Load Development... what’s your process

[nicholasjohn]

A buddy was giving me a hard time about my load development process so I thought I'd put it to you folks. How do you go about load development? Let's NOT go into great detail, or try to argue with each other about who is right, just post your simplified process.

I know that there are a bazillion different ways to skin this cat and we all have our own motivations.... but I want to see if there is a consensus.

BEFORE we get into this, I want to say, my time is more valuable to me than components. I LOVE to shoot, BUT I have a wife and two little kids that deserve my attention. With that, I get very few opportunities to shoot through various load tests. If I get shooting time, I'd rather be shooting rocks from field positions. As such, this is my modified way of "rushing" through ladder tests and load development. YES, I know that I should shoot 3-5 shots at each powder increment. I'm probably going to keep doing this, because it's working for me (I have 3 different bullets that will shoot just over half - good enough for me.... but I am still looking for that ragged hole unicorn).

Parameters: Hunting purposes only (let's say 600 yds, mulies, elk, bears and rock chucks).
Caliber: 7 RM
Rifle: semi custom - Full workup on Rem 700 action, Proof at 22", Trigger Tech, in bedded stocky's VG2.

My process:
Select components: Barnes 139, 145 and 150, Hornady 162, Nosler 150 and 160. RL26, H4831, IMR4831, H1000
Select brass and primer (let's not even go there).

With selected bullet and primer, load one bullet at SAAMI length, at half grain increments, from lowest to max suggested. So if suggested range is 68.0 to 71.0, I'd load one bullet in each increment at 68.0, 68.5, 69.0, 69.5, 70.0, 70.5 and 71.0.

Shoot ladder test (yes, only one bullet per increment - you had better be on your A game and willing to call shooter error/flyers). Do this until you notice pressure.

If you find 3 consecutive increments that group well, focus on that "node". Alter the charge weight and then seating depth. Hopefully you find a unicorn.

If you don't find a unicorn, move on to the next variation (either swap to different powder or give up on that bullet).

SO, I'm simple concise terms, what's your process?

Bumpkin,

It looks to me like you've streamlined the process to the point where it works beautifully for your purposes. Congratulations, Sir - nice work. Tell your know-it-all buddy to mind his own business, and then go have fun with your wife & kids. It's wise to make sure that by the time they're old enough to go shoot rocks with you that they still like their dear ol' Dad. Mothers like to see their kids getting along with their father, too. There's more to life than punching round holes in faraway pieces of paper.


Nick

 

[NEMTHunter]

I will put this out there
How can you tell if there is a node by firing 1 shot

In the end its whatever works for you & your happy with the way it works

If you get rounds that span a grain or more that group in the same spot but the ones after and before do not. You know there is a good nod there.

Thats how I do it. After I find a spot where a span of charges that shoot the same. I then load up about three of each of them, then test it.

It has always worked for me. And I use less supply's doing it. And spend less time testing loads.

I can understand if others do not do it. That's fine. Do what works for you or what you feel the best doing.

 

[Remmy700]

Tagging In!

 

[fightthenoise]

I'm hoping this one-shot-per-load thing pans out because I had pretty good results yesterday. I'm skeptical you can see these things at 100 yards, but at 300 it's quite obvious. Here is RL17 + ELD-X 178's in a 30-06 Model 70.

 

[coyotezapper]

A buddy was giving me a hard time about my load development process so I thought I'd put it to you folks. How do you go about load development? Let's NOT go into great detail, or try to argue with each other about who is right, just post your simplified process.

I know that there are a bazillion different ways to skin this cat and we all have our own motivations.... but I want to see if there is a consensus.

BEFORE we get into this, I want to say, my time is more valuable to me than components. I LOVE to shoot, BUT I have a wife and two little kids that deserve my attention. With that, I get very few opportunities to shoot through various load tests. If I get shooting time, I'd rather be shooting rocks from field positions. As such, this is my modified way of "rushing" through ladder tests and load development. YES, I know that I should shoot 3-5 shots at each powder increment. I'm probably going to keep doing this, because it's working for me (I have 3 different bullets that will shoot just over half - good enough for me.... but I am still looking for that ragged hole unicorn).

Parameters: Hunting purposes only (let's say 600 yds, mulies, elk, bears and rock chucks).
Caliber: 7 RM
Rifle: semi custom - Full workup on Rem 700 action, Proof at 22", Trigger Tech, in bedded stocky's VG2.

My process:
Select components: Barnes 139, 145 and 150, Hornady 162, Nosler 150 and 160. RL26, H4831, IMR4831, H1000
Select brass and primer (let's not even go there).

With selected bullet and primer, load one bullet at SAAMI length, at half grain increments, from lowest to max suggested. So if suggested range is 68.0 to 71.0, I'd load one bullet in each increment at 68.0, 68.5, 69.0, 69.5, 70.0, 70.5 and 71.0.

Shoot ladder test (yes, only one bullet per increment - you had better be on your A game and willing to call shooter error/flyers). Do this until you notice pressure.

If you find 3 consecutive increments that group well, focus on that "node". Alter the charge weight and then seating depth. Hopefully you find a unicorn.

If you don't find a unicorn, move on to the next variation (either swap to different powder or give up on that bullet).

SO, I'm simple concise terms, what's your process?

Look at this method and pay attention to who the guy is who started the thread. I think he knows a little about LR. It's not my method but similar. I use Quickload and a Oehler chronograph which speeds up this process.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/long-range-load-development-at-100-yards.3814361/

 

[longtubeman]

Alot of great ideas, I have found my loads a bit faster way. Been doing this from late 80s. Use a chrono, and start with 2 grains below max in a few books, and go 2 over max in books. Dont have to shoot them all, stop with pressure marks. Go up in .5 at a time, looking at cases for any Mark's, on primers, or cases. I always start with max col to fit in mag.it only takes 6-8 rouns to find a node. When you see pressure signs, you stop. Most good loads , for any gun, are about 1 grain below max. Yes I'm a speed freek.lol. I did a 308 load for a savage tactical, 20" barrel. Only took 13 bullits to get two loads. Both grouped .125. I did a110 vmax at 3450 fps, and a 168, at 2850. Both grouped the same. From there you can fine tune every thing else. Hope this helps someone!

 

[stljc2]

1st I pressure test the loading..Example: 1 round 36.0, next round 36.5 and so on till I reach the max recommended powder load...IF I had no pressure signs (heavy bolt lift and the like). All shots at different bulls. Looking for the dead on zero, If there is one. Checking and recording my sd, es and ft /s. Pick a good sd, es and ft/s to start out with. Load up 3 rounds on where I want to start, utilizing a known good CBTO. If the CBTO isn't known I'll start 20 thou off the lands and utilize that through this stage. I do the 3 round work up per .5 gr step process rechecking groups and sd/es, ft/s. when I find a group with the results I want I load up 5 rounds and step up my gr weight .2, .4 and see if it improves. If not then I start playing around with the seating to see if it'll improve. when I find something I like...I go with it. Of course I do this with each and every change of components (brass, primers, lot # of powder, lot # of bullets). Long and drawn out I know..but it works for me.

 

[stljc2]

1st I pressure test the loading..Example: 1 round 36.0, next round 36.5 and so on till I reach the max recommended powder load...IF I had no pressure signs (heavy bolt lift and the like). All shots at different bulls. Looking for the dead on zero, If there is one. Checking and recording my sd, es and ft /s. Pick a good sd, es and ft/s to start out with. Load up 3 rounds on where I want to start, utilizing a known good CBTO. If the CBTO isn't known I'll start 20 thou off the lands and utilize that through this stage. I do the 3 round work up per .5 gr step process rechecking groups and sd/es, ft/s. when I find a group with the results I want I load up 5 rounds and step up my gr weight .2, .4 and see if it improves. If not then I start playing around with the seating to see if it'll improve. when I find something I like...I go with it. Of course I do this with each and every change of components (brass, primers, lot # of powder, lot # of bullets). Long and drawn out I know..but it works for me.

 

[Remmy700]

Back in the day I would load 20 rounds up. 10 rounds at .3 gr increments climbing to where I am pretty sure I am going to be getting into pressure. I would load another 10 in the same charges as the first 10. I would shoot them on chrono paying close attention to flat spots while also shooting them into 10 separate groups, 2 shots into each group. This was one of the best ways I found to get a really good idea of not only where my good SDs are vs bad ones but also giving me a good glimpse of group size. Now I know two rounds is not going to tell the entire story by no means but it is a really good insight with a little more information given than the 10 round load test that Saterlee uses. That method worked great for me and I could normally find a good low SD, accurate load right under pressure ceiling relatively quick. I am going to try you method also and see how it compares. Thanks for sharing.

 

[fightthenoise]

Now I know two rounds is not going to tell the entire story by no means but it is a really good insight

Everyone dogs on small sample groups, but the truth of the matter is if 2 shots don't group, 5 definitely won't either.

 

[Remmy700]

Yes sir, that is my view also.

 

[YZ-80]

My load development:
1) Make sure I got what I need (brass, bullet, powder, etc)
2) Prep brass. If new, do some limited new brass prep.
3) Get ogive measurement w/OAL gage and bullet of choice. Back it off .020"
4) Decide what charge to load at first rung of ladder. Usually start in the middle of a published range but load check charges in .5 gr increments from starting published minimum up to that point and use these as sighters/bore foulers.
5) load 6 rounds at each charge increment for two 3-shot groups at each charge. Monitor all dimensional parameters for uniformity and check concentricity.
6) go shoot. Hone in on charge weights that produce tightest group.
7) go home and load up for 5- shot groups at the 2 best charge weights.
8) Adopt the load that gives me .25 to .50 MOA and less than .5 MOA vertical dispersion at 300 yards.

Works for me and I usually have my load developed in 40-50 rounds.

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

A buddy was giving me a hard time about my load development process so I thought I'd put it to you folks. How do you go about load development? Let's NOT go into great detail, or try to argue with each other about who is right, just post your simplified process.

I know that there are a bazillion different ways to skin this cat and we all have our own motivations.... but I want to see if there is a consensus.

BEFORE we get into this, I want to say, my time is more valuable to me than components. I LOVE to shoot, BUT I have a wife and two little kids that deserve my attention. With that, I get very few opportunities to shoot through various load tests. If I get shooting time, I'd rather be shooting rocks from field positions. As such, this is my modified way of "rushing" through ladder tests and load development. YES, I know that I should shoot 3-5 shots at each powder increment. I'm probably going to keep doing this, because it's working for me (I have 3 different bullets that will shoot just over half - good enough for me.... but I am still looking for that ragged hole unicorn).

Parameters: Hunting purposes only (let's say 600 yds, mulies, elk, bears and rock chucks).

Caliber: 7 RM
Rifle: semi custom - Full workup on Rem 700 action, Proof at 22", Trigger Tech, in bedded stocky's VG2.

My process:
Select components: Barnes 139, 145 and 150, Hornady 162, Nosler 150 and 160. RL26, H4831, IMR4831, H1000
Select brass and primer (let's not even go there).

With selected bullet and primer, load one bullet at SAAMI length, at half grain increments, from lowest to max suggested. So if suggested range is 68.0 to 71.0, I'd load one bullet in each increment at 68.0, 68.5, 69.0, 69.5, 70.0, 70.5 and 71.0.

Shoot ladder test (yes, only one bullet per increment - you had better be on your A game and willing to call shooter error/flyers). Do this until you notice pressure.

If you find 3 consecutive increments that group well, focus on that "node". Alter the charge weight and then seating depth. Hopefully you find a unicorn.

If you don't find a unicorn, move on to the next variation (either swap to different powder or give up on that bullet).

SO, I'm simple concise terms, what's your process?

I never shoot 3 shots at each powder lever either... simply a waste of time. I will run up from start (or below) on a new rifle but once I have a known quantity I'm more inclined to give her a bit more to start with.
Once I have a pressure run up I'll move on to shooting a few groups with the part of the run up that shows promise. I'll usually load three of each for a charge or three and if they shoot well at 200 I'll load another 20 or more and shoot differing conditions to make sure I have a real load. If the rifle passes muster I'll load a hundred or two and start shooting.
That doesn't mean I'm done chasing my tail (I'll work on other stuff too; I've got a few thousand bullets without a load waiting on l.d. and each rifle I own has a decent load); I just want every rifle I own to have at least one decent load or it is wasting space in my gun safe.

 

[emp1953]

I recently bought 1000 demilled Federal cases in .270win. they came primed and cleaned. Since I didn't know how they had been stored I choose not to trust the primers. I also tumble clean them. I run each case through a full length sizer and deprime each case. (I should have prefaced this with, I'm retired and have a lot of time on my hands). I use a handheld Lee case trimmer on each one getting all the cases to the same length. As I reload I will also randomly check length with a dial caliper. I ream the necks to get the shoulder off from the trimming process. I am shooting a Sig SHR970.

Since I wanted to load 150gr Noslers I went to the nosler website and got load data. Nosler claimed their most accurate load was with 52gr H4350 it was also listed as the Max load. When working up a load I ALWAYS shoot 3-5 shot groups. So I loaded up 5 rounds each of 50.5gr 50.6 in 0.1 gr increments to 51.9 gr. I had Partitions and Accubonds. This also ended up being an experiment to see if the two types of bullets shot to the same point of impact. To make a long story short all 15 loads gave me MOA grouping at 100yds. The different loadings shot to a different point of impact but all the groups were under an inch. The best was 1/2", 51g H4350 with both the Accubonds and the Partitions. But to a different point of aim.

So I found the node for that powder/bullet/case/primer combination. Next was to play with the bullet distance from the lands. I took 5 unprimed uncharged cases and seated bullets in them pretty far out of the case and chambered them slowly and gingerly. After locking the bolt, I slowly and carefully opened the bolt pulled the rounds and measured them with a dial caliper. All were the same length so I set my seating die to that OAL. My usual goto distance off the lands is .020 So I started there. I did .015, .020, .025, .030. During this process keep in mind that increasing the distance from the lands is increasing the internal volume of the case, effectively decreasing the velocity slightly. Conversely increasing the distance from the lands decreases the internal volume of the case, increasing the velocity slightly.

The original .020 that I originally selected was the best performer. Chronographed at 2720fps +/- 7fps. I set a goal in my head for grouping size. Once I hit it I don't shoot the rest of my loads. Why bother. I break the left overs down and reload them with my best load.

Yes it is time consuming. But when I put the cross hairs on a nice buck at 250yds and miss, I can only blame the jerk behind the trigger. Knowing all this info about my loads I can confidently take a long shot and I have, 605yds, the deer dropped in its tracks using the 150gr partition. I figured it out with a phone app to be 48 clicks on the scope elevation. I could only get 44 clicks so I held the horizontal cross hair right on the top of the deer's back and let go. Doing all this work gets the most out of your rifle and makes your reloading efforts all worth the work and attention to detail.