Notes on the Centenerian

[fiftybmg]

Shooters disregard the 30-06 because they hear that a .308 is so close to it as to make no difference, not because of any experience with reloading in general.

The 30-06 has 21% more case capacity of a .308 . That puts it nowhere close. When the manufacturers figures put .308 ballistics close to a 30-06, the pressure of the .308 is running higher than for the 30-06, so it is not an equal comparison. The 30-06 can approach the low end of the .30 magnums with equivalent bullet weights, which a .308 simply cannot.

The design of the 30-06 case lends itself to excellent accuracy potential. The ratio of the neck length to bore size is high for caliber, and exceeds the .30 caliber magnums. This means the bullet can be seated clear of the powder column, which is great for performance and accuracy.

When knocking 30-06 performance capability as "old wives tales" and "myths" of "special powers" , please save the yarn and try get to the numbers. Stick to quoting verifiable numbers.

There is nothing new from cartridges ballistically . A lot of cartridges duplicate each other's ballistics with specific bullet weights. The real innovations have been in bullet manufacture and platform evolution, giving us the long range capability that we have today.

The 30-06 should not be compared to any Creedmoor. Creedmoor calibers were designed with a shorter powder column to reduce recoil for target shooters - specifically to keep the scope on target after the shot. To compensate for the reduced powder capacity, the cartridge was mated to high BC bullets to reduce drop at long distance. This does not equate to terminal performance at long distance.

Taking the centenarian, loading it with the right powder, and mating it to suitable high BC bullets will give very interesting results.

The 30-06 cartridge is just under-rated, it is not inferior.

 

[J E Custom]

I cant imagine anyone comparing the 308 to the 30/06 because like you, I feel that they are in a totally different group of cartridges.

It is still the standard for comparison for performance and recoil. It is also the basis for the 50 BMG design by John Browning (Dimensionally the 50 BMG is just a scaled up version of the 30/06).

There are many "New" designer cartridges that make claims of performance, that will never stand the test of time and sink into obscurity.

Its good to see someone defend some of the classic cartridges that still exist and perform as they were designed. sometimes we get caught up in the latest and greatest and forget where we came from.
With all the new powders and bullets, the 30/06 is far from dead and will perform as well or better than some when compared with like components and pressures.

Just My Opinion

J E CUSTOM

 

[Smokepoles]

the 06 is still my personal favorite and if I were to have only one rifle thatd be it.

 

[Dosh]

Can't heap enough accolades upon the 06 and it's cousins ".270 Win, 25-06" etc.

 

[dwightb]

The .270 is not based on the 30 06. It was based on the 30 03 very similar but an earlier cartridge. 25 06 is a necked down 30 06.

 

[Smokepoles]

Oh here we go..

 

[fiftybmg]

Oh here we go..

Just creating a new thread so as not to sidetrack the original threads where these posts occur.

In response to posts on other threads, where .308 / .30-06 are mentioned in the same context as being replaced by Creedmoor for hunting, and forum members are falling over each other to smugly high-five their Creedmoor marketing knowledge.

Creedmoor is not a hunting cartridge. High BC bullets for Creedmoor are not for hunting.

When you load hunting bullets in a Creedmoor, you lose one of the two pillars underlying it's performance, that of the BC superiority. With the superior BC, the bullets can fly longer to compensate for the shorter powder column. Take that away and you have a small caliber brush buster.

You can certainly use a Creedmoor to hunt, same as you could use any caliber ever invented for hunting. But we do not punt every caliber invented as hunting replacements for the .308 / 30-06.

The 30-06 and .308 were made for terminal performance, not for target shooting.

Comparing the three is invalid, and illustrates shooter ignorance, not cartridge superiority.

 

[Smokepoles]

I like your post don't think I'm against it I was referencing the 270 comment above. I favor an 06 but that said I own a 308 and a creed as well. Don't forget 260 have been killing for years and if you stuff an accubond or similar in a creed it's no different and is plenty effective as a hunting round, I've seen plenty of whitetail and pigs drop from them. Bigger game or longer range it wouldn't be my choice but I'm not scared to point one at a deer within a reasonable distance.
That said I don't care to debate which is better, just wanted to pat a fellow 06 fan on the back.

 

[FEENIX]

Oh here we go..

 

[tbrice23]

View attachment 132922

Oh my dear lord that is freaking hilarious.

 

[Dosh]

Don't encourage him!

 

[MudRunner2005]

Here we go again.

21% more powder doesn't automatically equal 21% greater performance...Anyone who's ever played around with cartridges or wildcats can tell you that. Cartridge design, burn rates, should angle, wall taper, burn column, all of these factor into performance. The .30-06 still does a great job at what it does, but it's just old school, and the design is old school. The whole entire reason we have the .308 Win (7.62x51 NATO) is because the military wanted a .30 caliber cartridge that would produce .30-06 Sprg. performance in a smaller, lighter, more compact package...And the .308 Win did just that. That's why it exists. "New" designed cartridges (like the Ackleys) are just a much better case design. Scientific facts. Does the old still work? Absolutely. But it's not up to par with the "new" designs when it comes down to burn characteristics and performance. If the old school case designs were so extraordinary, why does nobody still use them when they design their new cartridges...?

As for the 6.5CM, I'm pretty sure we all know where I stand on that one, and that I would not put it above the .308 or .30-06...Ever.

Also, I could see this thread getting really fun, really quickly. Can't wait for the festivities!!!

 

[therifleman556]

...And the .308 Win did just that.

Past tense, it did do that. It did equal original 30-06 ballistics with the powders of the 1950s. Loaded to equal pressures, it cannot any longer.

There's no substitute for cubic inches...

 

[tbrice23]

" no replacement for displacement "