New To Reloading Please Help!

[epoletna]

I have never heard of lapping the stem.
Got me to thinking... I wonder if anyone has glass bedded their stem?
Might have to use a loaded round or seated factory bullet. Make sure it is a "straight" bullet.
Good idea?

Yes, people have glass bedded their stem. Obviously you've gotta use release agent on the bullet you use as a mould. And keep different stems for different bullet profiles.

 

[richhymas]

Hi everyone.

I am new to reloading I got a setup about two weeks ago and have loaded 150rds and don't have any real "issues" I get pretty darn consistent velocity and am not seeing any loss in accuracy compared with most match grade loads so I know I am doing it "right" but I also know I can do better. I got a 2 hour "crash course" in reloading from the guy at the store, he helped me set up my dies and we loaded ammo in the store as he tried to cram as much knowledge into my head as possible in that short amount of time.

I do have a few questions/concerns and hope that you more experienced guys can help me out and maybe give me tips on improving my setup/technique so bear with me as I walk through my process.

I have a Hornady Lock and Load press kit with RCBS dies a Full Length sizing die and a seating/crimping die I'm using a Hornady digital scale and Hornady's powder measure with Lee case trimmer tools. I am loading for .223/5.56 and I have cases segregated and different loads for each case type.

I am hand cleaning my used brass, brake clean for the outside and a good wipe down which is slow but it works and I will invest in a media tumbler later, a primer pocket cleaner and and old bore brush for the inside of the case, I am not going crazy I am just knocking some of the fouling out of the inside, cleaning the primer pocket and making sure the outside is clean and free of any debris that will scratch my dies. I make sure the cases are totally dry before I do anything else.

I then lay cases out on a blue shop towel usually 10 at a time and spray them down with Hornady case lube that came with the kit, I roll them to distribute the lube and remove any excess, the cases have a thin oily film on them, they are slippery but not dripping lube, I inspect the cases before they go into the sizing die. The sizing and de-priming process goes smooth the press goes "over center" and the top of the ram and the die are making light contact. Coming back out I have no issues although some of the case necks are tighter than others and require a bit more force to get beyond the expander ball.

Here is my first question/concern. My book says trim 5.56 to 1.250 but my Lee case trimmer stops cutting at 1.256" I cant screw the dang thing down any more/tighter and a lot of my cases are at 1.255". The guy in the store said as long as they were all the same length between 1.250-1.260 its fine and less trimming means longer case life. Do you all agree? Should I buy a different case trimmer that will actually get down to 1.250? This ammo is mostly going back in the same gun but I also don't want any issues if I do want to load into a different rifle.

I trim to 1.256" on the 50-60% of cases that will actually need it as stated, I debur inside and out and remove primer crimping since most of my brass is Lake City 5.56.

I then install primers using the tool I got with the Hornady kit no issues here. I never touch the primers they go straight from the box to the tool. The remaining primers go into a sealed container with a couple of silica gel packets.

I have CFE223 powder mainly because it was available in 1lb bottles but am happy with my results so far so I bought 2lbs more and I think I will just stick with it I did lose some because I was an idiot and didn't clean/degrease my powder measure before pouring some into it but I realized it as soon as I did it and I didn't load any contaminated powder and I didn't try to save any of the powder that went into the oily powder measure.

I think I have a very good process for metering out powder (And CFE223 meters extremely well) I keep the hopper topped up to about the same level the whole time to keep steady pressure in the powder column.
I have marked the drum and the frame of the measure so I can run the lever, pouring powder into my pan, then I lift it up about 1/3rd of the way and drop the handle from the same height each time.
I found when I was racking/knocking the drum by the handle after each load was measured to knock out any powder stuck in the exit funnel I was getting a lot of .2-3 gr variation and with the "drop method" from the mark I made I get the same amount within the tolerance of my scale which is 1/10th grain about 80% of the time. If its over I knock a tiny amount of powder back into the hopper if its under I just pour the whole thing back in and try again.

Ive been measuring every charge before I load it into a case. I know its time consuming but I am looking for extreme precision and I don't mind taking my time.

For loads I stopped at 24.5 (.4 under book max) for .223 and 26gr (.5 under book max) for 5.56. I am getting an average of 2638fps and 2784fps out of .223 and 5.56 respectively with Hornady 73gr ELD's in 35-40 degree weather. No excessive pressure signs from each load and accuracy on par with most factory match ammo. Gold Medal Match is still better but I will eventually dethrone that load.

When it comes to seating and crimping I am running into an issue where I get rings from the seating rod around the tips of my bullets they aren't deep but I assume that cant be good for consistency and it seems like I am really having to push on the load lever pretty hard, some cases it takes more effort to seat the bullet than it did to size them. I have also seen a few extremely thin copper shavings appear around the case mouth that I am certain are coming from the bullet jacket. I do my best to set the bullet in the case perfectly plumb vertically before seating.

Am I doing something wrong when seating my rounds? Or anywhere else in my re loading procedure? Is there anything I can do about the ring being left on my rounds during seating? And should I even worry about that?

Sorry for writing a "How I learned to reload on my summer vacation" short story but I figured the more detail I gave the better the help I would receive.

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give.

Sounds like you are doing a lot of good things with the equipment you have. I agree with others to make sure you chamfer well and have the right seating stem for your bullet. I do think your biggest issue with shaving copper is that you have too much neck tension. Measure your brass neck diameter with a micrometer before and after you seat the bullet. If the difference is more than .002 you have too much neck tension (the mouth is significantly smaller than the bullet diameter and it takes too much force to seat the bullet). This is hard on the bullet and hard on your equipment. To fix this buy a mandrel. After resizing you can run a mandrel through the case neck to open it back up so it is .001 smaller than the bullet.

Hope that helps.

 

[bluedog69]

Yes, people have glass bedded their stem. Obviously you've gotta use release agent on the bullet you use as a mould. And keep different stems for different bullet profiles.

I figured as wide and deep as this rabbit hole is(Long Range Hunting Forum) that somebody surely has done it!

Thanks for the comment!

 

[xsn10s]

I have never heard of lapping the stem.
Got me to thinking... I wonder if anyone has glass bedded their stem?
Might have to use a loaded round or seated factory bullet. Make sure it is a "straight" bullet.
Good idea?

I bedded a stem but had better results lapping. However on the really long secant style ogive bullets I just went with getting the ELDM or VLD seating stem. So far I've been really pleased with the results.

 

[xsn10s]

The only time I have seen bullets shaved was when the cases weren't inside chamfered.
I tried to convince the guy but he just knew it was Noslers fault/junk bullets with weak jackets.
He had chamfered the cases last time he reloaded them...and this time he had trimmed them.
I was just in amazement that he couldn't see that the cases were flat as could be at the mouth.

I had bullets shave with just a standard chamfer so I bought a vld chamfer tool. Problem solved but I would try going a bit more deep with the standard chamfer first. If that doesn't work then just get a VLD style chamfer.

 

[bluedog69]

Like other have said get away from the spray lube and buy yourself some Imperial Sizing Wax it

This stuff is awesome. I even used it to turn 270 cases into 25-06. No problem at all!

 

[Pdyson]

Hornady seaters have several seating stem choices to choose from. I used JB Weld on a stem many years ago, used sizing wax as a release agent, and it worked like a charm. For 3 years now, I'm using a micrometer universal seater that adjusts from 224 all the way up to 338. I have written down the settings in my not book for each of the different cartridges and calibers I load for so I can hit my CBTO measurements with a high degree of accuracy every time. It never marks a bullet, but then again I don't crimp, anything but pistol bullets. I don't even crimp for my ARs. I have seen with pistol bullets and a heavy crimp it's possible for the case mouth to bite into the bullet before the seating stem finishes pushing it down. Which will definitely mark the nose.

 

[Keith M Sheehan]

Hi Otto, I've been hand loading for 65 years. All the way from .32 S&W up to .45-90. When I started, it was considered such a dangerous "black art" that the parents of my friends wouldn't let them visit my parents' house while I was hand loading in the basement. Everything I've read from your many respondents is all very excellent help. Believe me, hand loading is an on-going learning process and I can see that you're on the right track. It is a very relaxing, very rewarding pastime, and, with the cost of factory ammo, a necessary process. All the best to you.

 

[GBA1776]

As Koda said, you're well on your way. A couple of points:

1. You didn't specify, but it sounds like you're using Hornady One Shot spray lube, and applying it while the cases are lying flat. I have only used two cans of One Shot, as I prefer Imperial die wax, but for me the great benefit of One Shot is that you can lube the inside of the case neck at the same time if you stand the cases up and spray them lightly. I stand them in a tray of some kind, spray them all lightly, wait 30 seconds for that to dry, then rotate the tray 180 degrees and repeat. Two passes will get the inside and ourside of the case necks properly lubed, and you might find you have less problem on the upstroke of the press.

2. The difficulty of seating some bullets, and the thin ring, might be because of different brass hardness and/or case necks that are not chamfered inside sufficiently. You can address hardness by annealing, but you don't want to get into that at this stage of the game, and probably never for .223. Try inside chamfering a little more and see if that solves the problem.

3. The ring around the bullet is partly because of lack of chamfering, but could also because the seating stem does not fit your bullet properly. You could try lapping the seating stem. Not difficult (hand drill with lapping compound), but maybe not necessary when you get the inside of the case mouth chamfered a little more.

Good luck -- you've got a good start. BTW, is this for a bolt gun or a gas gun?

Thanks for all the advice everyone I really appreciate the help!

I am using Hornady One Shot lube and I have been spraying them while the cases are laying flat and I have not been getting inside the case neck very well. This is such an obvious point I cant believe I was missing it.

When I debur cases after trimming I use one of the prongs on the external case neck chamfer tool to feel inside the case neck to ensure that I have totally removed any burr left from trimming so I don't think its burr causing issue when seating. But I will try to chamfer a little bit more and see if that helps.

I have been seating 73 ELD's but I should get 500 55gr delivered today from a rebate Hornday is offering so when I do get those projectiles I will see if I am leaving a ring on those bullets with a more typical profile.

And I will be using the ammo in an AR.


Thanks again.

 

[Koda_]

And I will be using the ammo in an AR.

You might not need to.... but i crimp my semi auto loads as ive had issues with one shot in the neck causing 223 bullets to not seat as tight and come loose from feeding into the chamber.
I prefer a totally separate step for crimping using a simple cheap Lee Factory Crimp Die. An extra step but much simpler to control seating and crimping separately.
I still use Hornady one shot, so simple to use.

 

[emp1953]

Use one of these.

Deburring Tool .17-.60 | RCBS

Buy Deburring Tool 17- 60 at RCBS, the leading producer of high-quality reloading equipment supplies for over 60 years.

www.rcbs.com

chamfer a good shiny angle on the inside of the case neck. Do one or two cases to get a feel for how much you need to do to stop shaving bullets. Don't over do it. You will get a feel for how much is enough.

 

[emp1953]

Welcome to the reloading world. The advice I would give you at this point is to buy a couple of good reloading manuals and read them thoroughly. The rabbit hole is very deep, but can be very rewarding. Consistency is the key. Measure everything and go slowly. Do not get distracted while in reloading room. Trimming brass is my least favorite part of the process. Lastly, be very cautious on using recommended loads from the internet. Use well known manuals and start low on charges and work up.

Also record what ever you measure in a notebook. That way when you hit on something that works, you know for sure that you can repeat it.

 

[GBA1776]

Like other have said get away from the spray lube and buy yourself some Imperial Sizing Wax it only takes enough to cover the skin on the pad of your index finger to lube a case sufficiently and I only lube every 3 rd case on something as small as 223 but every case on something as large as 30-06 and you can wipe the edge of the throat on the inside of the brass to give the epanding ball a little lubrication every 20 or so I've never seen it matter if you get some Sizing Wax inside the case .Can you tell me why you bought a Hornady press but Rcbs dies??? I have used almost every kind of die and press combo out there in the last 35 years but I find that Lee dies have no problems with build up inside the die and the have a wrench type nut for die adjustment and now have a new style locking nut but I still like the older version.I have some Rcbs dies but have replaced them all with Lee over the years. I just couldn't get past the knurled stems that most people use pliers to tighten them up and I just don't have any place on my reloading bench for Vice Grips or Channel lock pliers( just me nothing wrong with them) other than the marks you are seeing You are definitely ahead of the curve and I wouldn't fret over a few thousands different in OAL if you were shooting a precision rifle in competitions then you would need to invest in a whole different set up like most competitors do.

I got the Hornady press because I liked the quick change bushings that are part of the system plus getting 500 free projectiles (and a few free lock and load bushings) meant it was actually cheaper than something like a Lee Classic Turret press kit. Which is what I was initially looking at buying.
Also the Hornady setup was actually in the store and available.

I was maybe a bit impatient to get started but I really looked at the "lock and load" system how it engaged with the press and I measured the bushings and the tolerance on them was very impressive and they lock in rock solid so I figured I wasn't losing anything by using the system over a turret press like the Lee.

Basically the same thing with RCBS dies, the guy at the store recommended them and they were available, he did have other 3-4 die kits but they were a lot more expensive. This might be a case of a false economy because I am sure I am going to end up buying one of those more expensive die sets, probably sooner rather than later. And maybe the fact that the RCBS were still in the store when everything else was sold out should have been a clue. Oh well.

My RCBS have an 11mm lock nut and then a knurled piece you turn to adjust and I haven't had any issues with them getting stuck and I used an old mechanics trick to hang tools off my bench, cup hooks or bolts screwed into the side of the bench is a perfect place to hang stuff you don't want cluttering up the top of your bench.

So you recommend the Lee sets? I was looking at Hornady match grade dies because they have ELD/VLD seating stems and I have a ton of ELD projectiles.

As far as OAL consistency is concerned I am getting a .003" range of OAL's 2.249-2.252" and the book calls for 2.250 with my projectiles. The guy in the store said not to worry about that and it seems you agree.

 

[GBA1776]

Use one of these.

Deburring Tool .17-.60 | RCBS

Buy Deburring Tool 17- 60 at RCBS, the leading producer of high-quality reloading equipment supplies for over 60 years.

www.rcbs.com

chamfer a good shiny angle on the inside of the case neck. Do one or two cases to get a feel for how much you need to do to stop shaving bullets. Don't over do it. You will get a feel for how much is enough.

Do you mean use that RCBS tool specifically or use a tool like it? I have one of those that looks nearly identical it came in a Lee case trimmer set. I will do some more testing later, I have been running the tool to remove any burrs and feeling for it with the prongs on the tool when I am done but I am not doing it enough to get a beveled edge on the inside of the case mouth.

Sounds like that is one of my issues.

Thanks.