for me.

Its also pretty obvious to me that my ultimate would be 15x with tripod, but my question is more about 12x handheld.

I know I might just need buy a pair of 12x and find out for myself, but before setting myself back, I was hoping for some comments on your experiences . . .

 

[duckhunter175]

Zog-- I went through the same dilemma as well. I went from 8x to 10x then from Viper HD to Swaro to Swaro EL and finally settled on Swaro EL 12x50s.

I use them in my deer stand and I use them on my western hunts each year, carried in a Marsupial bino pouch. The size isn't prohibitive from chest carrying or from drawing a bow or mounting a rifle.

As for the shakiness-- the best binos are whichever ones you can put on a tripod!! Of course 10x mounted vs 12x free hand will win. Just like a 6x riflescope from the prone on a bipod will outshoot a 15x from standing unsupported.

For apples to apples- not a massive difference between handholding 10s vs 12s. The whole point of handholding is either for a quick scan to avoid bumping animals or confirm the target animal is still present and 12x won't stop you from doing that. If you are trying to hand hold them and cover significant amounts of terrain to pinpoint animals that might be a different story.

The 12s are larger than 10s and if you aren't running a tripod at all I could see holding 12s up and scanning for long periods of time would cause fatigue.

But for an all around bino that allows you to leave the 15x at home and go to one bino instead of 10s and 15s I think they are great!

 

[CUTTER1]

I have 2 Swarovski (15x56 & 10x50) and have used them extensively sold my Swarovski RF 10x42 for Zeiss RF 10x42 and now rethinking that move!
Have a pair of Mavin in each pickup (9x45 & 15x56) and for the money they are great!

 

[zog]

settled on Swaro EL 12x50s.

For apples to apples- not a massive difference between handholding 10s vs 12s.

Thanks. I guess the other side of this is that there might not be a massive vision advantage of 12x over 10x either? Simple math says 20%

 

[zog]

sold my Swarovski RF 10x42 for Zeiss RF 10x42 and now rethinking that move!

You mean because the Zeiss are a bit of a downgrade?

RF = rangefinder?

 

[duckhunter175]

Thanks. I guess the other side of this is that there might not be a massive vision advantage of 12x over 10x either? Simple math says 20%

Your field of view will only be more narrow with the 12s by 10 yards at 1000m because the 12s have a 50mm obj instead of 42mm for the 10x42EL.

As far as the magnification and if it helps you see more detail in what you are looking for that is more personal. I personally appreciate and notice the extra '2x' and it keeps me from needing another set of binos (saving space and weight) on backcountry hunts.

 

[Country Bumpkin]

The 15s will not be comfortable, nor will they work for doing the quick 'once over' as you are hunting. They are purely a tripod use bino.

I disagree, but to each their own.

I use my Leica 15's for everything I do in Idaho, except Archery hunting in the timber. I do agree that they require some skill to utilize on anything inside 500 yards, because of the narrow FOV, but in my opinion it's worth it. I don't carry a spotter, and mounted on a tripod, I can determine if a deer is worth going after with just my 15's. Not only are they amazing glass, but I don't have to carry a range finder either.

 

[dfanonymous]

Since the thread starter got his answers I want to side-track a little and talk handheld max power. I am salivating at some 12x50's.

I have been using Swaro 10x42 for years and of course I love them but just want to see how much better my 61 year old eyes can see with 12x. However several have commented on shakiness without a tripod. Several say that 10x with tripod easily beats handheld 12x. It makes sense to me; sometimes without using a solid elbow rest in wind, even 10x can be shaky for me.

Its also pretty obvious to me that my ultimate would be 15x with tripod, but my question is more about 12x handheld.

I know I might just need buy a pair of 12x and find out for myself, but before setting myself back, I was hoping for some comments on your experiences . . .

Sorry I've been banned since July or something.

It really depends...There are particular reasons to use different types of gear for specific use, for specific individuals. Range of what you are trying to look at is a part of it too.
That being said, I only know what works for me, and for people I know, though I'm sure there's more ways to skin this cat.
Sooo, 12x might not be the end of the world, it doesn't look all the much different then a 10x, that being said, if using for spotting game, I like the wider view in a 10x. I like using a 10x50...I find that 50s give me good vis in low light and prevent my eyes from tiring.
I usually use a spotter for tine counting or verifying, or spotting a buddy...(stalk or shot)
I have a bino adapter for the tripod, one can argue that 12-15x binos can be set up like that. The only issue is, and if you've used a straight 15x, it takes time to get use to being able to easily find things with 15x unless you are looking at a object a mile away. I would just use a spotter at that point.

That covers stability issue, but more power in the bino, I can't imagine that the exit pupil are going to better then a standard 10x50. For me, it's been utterly worth it to never have eye fatigue anymore.