Hammer bullets WTH

[Petey308]

I have no idea what caused the issue and I'm certainly not on a trip with any specific destination I need to arrive at. Simply trying to ascertain what might be the cause....but yes, Hammer states the minimum twist rate for each projectile for terminal performance.....and that's why I'm inquiring.

Yep I get that. That wasn't my point though.

Do you know of other bullets from other companies that stress minimum twist rates the same way in order to produce acceptable terminal performance?

I'm not talking about simply advertising a minimum twist rate, because they all do that. I mean do they stress it as a limiting factor in order for the bullet to actually work properly terminally?

I'm not dogging on anyone or any company either. I think it's a valid point and concern. And I also agree terminal stability is indeed a thing and twist rate (bullet RPM) plays a part. I just wonder if it's a good thing for a bullet to be so sensitive and temperamental to it is all. Perhaps a better bullet would be less sensitive and temperamental to it, yes? As a bullet manufacture, that's the sort of thing I'd be striving for to make a better pill.

 

[Shane Lindsey]

Maybe other companies should be focusing on it. Ever hear Barnes users complain about them blowing right through and not finding the animal? I have before, maybe they too had the wrong twist rates. 210/215s shoot good with marginal twists. Put them in an animal and it may be a totally different story.

 

[bigngreen]

Dang fordy, I knew you tested the hht bullets(prototype) and said they seemed to perform same if not better than the std hh bullets ---- I didn't realize they had changed the tip design since then (for the worse?!)
I've had good luck with the hh and have been building loads for the hht's too--- but if they take away from performance id rather not have the extra bc from the tip--- guess next time I should follow threads more closely

Tips are the same today as the first ones we shot, zero difference except color.

 

[Petey308]

Maybe other companies should be focusing on it. Ever hear Barnes users complain about them blowing right through and not finding the animal? I have before, maybe they too had the wrong twist rates. 210/215s shoot good with marginal twists. Put them in an animal and it may be a totally different story.

Barnes are created much differently and behave differently. Those are a mushrooming solid and require a great deal of impact velocity to open up reliably and sufficiently. Spinning them faster can help, but ultimately more impact velocity and more resistance upon impact will do more good.

Most instances where a Barnes or similar bullet blows right through is due to impacting at too low of a velocity and/or with insignificant resistance encountered.

Stability can play a factor, especially when it's creating an imbalance with the bullet, but shoulder stabilization within the animal becomes a thing too and influences what the bullet does and the path it takes.

My main point here is there are other factors and variables in play other than just stability.

 

[Shane Lindsey]

Barnes are created much differently and behave differently. Those are a mushrooming solid and require a great deal of impact velocity to open up reliably and sufficiently. Spinning them faster can help, but ultimately more impact velocity and more resistance upon impact will do more good.

Most instances where a Barnes or similar bullet blows right through is due to impacting at too low of a velocity and/or with insignificant resistance encountered.

Stability can play a factor, especially when it's creating an imbalance with the bullet, but shoulder stabilization within the animal becomes a thing too and influences what the bullet does and the path it takes.

My main point here is there are other factors and variables in play other than just stability.

But if it's flyin sideways on impact, it's not going to track true. That was my point.

 

[bigngreen]

Barnes are created much differently and behave differently. Those are a mushrooming solid and require a great deal of impact velocity to open up reliably and sufficiently. Spinning them faster can help, but ultimately more impact velocity and more resistance upon impact will do more good.

Most instances where a Barnes or similar bullet blows right through is due to impacting at too low of a velocity and/or with insignificant resistance encountered.

Stability can play a factor, especially when it's creating an imbalance with the bullet, but shoulder stabilization within the animal becomes a thing too and influences what the bullet does and the path it takes.

My main point here is there are other factors and variables in play other than just stability.

Terminal stability is a larger issue with Barnes unless you hit with enough velocity to shear off the pedals. Barnes over turning on elk was a huge issue until tightening the twist rate which helps keeping them pointed forward with so much frontal area but by the time that was figured out there were just better bullets over all in the terminal department.

 

[dogz]

Maybe other companies should be focusing on it. Ever hear Barnes users complain about them blowing right through and not finding the animal? I have before, maybe they too had the wrong twist rates. 210/215s shoot good with marginal twists. Put them in an animal and it may be a totally different story.

IMO, a lot of the earlier Barnes were blowing off all 4 petals hence basically sending a wadcutter thru the critters. The wadcutter would penetrate thru all right but the critters would take a fair bit of a jaunt after taking the hit....

 

[Petey308]

Tips are the same today as the first ones we shot, zero difference!

The composition and type of resin is the same? Same size tip? Same profile and integration with the rest of the bullet?

That tip on the right does not appear to be the same as the middle one. How it aligns with the rest of the bullet doesn't look great either.

 

[Rflshootr]

It's always the bullet.

Nawwww....the load was outta tune

 

[Petey308]

But if it's flyin sideways on impact, it's not going to track true. That was my point.

I doubt it would have exited like he said though if it impacted sideways, but it's still possible.

 

[Shane Lindsey]

Sounds like a CMM (Cartel Meth Mulie)...

 

[bigngreen]

The composition and type of resin is the same? Same size tip? Same profile and integration with the rest of the bullet?

View attachment 637651


That tip on the right does not appear to be the same as the middle one. How it aligns with the rest of the bullet doesn't look great either.

Same composition and well established! Bullet on the right is a prototype that is coming and it's a different ogive, they'll have a different tip color.
There have been prototypes and different materials, those should not be mixed up with production designs.

 

[Petey308]

Same composition and well established! Bullet on the right is a prototype that is coming and it's a different ogive, they'll have a different tip color.
There have been prototypes and different materials, those should not be mixed up with production designs.

So they didn't change the type of polymer ever? It's the same as they polymer from Maker? They didn't change anything from the polymer they first started with when they started making their own tips in house, to what they're using now? Just wanting to clarify is all.

Glad to hear that tip on the bullet on the right won't be the one that gets released on the final product. Hope that one is simply better.

 

[bigngreen]

So they didn't change the type of polymer ever? It's the same as they polymer from Maker? They didn't change anything from the polymer they first started with when they started making their own tips in house, to what they're using now? Just wanting to clarify is all.

Glad to hear that tip on the bullet on the right won't be the one that gets released on the final product. Hope that one is simply better.

In production the tip is the same, they've played with them in testing, there was a big freak out when a color was changed so they tested them and they test the same.

I would bet the prototype bullet tip will be very similar to what's seen, they've been shooting them a year, they shot excellent this spring the ones I was able to shoot.