Mitigating Barrel Whip and Harmonics

[25WSM]

Thanks guys. I'm at the Pittsburgh hospital now. They did take care of me for the ride here in the ambulance. But now I've been here 3 hrs and they still haven't given me my regular pain pills yet so I'm laying here in a level 8 pain with nothing. Let's hope this doesn't represent the care I'm going to get.
Shep

 

[DSheetz]

fair winds and following seas Shep .

 

[GLTaylor]

fair winds and following seas Shep .

You've been incredibly helpful and kind to me. You're in my prayers. Get better soon and have good results!

 

[GunHawk]

Try this site
http://www.the-long-family.com/OBT_paper.htm

Thanks for the information

 

[StumpGrinder]

I have used the de resonator rings, they work, and they work very well, move the ring 1/2" at a time. I start with the ring just off the forearm tip and move toward the muzzle.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...FD7CCDEB706DBA87697BFD7CCDEB706D&&FORM=VDRVRV

A friend invented the Browning Boss system, and they work in spades. Accuracy ends up being a single ragged bullet hole, even with BAR's in 7 Mag, 30/06, and 270 that I have had them on.

Don't over look standard tuners, and they are easy to use, just different...

Harrells precision makes a dandy for $95

http://harrellsprec.com/index.php/products/tuner-brakes

RAS tuner brake

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...01D3AF49C8E07A5A773301D3AF49C8E07A5&FORM=VIRE

Mike Ezel tuner

http://www.ezellcustomrifles.com/home-3/pdt-tuners/

First time you put a tuner ring on your barrel, you will be impressed. Focus the groups shooting two shot groups...hard to believe just how simple this works.

I have been watching videos by Eric Cortina a professional long range shooter and he does all 3. He finds his load, then tunes his seating depth to find the widest node and he makes his own barrel tunners. He has them for sale on his website but you have to have your barrel threaded. I just researched and bought 6 limbsavers. In one of Eric's vidios he was preparing for a match and didn't have time to do all of his normal load work up so he loaded his pet load to 20k off jam and tuned with the tuner. Competition 22lr shooters have been using barrel tuners for years, factory ammo is all they have! I wonder if it would help on a muzzleloader???

 

[MWFromOK]

That brake-born whipping is occurring after the bullet is released though. Right?

I think increased weight of the muzzle brake in this case improved accuracy, but just wasn't noted.

 

[asd9055]

I think increased weight of the muzzle brake in this case improved accuracy, but just wasn't noted.

The original was the BOSS developed by Browning in the 1993. People didn't understand it and put it down. Now everyone makes one. Before the BOSS one company was selling a rubber "dougnut" one would slide over the barrel and try to tune it. Chris Long wrote about OBT and has a way to tune your barrel by load. There are even a 3-d barrel harmonic finite element analysis

Barrel Harmonics Mode Shape Movies

I have been using the BOSS system with M70 or Chris Long's OBT method for a long time.

 

[Opa-lopa]

Barrel motion is a forced vibration, "harmonics" happen long after the bullet has left the barrel. Is there an optimum muzzle velocity to reduce changes and n barrel pointing at bullet exit & make groups smaller? Sure. The Browning "Boss" system changes the barrel vibration frequency when the brake is moved & reduces pointing changes when properly positioned. Flutes? Reduce barrel mass and don't change stiffness much so they increase the first bending mode frequency. Does it help make groups smaller? I think it's a crapshoot. I'd tell you there hasn't been a straight barrel made in all of human history, it all depends on what level of straightness is "good enough ".

 

[asd9055]

Barrel motion is a forced vibration, "harmonics" happen long after the bullet has left the barrel. Is there an optimum muzzle velocity to reduce changes and n barrel pointing at bullet exit & make groups smaller? Sure. The Browning "Boss" system changes the barrel vibration frequency when the brake is moved & reduces pointing changes when properly positioned. Flutes? Reduce barrel mass and don't change stiffness much so they increase the first bending mode frequency. Does it help make groups smaller? I think it's a crapshoot. I'd tell you there hasn't been a straight barrel made in all of human history, it all depends on what level of straightness is "good enough ".

I tuned 11 rifles with the BOSS...maybe I should hit the crabtables at Las Vegas
OBT prediction works...
or maybe it just works for a few people...not everybody

 

[Mikecr]

Barrel tuning with a device like BOSS, and OBT, have nothing to do with each other.
OBT is about vibrations traveling back & forth at the speed of sound in carbon steel, or stainless steel (which is it?). These vibrations at the muzzle, open the muzzle, and would not be desired at the muzzle on bullet release.
Barrel tuning affects whip. Where the muzzle is pointed on bullet release.

 

[asd9055]

The point is they both work!
I have and tune 11 rifles with BOSS, I bothered to learn how it works....I also check my loads for OBT even on those.
I have a few rifles without ANY BOSS or Barrel tuners, those I have found that if my OBT is close I get better groups
Someone experienced or well versed on finite element analysis might be able to point out the difference. I just know how to apply it to my benefit, don't need to know the details.
https://www.varmintal.com/amode.htm this shows a loight on barrel "movement"
But now that is cat is out of the BAG, has anyone tried a suppressor on a Browing/Winchester with BOSS? If yes how do you tune it? Same way?

 

[WildRose]

Weight is your friend, And the heavier the contour the more consistent the rifle will be.
Almost any barrel can be accurate but the lighter the contour/barrel weight, the more finicky it will be.

Also the shorter the barrel normally the less barrel whip. I have also found that straight tapers normally do a better job of reducing harmonics. The longer the barrel the more likely it will have barrel whip especially with the heavy bullets.

Fluting does not reduce whipping or harmonics, It only increases it because it removes material. a un fluted barrel that weighs the same as a fluted barrel has the same basic
caricaturists.

Structural strength and rigidity are best with a fast taper, the problem is that if a barrel needs to be 26'' or longer the fast taper will be very small at the muzzle The limbsavor does work but looks so ugly in my opinion. This is the reason that many factory rifles have tip pressure applied to the barrel at the fore end of the stock. It make the barrel act like it is very short. (The length from the tip pressure point to the muzzle).

I always recommend a #4 or #5 as a good medium barrel contour and for the potent big bores 30 cal+, I recommend a minimum of a #6 straight taper.

One more pound of barrel weight can definitely be worth it in accuracy.

Just my opinion

J E CUSTOM

I find heavier barrels to be more accurate simply because it takes more energy to throw them off target. A little gust of wind will have a greater effect on a 6lbs rig vs a 12lbs rig.

I've literally watched light barreled rifles move an easy foot or more simply due to the movement induced by your heart beat.

From a physics perspective it may not make the rifle itself more accurate but it certainly tends to make us more accurate with them.

I also find that with my disabilities and age it's simply much harder for me to get truly steady on target in the best of circumstances without a good rest or brace.... . The heavier rifles are really a big help in that regard.

I've actually found adding weight to the fore end to be a useful aid as well.

Added weight whether in the stock, barrel, or combination of both just makes for steadier and hence more accurate shooting for most.

 

[smokey3]

Th

Heavier barrels are not more accurate. They simply absorb more heat from repeated firing without heating up as much as a light barrel would.

There are 2 schools of thought on the harmonics thing... either dampen them to death or support and accentuate them. My match rifles sit in aluminum chassis and get the actions epoxy bedded, the recoil lugs epoxy bedded, the scope rail epoxy bedded and many other little things get done which in the end net me a rifle that positively rings like a bell when you cycle the bolt. There are no voids for vibrations to have trouble crossing.

I know quite a number of people that have dampeners on their barrels. I can't say it has definitely helped anyone with anything. To me it looks like a way to take 10 bucks from people that are desperate.

They are not very attractive either, IMO.

 

[asd9055]

I find heavier barrels to be more accurate simply because it takes more energy to throw them off target. A little gust of wind will have a greater effect on a 6lbs rig vs a 12lbs rig.

I've literally watched light barreled rifles move an easy foot or more simply due to the movement induced by your heart beat.

From a physics perspective it may not make the rifle itself more accurate but it certainly tends to make us more accurate with them.

I also find that with my disabilities and age it's simply much harder for me to get truly steady on target in the best of circumstances without a good rest or brace.... . The heavier rifles are really a big help in that regard.

I've actually found adding weight to the fore end to be a useful aid as well.

Added weight whether in the stock, barrel, or combination of both just makes for steadier and hence more accurate shooting for most.

Good Ole JE...he sure is missed!