The issue is not the rifle at all. The issue is their lack of response or communications. Its been stated numerous times we don't know what caused the incident. Most in this thread understands that quite well, its the extremely poor customer service that has this thread humming along. Like stated, if its not the rifle like many believe, so say so, return, repair or say something! They have lost more potential sales from their poor customer service than if it were truly a rifle problem. We all understand a product can have a problem and accept that if the manufacturer STANDS behind their product.
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They could have VERY easily handled it in a way that made this thread never exist.
Non of us here have enough data and the expertise combined to draw a conclusion as to whose fault it is.
What we are criticizing the it apathy and luck of response from Beretta!
I was on the service side for 20 years and I understand service and liability.
Beretta could have said:
1. Our experts determined it was not a faulty rifle, we are sending everything back. Check with ammunition.
Or
2. We determined it is not a faulty rifle but as a good faith towards our customers we will send you a new rifle. Sign NDA
Simple as that!
What we are criticizing the it apathy and luck of response from Beretta!
I was on the service side for 20 years and I understand service and liability.
Beretta could have said:
1. Our experts determined it was not a faulty rifle, we are sending everything back. Check with ammunition.
Or
2. We determined it is not a faulty rifle but as a good faith towards our customers we will send you a new rifle. Sign NDA
Simple as that!
D
Deleted member 115360
Guest
Thank you to the folks who see the issue here.
Those of you who some how magically know that it was the ammo and not the rifle are amazing. Beretta made thr rifle and they haven't been able to do that with it in their possession for almost 8 months. Some of you can do it from your ez chair, amazing. Here's the thing, when my rifle exploded in my hands, it never crossed my mind to send it to Hornady (who didn't manufacture it) to see what went wrong. Some of these responses are idiotic. Some of you also don't seem to realize that a bolt action rifle isn't supposed to dump an overpressure into the magazine. At a minimum it is a design flaw. Anyways, my issue is their lack of customer service. I own benelli shotguns, Tikka rifles, beretta pistols, and I just bought a new Sauer 6.5prc last month. I have been a customer for 3 decades, and they won't even grant me the courtesy of a phone call, going into the 8th month.
Those of you who some how magically know that it was the ammo and not the rifle are amazing. Beretta made thr rifle and they haven't been able to do that with it in their possession for almost 8 months. Some of you can do it from your ez chair, amazing. Here's the thing, when my rifle exploded in my hands, it never crossed my mind to send it to Hornady (who didn't manufacture it) to see what went wrong. Some of these responses are idiotic. Some of you also don't seem to realize that a bolt action rifle isn't supposed to dump an overpressure into the magazine. At a minimum it is a design flaw. Anyways, my issue is their lack of customer service. I own benelli shotguns, Tikka rifles, beretta pistols, and I just bought a new Sauer 6.5prc last month. I have been a customer for 3 decades, and they won't even grant me the courtesy of a phone call, going into the 8th month.
D
Deleted member 115360
Guest
Irrational? 7 months without a single contact? A half dozen calls and multiple emails without a response, and I'm irrational?
What world do you live in?
Here is my Pleasant experience with a major firearms company, SigSauer.
A few years ago I bought a Sig556. First day out barrel split near the muzzle brake. Called Sig before I got home from the range. They send me a prepaid box to send the rifle to them. Upon receiving the rifle and examining it, they determined I must have left something in the barrel. They told me they would replace the barrel for what was the barrel cost to them, which was $100 total. And shipped it back to me!
They could have charge me a lot more, but they didn't. I own a few Sigs now.
That is what customer service is! That is what Beretta could have done and there would have been a ton of positive comments instead of this
A few years ago I bought a Sig556. First day out barrel split near the muzzle brake. Called Sig before I got home from the range. They send me a prepaid box to send the rifle to them. Upon receiving the rifle and examining it, they determined I must have left something in the barrel. They told me they would replace the barrel for what was the barrel cost to them, which was $100 total. And shipped it back to me!
They could have charge me a lot more, but they didn't. I own a few Sigs now.
That is what customer service is! That is what Beretta could have done and there would have been a ton of positive comments instead of this
Not a rifle but I had some bad ammo from Remington for my .44Mag, brass split badly and would not eject from my Blackhawk years ago. Had to punch out with small wooden dowel. Called them and they knew of problem and said they would send replacement ammo. I gave them address of LGS. Week later I get call from LGS little bit bewildered. What's up I said? He said I have some ammo here for you and said I was expecting some. LGS said were you expecting a case of 1,000!? Now that was CS!!
capona
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a good design to me. Where is it supposed to go?
You don't want the overpressure going back into your head do you? It's got to go somewhere. Going down into the mag well is better than any alternative pathway.
capona
Well-Known Member
Excellent contacts to use for written correspondence.
CC anyone else you have had contact with so they know it has high vis.
Time to write, not phone. Documentation. There's no excuse for poor communication from Tikka but once things go into legal it can go dark for a period. They maybe working with Hornady in the background to make determinations.
If there was a pending recall potential, I'd expect this kind of thing. And I'm not indicating what company would do that recall. I'm just saying from an operational process standpoint, things have to happen.
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West Calamus
Well-Known Member
Don't know about a tikka but a model 70 damm sure drops over pressure into the magazine. Right back though the bolt firing pin hole through the 2 vent holes in the bolt . I would never shoot one of those slick bolts that did not have vent ports. Just don't want bolts parts driving into my head if I ever have another catastrophic event.
West Calamus
Well-Known Member
But do agree with you that you are getting horrible customer service...
D
Deleted member 115360
Guest
I stand corrected. I just did some reading, and it sounds like several manufacturers vent overpressure into the magazine. I learned something today. Thank you.
Bob Wright
Well-Known Member
Remington and others vent it sideways in the area of the bolt/lug cavity behind the breech. Not all rifles are the same, of course. Weatherby vents gas sideways thru the bolt.
If this rifle is in limbo in the legal department they're taking way too much time for your situation.
If there are numerous situations of the same problem, which means an engineering fix and tests have to occur, possibly a recall. We don't know what is going on there, admittedely, but the silence is concerning.
No excuse to not communicate status and send you $ or an upgraded rifle option if there is a product safety issue, using ammo that cannot contain the pressure. I'm hearing split brass on this cartridge is happening with some frequency. That's a contributing factor if not "the" factor. Your photos bear that out.
In my engineering experience, dumping high pressure hot gas into plastic components (in a dead headed pressure situation) containing ammunition is a questionable practice. The results spoke in your situation, whether or not your mag had ammo in it. The HMR cartridge obviously had enough pressure to disintegrate the parts and sling them 50 feet. I don't think the Remington and Weatherby gas path designs would have allowed this. I've pierced primers in my reloading and gas vented safely away, on the Remington.
If this rifle is in limbo in the legal department they're taking way too much time for your situation.
If there are numerous situations of the same problem, which means an engineering fix and tests have to occur, possibly a recall. We don't know what is going on there, admittedely, but the silence is concerning.
No excuse to not communicate status and send you $ or an upgraded rifle option if there is a product safety issue, using ammo that cannot contain the pressure. I'm hearing split brass on this cartridge is happening with some frequency. That's a contributing factor if not "the" factor. Your photos bear that out.
In my engineering experience, dumping high pressure hot gas into plastic components (in a dead headed pressure situation) containing ammunition is a questionable practice. The results spoke in your situation, whether or not your mag had ammo in it. The HMR cartridge obviously had enough pressure to disintegrate the parts and sling them 50 feet. I don't think the Remington and Weatherby gas path designs would have allowed this. I've pierced primers in my reloading and gas vented safely away, on the Remington.
D
Deleted member 115360
Guest
Thank you for that explanation. I for whatever reason was under the impression that everyone vented that overpressure out on the side of the bolt away from the shooter, (when shooting a rifle oriented correctly). When this thing blew up, I made the assumption that it was a design flaw, or possibly just a freak occurrence, since violent pressure can be a bit unpredictable. If I was designing rifles, I think would vent it differently, but it appears there are several companies who know infinitely more than I do who disagree.
