Norma BondStrike, TipStrike, and J&A Abram bullets

jbronner13 said:
I dunno man, gonna need a picture of this, your face, driver's license and junk altogether to prove you really did this šŸ˜‚
Click to expand...
You forgot SSN, mother's maiden name, place of birth, school records K-12, job history, birth certificate, marriage certificate, and library card. Of course all of it should be included individually with a picture of him holding it with a newspaper showing the date of the picture.
 
NorthRiverGuide said:
You forgot SSN, mother's maiden name, place of birth, school records K-12, job history, birth certificate, marriage certificate, and library card. Of course all of it should be included individually with a picture of him holding it with a newspaper showing the date of the picture.
Click to expand...
And preferred pronouns so we can call you out properly if we smell something fishy
 
Petey308 said:
You're most welcome and I'm glad you found it useful.
Click to expand...
I have a question and not sure if you can answer it or not. But are different manufacturers using different makeup of components such as harder copper, lead, etc than others ? Couldn't this affect the way a bullet performs ? Could this lead to some bullets failing while others perform well ? Even from the same lots. I read through your post. At least I hope I covered them all. But I don't recall you touching on this. If you did ? Sorry I missed it.
 
M1A1ABRAMS said:
I have a question and not sure if you can answer it or not. But are different manufacturers using different makeup of components such as harder copper, lead, etc than others ? Couldn't this affect the way a bullet performs ? Could this lead to some bullets failing while others perform well ? Even from the same lots. I read through your post. At least I hope I covered them all. But I don't recall you touching on this. If you did ? Sorry I missed it.
Click to expand...
The short answer is yes, alloy contents do vary and it does indeed affect things. I think maybe my post about the Sierra TMK vs the TGK might cover differences in jacket thicknesses and the hardness of the cores best. A thicker jacket, especially if it's a harder alloy, will not deform as much and typically when it does it fractures more than just bends. Same with harder alloy cores compared to softer cores or pure lead cores. The harder alloy core will resist squishing and splattering as much than a softer alloy or pure lead does.

Unfortunately I couldn't tell you the exact alloy content of all the different bullets to include their particular cores and jackets, although most jackets are the same type of gilding metal, just varying in thicknesses. Some have mechanical bonding devices like interlock rings or cannelures, some are electro-chemically bonded, etc. and some are thin with no tapering or additional means to help adhere the jacket to the core.

I'm not sure if this answers any of your questions or not. I'd love to get a database of that kind of thing as well. I hope someday soon I will.
 
Last edited:
Petey,
I have seen a couple of your posts, and I enjoy them.

Some people need to stop and think with how they interact publicly with others.
I sell products as well.
I have competitors as well.
Does something slip through quality control every once in awhile? YES
Will some people complain about it? Yes
Do we make it right and take the hit? Yes
Some folks like other brands better than mine/ours, and they buy brand XYZ and celebrate their joy for that rest, bi-pod, front bag, rear bag, etc...
They may also list why they don't like my brand as much as XYZ brand-That's fine too.
There is nothing wrong with that!
A lot of times I stay in my specialty pistol bubble here, unless someone tags me or I happen to see a cool post. I just don't have the time to keep track of everything, even though there is a lot of good stuff here.
I like posts like these myself, except for the drama.
I don't care what product you like and buy/use (Consumer/Fan Boys) or what product you make and sell (Manufacturer and or Dealer), some people are not going to like it for a variety of reasons (Some of those reasons may be very petty).
Sometimes we need to get some thicker skin. Sometimes our passion ends up with us shooting ourselves in the foot, and we haven't even realized it yet.
Have you ever noticed how easy it is to justify our own bad behavior, while at the same time condemning others?
There are a couple of forums I don't frequent or users I will not respond to because of the stupid drama
My response really is not just about this thread, but others I have read in the last 6+ months.
Most of us wouldn't act out like some do on a forum in a public setting.
Of some would, but that is a different story.
My encouragement is not for us to lower ourselves to someone else's level.
I guess I am done ranting.
Make Len's House a better place than the other forums-Have a great day guys!
 
Ernie said:
Petey,
I have seen a couple of your posts, and I enjoy them.

Some people need to stop and think with how they interact publicly with others.
I sell products as well.
I have competitors as well.
Does something slip through quality control every once in awhile? YES
Will some people complain about it? Yes
Do we make it right and take the hit? Yes
Some folks like other brands better than mine/ours, and they buy brand XYZ and celebrate their joy for that rest, bi-pod, front bag, rear bag, etc...
They may also list why they don't like my brand as much as XYZ brand-That's fine too.
There is nothing wrong with that!
A lot of times I stay in my specialty pistol bubble here, unless someone tags me or I happen to see a cool post. I just don't have the time to keep track of everything, even though there is a lot of good stuff here.
I like posts like these myself, except for the drama.
I don't care what product you like and buy/use (Consumer/Fan Boys) or what product you make and sell (Manufacturer and or Dealer), some people are not going to like it for a variety of reasons (Some of those reasons may be very petty).
Sometimes we need to get some thicker skin. Sometimes our passion ends up with us shooting ourselves in the foot, and we haven't even realized it yet.
Have you ever noticed how easy it is to justify our own bad behavior, while at the same time condemning others?
There are a couple of forums I don't frequent or users I will not respond to because of the stupid drama
My response really is not just about this thread, but others I have read in the last 6+ months.
Most of us wouldn't act out like some do on a forum in a public setting.
Of some would, but that is a different story.
My encouragement is not for us to lower ourselves to someone else's level.
I guess I am done ranting.
Make Len's House a better place than the other forums-Have a great day guys!
Click to expand...
Well said, Ernie!
 
Ernie said:
Petey,
I have seen a couple of your posts, and I enjoy them.

Some people need to stop and think with how they interact publicly with others.
I sell products as well.
I have competitors as well.
Does something slip through quality control every once in awhile? YES
Will some people complain about it? Yes
Do we make it right and take the hit? Yes
Some folks like other brands better than mine/ours, and they buy brand XYZ and celebrate their joy for that rest, bi-pod, front bag, rear bag, etc...
They may also list why they don't like my brand as much as XYZ brand-That's fine too.
There is nothing wrong with that!
A lot of times I stay in my specialty pistol bubble here, unless someone tags me or I happen to see a cool post. I just don't have the time to keep track of everything, even though there is a lot of good stuff here.
I like posts like these myself, except for the drama.
I don't care what product you like and buy/use (Consumer/Fan Boys) or what product you make and sell (Manufacturer and or Dealer), some people are not going to like it for a variety of reasons (Some of those reasons may be very petty).
Sometimes we need to get some thicker skin. Sometimes our passion ends up with us shooting ourselves in the foot, and we haven't even realized it yet.
Have you ever noticed how easy it is to justify our own bad behavior, while at the same time condemning others?
There are a couple of forums I don't frequent or users I will not respond to because of the stupid drama
My response really is not just about this thread, but others I have read in the last 6+ months.
Most of us wouldn't act out like some do on a forum in a public setting.
Of some would, but that is a different story.
My encouragement is not for us to lower ourselves to someone else's level.
I guess I am done ranting.
Make Len's House a better place than the other forums-Have a great day guys!
Click to expand...
Well said! I do think a lot of it comes down to not taking any sort of criticism for simply what it is. Why get so offended and take it so personal? It's just part of it all. There will always be criticism and things people question. In reality, it's healthy and pushes you to do better and be better. It gives you the opportunity to shine in how you handle it, or not so much. And that said, we're all human and in the heat of it, mistakes will be made at times. I think how you move forward from it matters the most, or if you actually do move forward or not. There are indeed some pettiness at times.

I'm not perfect and I can admit I struggle at times to let things go and I've got lost in emotions and lost some rational and logic. I do try to reflect and move on the best I can and put it behind me. Sometimes it gets brought up again and we start stirring things up again.

I think most that have be in this forum a while know the hot button subjects and know when things are about to get potentially nasty. It's sad and unfortunate too that it is indeed that way. Can't we all just get along and discuss our differences of opinions, preferences, etc without it getting nasty? Why does it have to be viewed as an attack if you have an opinion or if you maybe call out things you see as incorrect or misleading? Without that, I'd say it would make for a place where we lose legitimacy and now we're free to make any claim we want and it just has to be accepted. It's just the way we handle that that matters most.

I suppose we could debate this and we each could have our own rants or rambling lol. I feel like this might be more of the latter lol.

Anyway, thanks for that reply Ernie.
 
Petey308 said:
Well said! I do think a lot of it comes down to not taking any sort of criticism for simply what it is. Why get so offended and take it so personal? It's just part of it all. There will always be criticism and things people question. In reality, it's healthy and pushes you to do better and be better. It gives you the opportunity to shine in how you handle it, or not so much. And that said, we're all human and in the heat of it, mistakes will be made at times. I think how you move forward from it matters the most, or if you actually do move forward or not. There are indeed some pettiness at times.

I'm not perfect and I can admit I struggle at times to let things go and I've got lost in emotions and lost some rational and logic. I do try to reflect and move on the best I can and put it behind me. Sometimes it gets brought up again and we start stirring things up again.

I think most that have be in this forum a while know the hot button subjects and know when things are about to get potentially nasty. It's sad and unfortunate too that it is indeed that way. Can't we all just get along and discuss our differences of opinions, preferences, etc without it getting nasty? Why does it have to be viewed as an attack if you have an opinion or if you maybe call out things you see as incorrect or misleading? Without that, I'd say it would make for a place where we lose legitimacy and now we're free to make any claim we want and it just has to be accepted. It's just the way we handle that that matters most.

I suppose we could debate this and we each could have our own rants or rambling lol. I feel like this might be more of the latter lol.

Anyway, thanks for that reply Ernie.
Click to expand...
That was exactly my point. I was just much more blunt. Besides it gave the @NorthRiverGuide the opening he has been looking for since he showed up here. We'll see if he has another rehearsed speech to give. The 1st one was better than I even imagined.

Petey, you do great research, for that I commend you.
 
Gday a interesting thread & id looked @ it some time ago now it's taken the ever so familiar turn

I'm not to proud to say I'm wrong as it's the correct thing to do & if I should I will acknowledge I'm wrong I just don't get why some here can't or is it the agenda base no rose coloured glasses here

Petey308 may I suggest a way forward as I've been called out on here & we addressed that in another thread & don't want to get that part going again so I accept my head was getting put on the chopping block sometime back & it started with our mate ( well yours or company you keep & I mean no I'll in saying this to you as the other guy is the tool )
& this part I believe is more important to you than most people as your writing a book & transparency imo is even more important than just a D like me defending myself

Now you may not want to enter into putting your personal information out there & completely understand but your eventually going to get put under the microscope as you publish a document for the public you will become public like it or not.

The one where I think you can put a lot of the unrest is to put up facts & not theories ( I believe you won't take offence to that if you understand where I'm coming from but apologise if you take offence in advance as not my intention )

I do think you've got a really good handle on the cup & core & even surpassing my knowledge & some others ( I'm trying to not come across as cocky or a suck I'm just stating my thoughts) but as you have already acknowledged as per this quote you see there's a bit more to it than just dissecting pills on face value
Petey308 said:
The short answer is yes, alloy contents do vary and it does indeed affect things. I think maybe my post about the Sierra TMK vs the TGK might cover differences in jacket thicknesses and the hardness of the cores best. A thicker jacket, especially if it's a harder alloy, will not deform as much and typically when it does it fractures more than just bends. Same with harder alloy cores compared to softer cores or pure lead cores. The harder alloy core will resist squishing and splattering as much than a softer alloy or pure lead does.

Unfortunately I couldn't tell you the exact alloy content of all the different bullets to include their particular cores and jackets, although most jackets are the same type of gilding metal, just varying in thicknesses. Some have mechanical bonding devices like interlock rings or cannelures, some are electro-chemically bonded, etc. and some are thin with no tapering or additional means to help adhere the jacket to the core.

I'm not sure if this answers any of your questions or not. I'd love to get a database of that kind of thing as well. I hope someday soon I will.
Click to expand...
Yep what you will put in your book will cover the bases well with the c& c especially if you put the alloy differences in but man that's some serious work but go for it if you have the time as man that would be awesome

Now we enter the mono world & I note you've been working with mark & the afterburners & the design is good but you lot are looking @ the trees not the wood in them I say this with the utmost respect & overall just my opinion but I'd think I've got the runs on the board & seen where I went wrong with those thoughts I use to have
I don't say this half heartedly as on paper you guys are correct but now we enter the reality of hunting & where things go pear shape for the animal & us & with the utmost respect you have someway to go before you understand what's going on so my advice is keep researching step back clear your head & start from the basics then the penny will drop ( it took time/ patience & a group of great individual minds to get to the level we know what's going on today & still learning as we go , not the crap that goes on here & many a private conversation that still today remain private & wont be put out by me so please don't anyone ask )


I really liked Ernie's post well done sir

Steve is that a olive branch šŸ•Š I see in your last post šŸ˜‡

I'll post again I'm definitely no guru just a simple person that still has a long way to go on my knowledge base

keep raising that bar people & the critter & all of us benefit yep it's that simple
Cheers
 
fordy said:
Gday a interesting thread & id looked @ it some time ago now it's taken the ever so familiar turn

I'm not to proud to say I'm wrong as it's the correct thing to do & if I should I will acknowledge I'm wrong I just don't get why some here can't or is it the agenda base no rose coloured glasses here

Petey308 may I suggest a way forward as I've been called out on here & we addressed that in another thread & don't want to get that part going again so I accept my head was getting put on the chopping block sometime back & it started with our mate ( well yours or company you keep & I mean no I'll in saying this to you as the other guy is the tool )
& this part I believe is more important to you than most people as your writing a book & transparency imo is even more important than just a D like me defending myself

Now you may not want to enter into putting your personal information out there & completely understand but your eventually going to get put under the microscope as you publish a document for the public you will become public like it or not.

The one where I think you can put a lot of the unrest is to put up facts & not theories ( I believe you won't take offence to that if you understand where I'm coming from but apologise if you take offence in advance as not my intention )

I do think you've got a really good handle on the cup & core & even surpassing my knowledge & some others ( I'm trying to not come across as cocky or a suck I'm just stating my thoughts) but as you have already acknowledged as per this quote you see there's a bit more to it than just dissecting pills on face value

Yep what you will put in your book will cover the bases well with the c& c especially if you put the alloy differences in but man that's some serious work but go for it if you have the time as man that would be awesome

Now we enter the mono world & I note you've been working with mark & the afterburners & the design is good but you lot are looking @ the trees not the wood in them I say this with the utmost respect & overall just my opinion but I'd think I've got the runs on the board & seen where I went wrong with those thoughts I use to have
I don't say this half heartedly as on paper you guys are correct but now we enter the reality of hunting & where things go pear shape for the animal & us & with the utmost respect you have someway to go before you understand what's going on so my advice is keep researching step back clear your head & start from the basics then the penny will drop ( it took time/ patience & a group of great individual minds to get to the level we know what's going on today & still learning as we go , not the crap that goes on here & many a private conversation that still today remain private & wont be put out by me so please don't anyone ask )


I really liked Ernie's post well done sir

Steve is that a olive branch šŸ•Š I see in your last post šŸ˜‡

I'll post again I'm definitely no guru just a simple person that still has a long way to go on my knowledge base

keep raising that bar people & the critter & all of us benefit yep it's that simple
Cheers
Click to expand...

Well, let me start by saying thanks, I think lol. This particular thread was only posted a few days ago, so you might be thinking of a similar one about bullet construction I originally posted almost a year ago now, but I don't suppose it really matters.

There's a reason the book isnt being rushed to be published. There's a lot left to do before I'll be satisfied and ready to publish it. And it's not something I'm putting out as a war on monos lol. I have no war there, believe it or not. I'm putting out the info and thoughts I have, as it's been requested and suggested numerous times by many.

And yes, obviously once I publish a book, my identity goes out with it, and I know what that means. At least it's on my terms at that point lol. And my identity has already been broadcast here, as well as my current sprouting startup business lol. I'm not hiding. In fact, for those that don't know, my name is Aaron Peterson. Petey is a nickname I got when I was stationed in Germany. It's actually not really been used much anymore, but I still use it for user IDs in some places, such as here lol. I'm still a full time member of the US Air Force, on year 19, as a crew chief on the A-10 Thunderbolt. I've been stationed in Europe, South Korea, and of course stateside, and have seen numerous combat deployments and temporary duties all over the world. This sort of thing though (hunting, bullets, making ammo, terminal ballistics, etc) is my passion, and what I will fall to full time after I retire.

Yes, I have a long ways to go in my journey and a lot to still be learned. My work with bullets like the Apex Afterburner is just an example of me continuing to learn more, and particularly with new mono bullet technologies. I continue to strive to keep an open mind and learn. That said, I take pride in not quickly giving up on my beliefs and I stick up for myself and what I think is right. The other side does as well, as would be expected. I do my best to keep professional and civil, but I'm human and have made mistakes there. I'm still fairly young and know as a result my experience is limited. I'm working with what I have so far though. Facts are hard to come by sometimes and I would argue there is a TON that so far has to be left to theory, unfortunately. There are just too many current variables and hurdles we don't currently have the means to get over to get to actual facts. Hopefully someday we will, and the sooner the better.

I know I got off on the wrong foot with many when I posted about monos, but I also think my intent was mistaken. I was reluctant to post that, and at the time I do believe I was still a bit naive to think it was unbiased enough to not get taken out of context. I have regrets with that post and thread. I'd do it much differently now that I've gained more wisdom in the last year of being much more active in this forum. The book I'm working on will reflect that wisdom and how it's laid out will be the best I can come up with to be delicate and unbiased and sensitive to many hunters' beliefs and preferences. It'll be all from me with nothing borrowed without express permission, such as pictures or stories and examples. I'm sure there will be many criticisms and disagreements, as there always is and always will be. You just can't please and satisfy everyone.

I appreciate your efforts and I admire and envy your situation with having been blessed with such an immense opportunity to get a lot of experience hunting and shooting lots of different bullets and animals. I appreciate you sharing your experience and results too.

I can only hope we can all learn to get along and work together and stop all the back and forth and actually be productive. I'm also sorry you seem to have issue with those you refer to as the company I keep. Perhaps we both have a few supporters in our respective corners, so to speak, but that would imply there's a fight, and I truly don't wish there to be a fight.

In the end, I'm just like you claim for yourself. I'm no expert and I'm just a simple man too. I'm not selling anything right now. I'm just posting up data, thoughts, and my experience thus far, and engaging in discussions.

Thanks for your reply,

Aaron.
 
Petey308 said:
Well, let me start by saying thanks, I think lol. This particular thread was only posted a few days ago, so you might be thinking of a similar one about bullet construction I originally posted almost a year ago now, but I don't suppose it really matters.

There's a reason the book isnt being rushed to be published. There's a lot left to do before I'll be satisfied and ready to publish it. And it's not something I'm putting out as a war on monos lol. I have no war there, believe it or not. I'm putting out the info and thoughts I have, as it's been requested and suggested numerous times by many.

And yes, obviously once I publish a book, my identity goes out with it, and I know what that means. At least it's on my terms at that point lol. And my identity has already been broadcast here, as well as my current sprouting startup business lol. I'm not hiding. In fact, for those that don't know, my name is Aaron Peterson. Petey is a nickname I got when I was stationed in Germany. It's actually not really been used much anymore, but I still use it for user IDs in some places, such as here lol. I'm still a full time member of the US Air Force, on year 19, as a crew chief on the A-10 Thunderbolt. I've been stationed in Europe, South Korea, and of course stateside, and have seen numerous combat deployments and temporary duties all over the world. This sort of thing though (hunting, bullets, making ammo, terminal ballistics, etc) is my passion, and what I will fall to full time after I retire.

Yes, I have a long ways to go in my journey and a lot to still be learned. My work with bullets like the Apex Afterburner is just an example of me continuing to learn more, and particularly with new mono bullet technologies. I continue to strive to keep an open mind and learn. That said, I take pride in not quickly giving up on my beliefs and I stick up for myself and what I think is right. The other side does as well, as would be expected. I do my best to keep professional and civil, but I'm human and have made mistakes there. I'm still fairly young and know as a result my experience is limited. I'm working with what I have so far though. Facts are hard to come by sometimes and I would argue there is a TON that so far has to be left to theory, unfortunately. There are just too many current variables and hurdles we don't currently have the means to get over to get to actual facts. Hopefully someday we will, and the sooner the better.

I know I got off on the wrong foot with many when I posted about monos, but I also think my intent was mistaken. I was reluctant to post that, and at the time I do believe I was still a bit naive to think it was unbiased enough to not get taken out of context. I have regrets with that post and thread. I'd do it much differently now that I've gained more wisdom in the last year of being much more active in this forum. The book I'm working on will reflect that wisdom and how it's laid out will be the best I can come up with to be delicate and unbiased and sensitive to many hunters' beliefs and preferences. It'll be all from me with nothing borrowed without express permission, such as pictures or stories and examples. I'm sure there will be many criticisms and disagreements, as there always is and always will be. You just can't please and satisfy everyone.

I appreciate your efforts and I admire and envy your situation with having been blessed with such an immense opportunity to get a lot of experience hunting and shooting lots of different bullets and animals. I appreciate you sharing your experience and results too.

I can only hope we can all learn to get along and work together and stop all the back and forth and actually be productive. I'm also sorry you seem to have issue with those you refer to as the company I keep. Perhaps we both have a few supporters in our respective corners, so to speak, but that would imply there's a fight, and I truly don't wish there to be a fight.

In the end, I'm just like you claim for yourself. I'm no expert and I'm just a simple man too. I'm not selling anything right now. I'm just posting up data, thoughts, and my experience thus far, and engaging in discussions.

Thanks for your reply,

Aaron.
Click to expand...
BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT!
 

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