Need brass annealing advice

[epags]

There are services that anneal brass you send them. I have a local shop that has an AMP and does annealing for around $0.15/case.

That is a great price. Even if you only spent $150 for a salt bath DYI system you could have more than 1,000 pieces processed before you broke even. Now I have to look around here for someone who does that.

 

[epags]

catamountsierra, could you share the parts and build on the PID? I also use the salt bath method with the Lee Lead Pot. Much obliged!

Me too^^^^^

 

[Saskquatch6]

How much your brass anneals is determined by the combination of temperature and time; a hotter temperature requires less time and a lower temperature requires more time. For cartridge cases, we also only want to anneal the neck and shoulder, so time becomes a potential control as longer time allows more heat to travel towards the case head. My salt bath runs at 500 degrees C, and stays within about 2 degrees throughout the process (thankyou PID, the Lee thermostat simply can't do that). I watch a second hand and count seconds to keep time consistent, and the case holder I made keeps the depth that the case is in the bath consistent. Automated might be nice, but I can do around 200 cases an hour and not be rushed, and I paid about $150 for the whole setup. Salt bath annealing is also the process used for annealing brass for scientific instruments, so I really don't worry about any lack of consistency that some have claimed. It works as long as I can pay attention and keep the time consistent.

Catamountsierra says it so well I won't repeat - however I just recently started SBA because I was frustrated by inconsistent neck tension and shoulder bump from work/fire hardened brass. So I measured 10 cases of 4x fired Winchester 300 WSM brass then annealed them (530•C/6s) and bumped the shoulder .002" using custom RCBS sizing die (stem removed). One case out of the 10 bumped .0035 greater than the 1.7410" shoulder target and of the rest 7 were at 1.7410" +/- .0005" and 2 were +/- .001". I then neck sized with Lee Collet die and when seating 165 Accubonds I can say it felt the smoothest and most consistent since using virgin brass. I know for some this small sample does not give spectacular numbers, but for me they are a huge improvement over case prep without annealing. SBA seemed to work really well and I expect brass life to be extended significantly. Hopefully group size will be positively impacted as well (but it's going to have to get a whole lot warmer around here to test that out!) Just a couple of additional thoughts - I downloaded a free metronome app on my phone and found it easy to hear the seconds tick as I focused my attention on the annealing process, brass, etc. Secondly I purchased the kit from Ballistics Recreations and bought the regular case holder - the 300WSM case just fit and when heated it was a bit snug - a few minutes with dremmel tool and all was good. Certainly not saying SBA is the best annealing system but it is relatively inexpensive, easy, consistent and does the job I want it to.

 

[Bucklowery]

Anyone annealed the nickel plated Winchester cases

Thanks
Buck

 

[whatnext]

Anyone annealed the nickel plated Winchester cases

Thanks
Buck

Yes. According to AMP tests showed they anneal the same as raw brass.

 

[Bucklowery]

Thanks

Buck

 

[catamountsierra]

Here is a little write up. I hope this helps anyone who wants to try this.

 

[sedancowboy]

I have been reloading for 52 years and annealing has been one of the biggest improvements to SDs and ESs that I have made. Consistency is the key to good numbers. I researched all the annealers on the market at the time I decided to purchase. Salt Bath has its followers but liquid salt at 932F did not appeal to me and dropping your precision brass into water was also undesirable then they have to be dried. more time plus water in a cartridge case is never a good thing.
Also the Salt is extremely corrosive. The Lee lead pots rust. Last you have to anneal your cartridges one at a time plus time them to be consistent.
The AMP II is a awesome unit but very expensive and again you do one at a time.
So I started looking at flame annealers (that is what factories use) and decided that one of these with a magazine to hold 50 cases might be the way to go. At the time I looked at Annealize and Mike's Reloading units. I chose Mikes for $399 at the time. It is robust and easy to operate take a scrap piece of brass and paint some templiq inside the case neck line up the flame to the neck shoulder junction and adjust the time to melt the templiq and you are good to go. I anneal every time I reload and it has improved my numbers by a lot.
You don't have to watch it run and it will do 50 cases while you do something else. I don't leave the room but you don't have to babysit it. I do use a bulk tank so the flame stays consistent. It certainly is as safe as SBA and requires much less input from the operator.
Current prices are Annealize is $275 and Mikes is $449.
Just my two cents worth.
Henry

 

[chris ross]

I am far from an annealing expert but here is my take. Yes, your brass will last for more firings so long as the primer pockets stay and case stretch isn't an issue. Done correctly, at the right temperature and duration, not only will your brass not get work hardened, your neck tension will be more consistent and accuracy will improve given all other factors are solid. If money isn't an option, get an anneal-eez or some other type of commercially made annealer. Mine is like the DIY annealer on YouTube and it works great but I also don't anneal mass quantity. Others on LRH will chime in as there are a bunch of annealers here with great set-ups.

I bought the Anneal-eez and it is very good and easy to work. I anneal after every shooting and have close to 12-15 shootings on my 6.5 Hornady brass. I'm not a big fan of the Hornady brass, but I've had to can only a handful of the brass

 

[Bucklowery]

I have been reloading for 52 years and annealing has been one of the biggest improvements to SDs and ESs that I have made. Consistency is the key to good numbers. I researched all the annealers on the market at the time I decided to purchase. Salt Bath has its followers but liquid salt at 932F did not appeal to me and dropping your precision brass into water was also undesirable then they have to be dried. more time plus water in a cartridge case is never a good thing.
Also the Salt is extremely corrosive. The Lee lead pots rust. Last you have to anneal your cartridges one at a time plus time them to be consistent.
The AMP II is a awesome unit but very expensive and again you do one at a time.
So I started looking at flame annealers (that is what factories use) and decided that one of these with a magazine to hold 50 cases might be the way to go. At the time I looked at Annealize and Mike's Reloading units. I chose Mikes for $399 at the time. It is robust and easy to operate take a scrap piece of brass and paint some templiq inside the case neck line up the flame to the neck shoulder junction and adjust the time to melt the templiq and you are good to go. I anneal every time I reload and it has improved my numbers by a lot.
You don't have to watch it run and it will do 50 cases while you do something else. I don't leave the room but you don't have to babysit it. I do use a bulk tank so the flame stays consistent. It certainly is as safe as SBA and requires much less input from the operator.
Current prices are Annealize is $275 and Mikes is $449.
Just my two cents worth.
Henry

Do you have a link to mike's unit

Also which( temperature) templaq
Are y'all using to set up machine for cases
Thanks

Buck

 

[Spoonbill]

I have been reloading for 52 years and annealing has been one of the biggest improvements to SDs and ESs that I have made. Consistency is the key to good numbers. I researched all the annealers on the market at the time I decided to purchase. Salt Bath has its followers but liquid salt at 932F did not appeal to me and dropping your precision brass into water was also undesirable then they have to be dried. more time plus water in a cartridge case is never a good thing.
Also the Salt is extremely corrosive. The Lee lead pots rust. Last you have to anneal your cartridges one at a time plus time them to be consistent.
The AMP II is a awesome unit but very expensive and again you do one at a time.
So I started looking at flame annealers (that is what factories use) and decided that one of these with a magazine to hold 50 cases might be the way to go. At the time I looked at Annealize and Mike's Reloading units. I chose Mikes for $399 at the time. It is robust and easy to operate take a scrap piece of brass and paint some templiq inside the case neck line up the flame to the neck shoulder junction and adjust the time to melt the templiq and you are good to go. I anneal every time I reload and it has improved my numbers by a lot.
You don't have to watch it run and it will do 50 cases while you do something else. I don't leave the room but you don't have to babysit it. I do use a bulk tank so the flame stays consistent. It certainly is as safe as SBA and requires much less input from the operator.
Current prices are Annealize is $275 and Mikes is $449.
Just my two cents worth.
Henry

This is an excellent thread and b being a mechanical engineer it has my attention. I have used the Annealize for three years now and have no issues as long as you have it set up properly. I do have one question. AT what point in the reloading process, do you perform the annealing?? Immediately after cleaning the brass but before resizing or just before priming ( after resizing ). From a technical standpoint I would'nt necessarily call this "annealing" as there is no carbon in Brass to cause work hardening, but i more appropriately call this "conditioning". Anyone have more thoughts on this subject??

 

[LRNut]

I used to do the drill and flame method but it is insanely slow, so I bought the original AMP annealer. I love it so much I bought the Aztec model for my Colorado place. I anneal every time I load. One at a time? Wow, it takes only a few seconds for each case.

There is mention of limiting your shoulder bump to prolong case life. I would also add take out the expander on your decapping pin and use a mandrel die to expand necks - definitely reduces the amount of case trimming required (another thing I do every time I load).

 

[Crowflyt]

If you use the Google machine, there are several "brass annealing services" that are much more cost effective for low volume reloaders. Most use the induction process and charge by the 100.

 

[sedancowboy]

Do you have a link to mike's unit

Also which( temperature) templaq
Are y'all using to set up machine for cases
Thanks

Buck

Mike's Reloading Bench-Home

I use 750F on the inside of the neck. I might add watch Eric Cantana's videos on Annealing.
Henry