Remington Police Vs Styer SSG .308

[EXPRESS]

A while back I began posting on this site in search of advice and info on a rifle for LR hunting and shooting.

I had and still have the opportinity to purchase a second hand SSG at a very good price, although that limits me in any aftermarket parts that I may want to add.

This for me is quite in imoprtant factor, as I wanted to use a McMillan stock, Jewl trigger, any other scope mounts other than the Styer type...

So I am now considering a Remington 700 Police, a model I have not been able to find on the Remington arms site, but which is availiable here. It is a heavy barreled tactical/sniper rifle.

Can anyone here tell me much about these rifles?

For me the fact that I can chop and change means that I will end up with THE rifle I desire as opposed to the SSG which would just be a rifle I know is more than capable of doing the job, but not exactly how I would like it.

Any info would be greatly apprecieted.

 

[Guest]

Check out www.remingtonle.com
I have a PSS in 308 and it will shoot .5 to .75 moa when I do my part, you can find them here in the states for around $700 retail.

[ 09-07-2003: Message edited by: Wayne McD ]

 

[Ian M]

I have shot PSS's a bit and can tell you some base info. The rifle is quite similar to their VS or varmint synthetic, except a slightly different HS Precision stock is used, a different finish and they have a second sling swivel stud on the forearm. It is a big rifle, not light and usually very accurate.

The stock is good as is, it has a slight palm swell, believe it is pretty similar to one used by U.S. military so it is proven tough. You get a very good stock with the PSS, all you would need to do is apply a bit of bedding (skim bedding) over the aluminum bedding block to ensure a perfect fit of the action to the block.

We found that the finish (sort of soft, Parkerized I believe it is called) marks easily, but that is not a big deal if you intend to learn about LR on the rifle and then have it rebuilt when it is shot out.

Some people argue that the VS is just as good for quite a lot less money. Slightly different stock, no palm swells but still stout, one less swivel stud, brighter finish, not sure about barrel contour but probably similar dimensions. Have shot some VS rifles that are excellent right out of the box, but same goes for accuracy of the PSS in most cases. After a break-in session which probably does more for the owner's confidence than for the rifle, I have seen several VS's shoot sub 1/2" for five shots at 100, these were all in .308 Win. caliber.

The used Styer may be a very good rifle, but even used it will be pricey. In most cases a person does not really know how it was maintained, how many rounds are actually through it, or how hot the barrel was allowed to get - that can be a bugger on barrel life.

Have you considered the Win. Stealth, like the VS/PSS it is also a great LR rifle. The WIn. loading area is bigger than that of a Rem. (more open) so easier to get rounds in and out. Also makes the basis for an excellent custom rifle, particularly the pushfeeds which many guys don't think are as good as they really are. I have shot many M-70 pushfeeds that will shoot as well as any M-700.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[EXPRESS]

Thanks Ian,
The main attraction the 700 offers me is that McMillan makes stocks for them, (though I'd assume they cut for model 70's as well)and the fact that they are used by the US military.

They are a very popular rifle at my range, although I can't say how they shoot never having seen one do it's best.
The stock has a thick palm swell to it, though I find the grip too short for my hand.

I had never considered the Stealth, see I am a little bit of a biased rifle biggot ;-)

I have a Sako varminter in 6PPC that shoots .3' and I have come up with groups in the high teens with 3 shoots.

The thought of buying a rifle that is going to be less accurate for shooting longer rages for me is terrifying.

Only problem is that you con't do much with a Sako in the way of aftermarket parts, not that you need to...

For this rifle, intened for hunting out to 500m, maybe 600m I want a tactical/varmint setup. Just buying another Sako varminter in .308 would be a bit of a defeat for me (and boring)

What can I do? and what kind of accuracy should I demand for these ranges? Which is considered to be the most accurate of the 700 series or model 70's?

Thanks again for the advice, I have no hurry to get the rifle completed, and I have already let several months pass due to health problems with my father, so I am happly to talk about this project a lot before doing much about it.

 

[EXPRESS]

Another consideration, although I don't know how relevant it would be with a .308 shooting 500 - 600m is barrel length.

Where I live(Italy) it is not feasable to modify a firearm beyond it's original dimensions and capabilities, so long barrels are out.

Who makes target/varmint rifles with a few extra inches on the end?
I mean, what are the most popular "out of the box"(or almost) rifles for LR hunting?

 

[RiverRat]

The two most accurate out of the box tactical rifles chambered for the 308 I have seen shoot were FN/ SPR's. Basically controlled round feed M70 actions one of them was in an H.S.Percision stock the other one was in a McMillan stock. Barrel lenght was 26". Both were consistent .5 to .6 MOA out of the box. And with loads tailored to the rifles both would shoot .3's or less. Cost somewhere around $ 1500 U.S. If I was going to buy an out the box rifle, I would get the FN/SPR followed by a Win.Stealth, then the PSS. JMHO based on observation of all the above.

 

[j.j-]

If you do get the police issue get it with the 26 inch barrel. I have a rem 700 Vs with a flash breaker. .308 Bi pod and leupold tactical and the are awsome rifles.

 

[EXPRESS]

Just a note, the Remington "Police" I am talking about here is not the PSS Ian was talking about, rather, a 700 series, here it retails for around $1300.

We are also offered the PSS and an XB series Tactical which go for around $3000+ and $2800 respectively.

Thanks for the input gents.

 

[Ian M]

EX,
I believe that we are talking about the same rifles, the ones that I have shot were called PSS. That might be changed to 700P now since the rifles were bought several years ago. Here is a link to the rifles that I am referring to,
http://www.remingtonle.com/rifle/700p.htm

This is a pretty good rifle, can be the basis of a decent LR system. We use .308's in 20, 22, 24 and 26 inch barrels a lot. Out to 5-600 yards a 20 kills game as dead as a 26" rifle. Difference in elevation adjustment might be two minutes or so out at long range, which for us with the .308's is 700-1000 yards.

 

[Jeff In TX]

Not sure if I understand this correctly, but, if you have $2800 to $3K to spend on a tactical rifle. Don't waste your time buying a factory Win or Rem anything. Do one of two things.

Give George Gardner at GA Precision, or Mike Lau at TBA (Texas Brigade Academy) a call. Both will build you a rugged made to take abuse tack driver on a McMillan stock for that price range.

JMHO

 

[texas]

It may notbe one of the most popular one but, check out the Sig Arms 3000 in 308. Also I'm not sure you can get other stocks for it. Look into stocks for options on other actions. For the money you can't beat a Sako or Savage and I know that there other stocks for them.

 

[EXPRESS]

Jeff, I'd like to spend a little less than 3K on the rifle, maybe 3K would be more like my budget for the rifle, scope and bi-pod.

I have just been told by my local gunshop that someone has a Sig arms SSG 3000 for sale, second hand, this rifle may just be what I'm looking for.

Thanks for the input gents

 

[r johnson]

I'm on my second 700 Rem pss the first was actually the LTR model.Both are accurate! The last group out of the LTR was .480 5 shot group at 100 yds. after shooting 80 rds. at long range and no cleaning between shots, it also has over 5700 rds. on the factory barrel. The new 700 pss has a 26in. fluted barrel and I like it better, because of the velocity increase. It has grouped a .28 five shot group at 100 yds, with factory barrel and hand loads. I have been able to shoot 12 oz. pepsi cans (10 so far.. actual bullet hole in can not just flipping it off the ground with a close hit) at 1000 yds. With the new pss and the 26 in barrel I found a load a can use to 1400 yds. With 20 MOA bases and Leupold LR M3 30mm scope I can dial form 100 yard zero to 1400 yds with no hold over. I also use the 300 win mag turrent cap on the .308 and shoot 2 min flatter than the .300 win mag at the specified distance on the cap. I believe the army specifies the 190 gr. boattail at 2900 fps with a b.c. of .533 for that bullet. the .308 is shooting a 155gr. Lapua vld with a b.c. of .508 at an average velocity of 3026 fps. So the .308 shoots right along side the .300 win mag, the main difference being ft./lb's. of energy. I only has 270 in. or 27 min of drop at 1000 yds (confirmed with range finder), and 76 inches of wind deflexion (10 m.p.h. cross wind) at that distance. At 1400 measured yds. this load has 735 inches or 54 min sometimes 53 min of drop,and is still super sonic. I am able to hit rocks aprox 2 foot square consistantly 5 to 6 times in arow before the wind changes at 1400yds. Just started shooting at this distance and have gotten two shots on center of one rock, two and three quarters inches apart at 1400yds. So buy the rem 700 pss It should average .6 5 shot groups or less with a variety quality handloads (mine have never seen a factory round) without any tinkering what so ever.. with the exception of a trigger adjustment. I use a 1 lb Jewell trigger and the rest of the rifle is pure factory. So, adjust the trigger and shoot it first with a quality handload with a Leupold scope securely attached should equate to small groups! Save the money you would spend on a high dollar rifle and use that money for quality handloading tools and the best reloading components, and go shoot it ...alot!. Good luck, and have fun!!!!