Problems with new gun

Rum River said:
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I've been loading for a long time and thought I'd seen it ALL. Guess not!
I built a long-range rifle for our local competition, "Long-Range Varmint Silhouette."
We use life-size, steel-cutouts of squirrels, marmots, crows, jackrabbits, coyote, and bobcat, at extended ranges.
The jack and coyote are at 500 meters and the higher classes of shooter has the coyote at 750 yards, and the highest class substitutes the bobcat at 850 yards!
Eventhough the shooting is prone with either a "pack-rest" or bipod, and any caliber, ammo, any sight(no .50 BMG, please) it's not an easy match.
I chose to build a .264 WinMag with 156gr Sierra target boat-tail bullets.
At first, things were fine, but as I got into the are that I thought I'd have an advantage, there were fewer holes in my target paper, and the paper is 48"x36"! I worked up my loads at 100 yards.
My scope-choice is a 20x Vortex.
Besides the fewer holes, some were slightly elongated. The REAL puzzler was that SOME were the shape of boomerangs! (I think you here call them bananas)
I found out some paper-shooters had the same problem, and it is "over-spin."
I dropped my velocities back to Grendel-Creedmore speeds, and the accuracy fell in line.
Now I have a Creed that uses 55-60gr of powder!!
My guess is that your 6.5 is a lot faster than my .264 and that's why you had trouble with an 1:8 and mine is 1:7.
Mine isn't nitrided, has no brake, and is a Shilen.
I CAN get acceptable accuracy at the higher velocities with lighter Hornady ELD-X and -M bullets, but I wanted high-BC bullets.
Have fun,
Gene
 
Nevmavrick said:
I've been loading for a long time and thought I'd seen it ALL. Guess not!
I built a long-range rifle for our local competition, "Long-Range Varmint Silhouette."
We use life-size, steel-cutouts of squirrels, marmots, crows, jackrabbits, coyote, and bobcat, at extended ranges.
The jack and coyote are at 500 meters and the higher classes of shooter has the coyote at 750 yards, and the highest class substitutes the bobcat at 850 yards!
Eventhough the shooting is prone with either a "pack-rest" or bipod, and any caliber, ammo, any sight(no .50 BMG, please) it's not an easy match.
I chose to build a .264 WinMag with 156gr Sierra target boat-tail bullets.
At first, things were fine, but as I got into the are that I thought I'd have an advantage, there were fewer holes in my target paper, and the paper is 48"x36"! I worked up my loads at 100 yards.
My scope-choice is a 20x Vortex.
Besides the fewer holes, some were slightly elongated. The REAL puzzler was that SOME were the shape of boomerangs! (I think you here call them bananas)
I found out some paper-shooters had the same problem, and it is "over-spin."
I dropped my velocities back to Grendel-Creedmore speeds, and the accuracy fell in line.
Now I have a Creed that uses 55-60gr of powder!!
My guess is that your 6.5 is a lot faster than my .264 and that's why you had trouble with an 1:8 and mine is 1:7.
Mine isn't nitrided, has no brake, and is a Shilen.
I CAN get acceptable accuracy at the higher velocities with lighter Hornady ELD-X and -M bullets, but I wanted high-BC bullets.
Have fun,
Gene
Click to expand...
I have a few concerns with your post.

Sierra doesn't make a 156gr bullet. They do make a 150gr Sierra Match King though. Amazing bullet. I have run them in a 1:7.5" 6.5SS at 3120fps out past 1500 yards easily. They actually suggest a 1:7.5" or faster on the box (used to say 1:7" or faster on the box), so I am not sure if you were actually "overspinning" them.

A 6.5PRC will not outrun a .264WM when both are loaded to their max with all else created equal. PRC will be around 59-61gr +/- max powder charge. .264WM will be around 66-68gr max powder charge. In the engine world, there is a saying. There is no replacement for displacement. Same pertains to case capacity.

There is NO WAY you are getting 50-60gr of any powder in the 6.5 Creedmoor case.
 
lancetkenyon said:
I have a few concerns with your post.

Sierra doesn't make a 156gr bullet. They do make a 150gr Sierra Match King though. Amazing bullet. I have run them in a 1:7.5" 6.5SS at 3120fps out past 1500 yards easily. They actually suggest a 1:7.5" or faster on the box (used to say 1:7" or faster on the box), so I am not sure if you were actually "overspinning" them.

A 6.5PRC will not outrun a .264WM when both are loaded to their max with all else created equal. PRC will be around 59-61gr +/- max powder charge. .264WM will be around 66-68gr max powder charge. In the engine world, there is a saying. There is no replacement for displacement. Same pertains to case capacity.

There is NO WAY you are getting 50-60gr of any powder in the 6.5 Creedmoor case.
Click to expand...
I had never looked up the 264 WM load data before. When I saw your post, it made me curious. I was looking for apples to apples, so I looked at different sites for H1000 as I use it a lot in various cartridges. They all seem to claim the max load for a 140gr class bullet is somewhere in the high 58gr-59.5gr. Is this what you seem to find is the case with your 264 WM? I know these data sets can tend to run conservative. I have found this to be true loading other SAAMI cartridges like the 7 STW and 300 WSM in the past. What type of pf velocities do you get from your 264 WM?
 
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vancewalker007 said:
I had never looked up the 264 WM load data before. When I saw your post, it made me curious. I was looking for apples to apples, so I looked at different sites for H1000 as I use it a lot in various cartridges. They all seem to claim the max load for a 140gr class bullet is somewhere in the high 58gr-59.5gr. Is this what you seem to find is the case with your 264 WM? I know these data sets can tend to run conservative. I have found this to be true loading other SAAMI cartridges like the 7 STW and 300 WSM in the past. What type of pf velocities do you get from your 264 WM?
Click to expand...
A LOT more than that with H1000.
Heck, I can run 60.0gr in a 6.5SS and a 6.5-06AI.
 
Well I think we found the Problem took to a gunsmith he had a I guess you would call it a gage rod I not sure he started feeding it down the end of the barrel and in about 4" it got tight push through that in a few more inches no problem pulled it back hit obstruction measured to end of barrel cut off 4" of barrel crowned and threaded for muzzle went the other day and guess what he can now hit a target didn't have enough bullets loaded to test it real good so we will load more bullets and go do some more testing . I want to thank everybody that chimed in to help me figure this problem out.
 
GregH118 said:
Well I think we found the Problem took to a gunsmith he had a I guess you would call it a gage rod I not sure he started feeding it down the end of the barrel and in about 4" it got tight push through that in a few more inches no problem pulled it back hit obstruction measured to end of barrel cut off 4" of barrel crowned and threaded for muzzle went the other day and guess what he can now hit a target didn't have enough bullets loaded to test it real good so we will load more bullets and go do some more testing . I want to thank everybody that chimed in to help me figure this problem out.
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Still seems kind of strange? Usually a barrel obstruction causes a catastrophic problem and the barrel splits open and usually injures or kills the person firing it.
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GregH118 said:
Well I think we found the Problem took to a gunsmith he had a I guess you would call it a gage rod I not sure he started feeding it down the end of the barrel and in about 4" it got tight push through that in a few more inches no problem pulled it back hit obstruction measured to end of barrel cut off 4" of barrel crowned and threaded for muzzle went the other day and guess what he can now hit a target didn't have enough bullets loaded to test it real good so we will load more bullets and go do some more testing . I want to thank everybody that chimed in to help me figure this problem out.
Click to expand...
Must have been causing a really random vibration pattern shot to shot plus deforming the bullets. That would for sure throw bullets all over the place.
 
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Not an obstruction but a significant change in bore/rifling diameter. It was probably shrinking the bullet diameter in that choked area and then becoming loose in the remaining 4 inches. If you saved that cutoff piece, I would contact Brux and maybe they would replace with a new blank. They certainly would like to know anyway.
 

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