I couldn't care less what litz says first. Litz is in the book selling business and suckers are everywhere. I have plenty of experience so I don't need to hear his opinion to know what does and doesn't happen. Second of all I'm talking about hundred yard practices vs 1000 yard practices. Nobody shooting 1000 yard benchrest is using the ideologies of those Shooting hundred yard benchrest. There are very few individuals that actually have a clue that are giving information out freely on the Internet. Every one of those is on accurateshooter.com. The info is there if you can sift through the bs.
"Secret" barrel length
- Thread starter cohunt
- Start date
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I think that the real issue here isn't so obvious. We're handloading to fine-tune the exit release of the bullet at the optimum point of barrel harmonics - and looking to achieve it every time. So we change powder charge and seating depth along with other relatively minor tuning tricks. All that is done with the cartridge itself. On the other hand - you could start trimming barrel length looking for the same optimal timing. The problem is that barrel trimming is a BIG commitment, a lot of trouble and a lot of money. AND - once you cut - you can't go back! (at least with that barrel.)
That's where the Browning BOSS came it - a moveable weight that was all about moving the barrel harmonics in relationship to the bullet timing. And now we know lots of other folks have jumped on this 'adjustable harmonic tuner'. bandwagon The problem here is that what we don't know from the 'warehouse' test is - what are the barrel profiles, how much did they vary across the test - and how the results might change with caliber differences.
As a result - I seriously doubt that there is a universal magic barrel length. I think we're farther ahead tuning the way we do now - with either or both the cartridge's specs and load and external harmonic barrel tuning. Certainly lots less expensive than trimming barrel lengths. So - unless I'm missing something here - is there really any point to this discussion?
huntinfool18
Well-Known Member
So is that 21.75 from the face of the receiver or 21.75 overall?
lancetkenyon
Well-Known Member
1000yd 5-shot BR WR was shot on a 28" barrel...
cohunt
Well-Known Member
Aren't all barrel lengths measured from the bolt/chamber face? At least that's how atf does the legal designation and as far as I know, all manufactures and smiths do the same--- I thought that's how they were measured, is it not?
cohunt
Well-Known Member
BUT what if it was 21.75" ..... could it have been better ?
I'm guessing if there really was a "magic" length we would see it consistently in matches---- but why was Virgil so adamant about the fact that that was the most important thing he learned there?
They tried different powders, bullets, primers, seating depths etc ( if I rember)-- yet he claimed that 21.75 was the most important part of the accuracy equation
I can't tell if you're actually trying to learn something here or what? It's because he was only focused on short range bench rest.BUT what if it was 21.75" ..... could it have been better ?
I'm guessing if there really was a "magic" length we would see it consistently in matches---- but why was Virgil so adamant about the fact that that was the most important thing he learned there?
They tried different powders, bullets, primers, seating depths etc ( if I rember)-- yet he claimed that 21.75 was the most important part of the accuracy equation
Edited to add and centerfire only
I recently cut inches off a factory 7 Rum. There was a velocity loss of around 27 fps per inch from 26 to 22. Then I went to 21 and lost 70 more fps. Only 2 shots so not real scientific but I wish I would've did it before I picked up a 20" barrel for 7 PRC build. Accuracy did not change.
Mike Matteson
Well-Known Member
Here my .02. It depending type of powder being used, and type of primers being used. The components makeup sets things into motion. Powders that are slower in a shorter barrel will need a hotter primes to get the powder burnt, or you got a flame thrower. I am not a match shooter either, but do work towards groups under 1/2" @ 100yds. In my hunting rifles I like velocities of about 3200 to 3300 fps. I like concentricity in my velocity that way I don't have to think about where I am going to hold to shoot. These shots at game animals are out to 500yds. This was done before range finder were much of any good.
HARPERC
Well-Known Member
I think his point was it can't get better, only worse.
You talking about Litz the Aerospace Engineer & Applied Ballistics guy?
Now what could he possibly know about all this stuff
?
Now what could he possibly know about all this stuff
?Most importantly - for the 22LR - ONLY!BUT what if it was 21.75" ..... could it have been better ?
I'm guessing if there really was a "magic" length we would see it consistently in matches---- but why was Virgil so adamant about the fact that that was the most important thing he learned there?
They tried different powders, bullets, primers, seating depths etc ( if I rember)-- yet he claimed that 21.75 was the most important part of the accuracy equation
cohunt
Well-Known Member
Virgil was shooting 22 ppc
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cohunt
Well-Known Member
I am, but most people shy away from shorter barrels so I'm betting most have never even tried 21.75" to have actual first hand knowledge
It's kinda a double edged sword--- .maybe gain accuracy ( if the info is true) but loose velocity.....I do know he was shooting in "ideal conditions"--- that was part of the lure of the warehouse-- to take out as many environmental variables as possible.
Hard to deny he was printing 5 shot groups of .025" though---- even with "real world conditions" variables---- I'm betting he was smoking the group sizes of most guys here
Always looking to learn better reloading, shooting practices--- and if there is a "magic" barrel length I might sacrifice some velocity for accuracy for sure
Anyone actually tried 21.75" barrels ???
