-
If you are being asked to change your password, and unsure how to do it, follow these instructions. Click here
groups open after 2 shots
- Thread starter Onesock
- Start date
Help Support Long Range Hunting Forum
86alaskan
Well-Known Member
I feel the pain, I had what was probably an identical T3 Lite in 25-06. The rifle would hold up pretty good but exhibited the exact same issues that you're experiencing. Only letting it cool down would help. I let the rifle go for 50-60 rds before cleaning. I have since abandoned all hope for that factory rig and the rifle is currently being barreled with a 1-9" twist cut rifled barrel. I had a very rough 4-6" of rifling in front of the chamber. I would take it as it is unless you want a new stick on there.
engineer40
Well-Known Member
It's not uncommon for a factory barrel to walk when heated. I wouldn't feel like you got a bad rifle or anything.
Although it is a PITA when trying to do load development
When you bedded the action did you put a pressure pad on the barrel up at the forend? I also wouldnt clean the barrel on a factory rifle such as that any sooner than 25-50 rounds. I am assuming you performed a load workup using a proven method such as OCW so you know you atleast are in the accuracy node? Since it seems very repeatable and you have done some work to no effect good or bad that tells me the normal issues are not at play and i would try a pressure pad at the tip of the forend if you have not already. I am assuming this is a light weight barrel contour.
I'm thinking more like 20 minutes between each shot. I'm also in the quit cleaning group.
It's a light rifle so you have to be very conscious about consistent grip and cheek pressure. The barrel heat thing can be very important with a sporter barrel.
If the above doesn't work, try holding the front stock of the rifle in a more traditional fashion. Not a death grip but just a light consistent downward and into the shoulder pull. It is hard to shoot a light hunting rifle in the same fashion as a heaver tactical rifle. Most shooters who learn to hold the front of the stock with a light hunting rifle shoot more consistent.
I shoot 100 Gr. bullets in a Savage 25-06 with a factory sporter barrel. It will put three into less than 1/2" pretty easily. The Tikka can do it too.
Good luck and give us the range report.
Kansaswoodguy
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2014
- Messages
- 773
I had a rugar 30-06 that was so rough down the bore you could see the milling marks at the muzzle with a naked eye. I finally used David Tubbs fire lapping bullets on that gun to get it down to right at MOA. Nothing great but from the 3 MOA groups it was throwing it's a rock star now and plenty good enough for deer hunting. Before you rebarrel try the fire lapping system
Kansaswoodguy
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2014
- Messages
- 773
engineer40
Well-Known Member
(In my humblest voice) I'm still interested in what I asked earlier. What happens if you do a group of 10 shots, not 3?
There may end up being just as many bullet holes over by shot #3.
Therefore that #3 might not be a "flyer". That may just be your "accuracy".
I'm not implying that a rifle cannot be accurate if so far you have experienced a #3 "flyer". However shooting a group of 10 shots might reveal more to the story.
Flyers can only be caused by a handful of things. The barrel is getting hot. The barrel is touching the forearm at some point. Something in the rifle system is loose and moving, bad receiver bedding, receiver bolts, scope mounts, etc. You may not actually be shooting ammo that is in the accuracy node for that rifle. The shooter is not realizing he is doing it when firing the rifle (flinching). Scope parallax issues. The shooter may not be holding the rifle in a consistent manner.
I'm surely not trying to offend the original poster or yourself. I am by far, not an expert or a gunsmith. But every example above has had me frustrated at some point, before I figured it out.
And I have come to realize that I don't have flyers. The flyers have to be counted as part of the group. The entire group, including the flyers is your real accuracy.
engineer40
Well-Known Member
I believe your experience concurs with that of most people who try the Tubbs Fire Lapping system.
So far I have tried it on 2 different rifles. The full 50 bullets, exactly as stated in the instructions. Neither one of those rifles had noticeable accuracy improvement. I save all of my targets and when compared, the rifles shot the same.
I did not yet have a chronograph when I previously tried it on those 2 rifles. I am curious if it helped my ES/SD numbers though.
I'm still a believer in the system, mostly because I have read so many positive results.
I have another box of 50 bullets in .312 size to try on an old mil-surp this spring. If I don't get any favorable results again, I can't say that I would try the system a 4th time.
Kansaswoodguy
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2014
- Messages
- 773
I only used the Tubb System one time on that 30-06 it was very rough when running a patch of Sweets the end of the barrel shined like a copper penny. When cleaning you could feel a tight spot about 6" from the chamber also. I cleaned it with KG-12 until a patch of Sweets came out clean. Then started the Tubb system cleaning the same way in between every 5 shots I think if memory serves. The cleaning of all the copper with the KG-12 and nylon brush was a real pain but unless the bore is rediculessly clean to start I don't think there would be much benefit to the system. The KG-12 cleans copper way way better than Sweets but the Sweets shows color when there is copper present the KG-12 doesn't so I use both. I started the whole process just cleaning with Sweets and spent hours trying to remove the copper and couldn't get it out thats when I found out about the KG-12 and ordered some online. I would say the cleaning pryor to and during the process is of paramount importance and also the most time consuming part of the process. I've only used it on that one barrel but I have no doubt it made a difference I could even feel a difference in the cleaning while running the system the tight spot was much less noticeable toward the end of the system. I would have to think it removes some of the useful life of the barrel but I was at the point with that gun the next step was a new barrel anyway..
buckfvr
Official LRH Sponsor
I didnt read it all, but what I did read, I didnt see OCW test mentioned.......Each powder you test needs to have the optimum charge weight test run so you can determin the velocity node where accuracy is most prevalent. Then run the bullet in and out to see if it prefers a particular seating depth.
When looking for a powder, try as much as you can to test apples to apples as far as velocity goes, as each powder as close to the same velocity as possible can contribute to very similar vibrations/harmonics, so as we have found, each gun will prefer a velocity node, so strive for that. Just our experience, but faster is seldom better. R
When looking for a powder, try as much as you can to test apples to apples as far as velocity goes, as each powder as close to the same velocity as possible can contribute to very similar vibrations/harmonics, so as we have found, each gun will prefer a velocity node, so strive for that. Just our experience, but faster is seldom better. R
