Actually ,I did get a CHUCKLE out of the Kodiak site adjustment I know that many people have used 240 grain bullets in in 44 mag succesfully on black bear but I would use a 300 grain or larger LBT style flat point of the LFN or WLFN style hardcast and if you do not cast your own Cast Performance bullets sell very good ones. I have not gotten good accuracy from the WFN style and since the wound channel is quite impressive with the LFN and WLFN style I didnot look any farther. Most black bears arenot very big [300lbs. and under most under] but occasionaly larger ones are encountered, Thus the need for more penetration and if you might need to take a shot from a less than perfect angle the 300grain and up will offer more than enough penetration.I didnot include jackted bullets as most arenot able to penetrate as well as the hardcast. remember with a revolver bullet integrity is vital in order to achieve adaquate penetration that is why I recomended Cast Performance as I have used their bullets with great sucess. If the bullets are to soft they will deform and lose penetration if cast too hard they may shatter on bone and not penetrate. the 44 can propell these heavy weight bullets to quite impresive speeds I used to shoot 327 grain hard cast @1330fps. If you have never fired one these heavy weights then be prepaire recoil is quite stout and can be quite uncomfortable in some hand guns proper grips are quite important I personal like bisley stle grip frames [Freedom and Ruger] The gunsmith whom made my 475,and 500 prefers the super blackhawk style with over size grips depends on your hand size and individual taste LOTS OF LUCK I hopr that you are able to take abear with a revolver
Grizz and the .300 RUM
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Buffalobob
Well-Known Member
JWP475
Being as I am a bad shot, could I rent you out to go with me any time I think a bear might get me? We also need a porcupine skinner.
This silliness started over someone saying it was easier to kill grizz than elk and I do not know the truth of that but I have never heard of an elk eatin anybody.
I have to sign off now till the race is over. Go #17 Roush Ford
I believe K-mart has a sale on sense of humor this weekend --2 pounds for $1.00 I am pretty well stocked up.
Being as I am a bad shot, could I rent you out to go with me any time I think a bear might get me? We also need a porcupine skinner.
This silliness started over someone saying it was easier to kill grizz than elk and I do not know the truth of that but I have never heard of an elk eatin anybody.
I have to sign off now till the race is over. Go #17 Roush Ford
I believe K-mart has a sale on sense of humor this weekend --2 pounds for $1.00 I am pretty well stocked up.
Bob S.
Well-Known Member
Just remember you don't have to outrun the bear just whoever your with. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif When I was guiding in Wyoming bear spray was the only thing allowed by the outfitter. I never had to use it but know several who have with positive results and no one with negative results. A 12 ga slug is supposedly a good way to go but who wants to carry a shotgun in the woods for protection. I did have a 870 as a saddle gun for a while. I always carried a 44 mag and several speed loaders and figured if I got eaten it was survival of the fittest/fastest. To tell the truth I was never worried about bears even though I have come across alot of them, I was more worried about those damm moose. Totally unpredictable in my opinion/experience. That 300 RUM will be plenty if you can put the shot where you want it.
G
Guest
Guest
I always thought bear spray was the brown & yellow liquids in one's shorts when the bear is too close!
Anyone have an opinion of the 500 S&W? I shot one once and really loved the gun. I would advise anyone against a semi-auto....for any purpose, but especially grizz. I like the reliability of the revolver.
Also is there a limit on weapons in alaska? I would want to go with a least 2 or better yet 3 people carrying rifles, shotguns and pistols. From what I've read of grizz attacks is that they seem to occur at close range when either surprising a bear, or TRACKING A WOUNDED ONE! (so make that first shot count!) The other attack I've read about is the hunter cleaning his Elk, Moose, or whatever.
Anyone have an opinion of the 500 S&W? I shot one once and really loved the gun. I would advise anyone against a semi-auto....for any purpose, but especially grizz. I like the reliability of the revolver.
Also is there a limit on weapons in alaska? I would want to go with a least 2 or better yet 3 people carrying rifles, shotguns and pistols. From what I've read of grizz attacks is that they seem to occur at close range when either surprising a bear, or TRACKING A WOUNDED ONE! (so make that first shot count!) The other attack I've read about is the hunter cleaning his Elk, Moose, or whatever.
3sixbits
Well-Known Member
What a crock of crap! Just ask BearSh-t Treadwell and his girl friend about only one person ever being killed by a bear. What, you say you can't? They arent around anymore to ask? I can not remember a year going by in the last thrity plus that we don't read or hear on the news of a bear attack resulting in death or a mauling in this state! You fellows are right about HARD Cast pistol bullets, I'll take them any day over jacketed in a pistol! By the by I was talking to a fellow this A.M. that used the Barnes X on his polar bear in Canada .300x378 WBY 180 grain,and only deformed the nose on the bullet shot into the shoulder. Seems I not the only one who has seen the failure of these bullets first hand, He will be loading the 180 grain Woodliegh's to try when I give him a box to try for his Russia trip this spring. The last two years the largest Brown bear in this state where taken with a load of 76 grains of 4350, 300 grain Woodliegh's in Winchester brass. I know as I loaded the ammo for the guide that had to kill the bears after the clients wounded them. So I guess once again believe the ads rather than first hand experiance. And we all know how honest gun writers are? Best of luck following advise from anyone that has not shot live game with any of these loads. Oh yes, the bears that killed Treadwell and his girl friend where killed with 12 ga slugs, by an Alaska state fish and wildlife protection officer. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
500 grain in smith is wonderfull and are avaialable from Leadhead for reloading and will be available soon from Corbon in factory loads. the 440 grain doesnot penetrate as well as when it is slowed to about 1350fps as I know this to be true because a couple of friends thought they would be the best because of their speed and used them on about 800 pounds bison and leaned the hardway 500to525 grain out of the 500 Linebaughkilled better and pentrated unbelievely @ only 1130fps do not get too caught up in this speed thing with big bore revolvers on large game
Jimm
Well-Known Member
There you are. I see that you can still see to post /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gifTell me , how do you like your caribou cooked ? Another thing ,where the hey is bush , alaska? Can you see better out of your left/ right eye?. No matter,coming anyway cook something good(I'm partial to meat)Jim
You did mention an excuse to by a 416 or 375.
I've shot both the the 416's Rigby and Remmington Mag. My vote would be a .416 Rem mag and get a 26 inch bull barrel. I have a 26 inch bull on my .458 win mag and it helps tame the recoil. The extra inches of barrel over the more common 22 - 24 inchers gets the extra speed out of using slower powders with heavy bullets.
When ever you hit a big animal with @5000 pounds of energy it knocks them back. 400 grains at 2400-2500 fps just takes things out.
I've shot both the the 416's Rigby and Remmington Mag. My vote would be a .416 Rem mag and get a 26 inch bull barrel. I have a 26 inch bull on my .458 win mag and it helps tame the recoil. The extra inches of barrel over the more common 22 - 24 inchers gets the extra speed out of using slower powders with heavy bullets.
When ever you hit a big animal with @5000 pounds of energy it knocks them back. 400 grains at 2400-2500 fps just takes things out.
G
Guest
Guest
I posted that pic. and story about a year ago and it was removed from the forum. Someone posted a site that proved the story was made up.
Buffalobob
Well-Known Member
And it was such a good story complete with pictures.
Next you will be saying that there is no easter bunny and that eggs are laid by chickens. You are destroying my faith in the world.
Next you will be saying that there is no easter bunny and that eggs are laid by chickens. You are destroying my faith in the world.
COBrad
Well-Known Member
I have read several comments on Hawk bullets as being similar to the Woodleighs in effectiveness on big, aggressive beasts. They make a 250 gr round nose that they told me would stabilize in my 12 twist .300 Jarrett. They also claim that they will not come apart at high velocity. Any one used them?
For what it's worth, I have talked with several alaskans lately, both guides and civilians. All have said, essentially, that the '06 and .300's will kill big bears quite nicely, but when that same bear is wounded or otherwise enraged, you not only want to kill him, but you want to put him on the ground, NOW, so he doesn't kill you before he expires. The .416's have been suggested more than once as a good caliber for PO'ed bears.
For what it's worth, I have talked with several alaskans lately, both guides and civilians. All have said, essentially, that the '06 and .300's will kill big bears quite nicely, but when that same bear is wounded or otherwise enraged, you not only want to kill him, but you want to put him on the ground, NOW, so he doesn't kill you before he expires. The .416's have been suggested more than once as a good caliber for PO'ed bears.
I certainly agree with REAL world experience although I am conrently testing the TXS's 3 hogs and 2 deer and no problems of course not definitive by by any means the original X's I know had failures according to Barnes that was due to the inconsistancey of the copper zinc alloy not being consitant and creating hard spots and if that occurred in the tip then you would get less than acceptable performance the TSX's have no zinc and have proven so for to be consistant I will see! I never used the original X' for that very reason of not beeing consistant the TSX have potential if the consistance problems is indeed a thing of the past in 4 different rifles they shoot as accurate as any bullet that I have fired You are spot on about bear attacks and caliber and bullet choices
G
Guest
Guest
I've used the Barnes XLC's (Blue Meanies) in my 7STW on Mulie and Lope in Wyoming. I've never seen animals drop so fast. Accuracy SUCKED!!!! I mean really sucked!
I heard the TSX's have better accuracy.
I personally never hunted Grizz or been around them. I have been around black bears as close a 15 feet. There are a lot of there in my part of NY since I'm right near the New Jersey border and they are protected there(no more Jersey bear hunt! Too many tree-hugger protesters!) Those black bears run away quicker than deer. I've heard that grizz aren't that cowardly.
If I did hunt Grizz I would want a good back up weapon...or two! Preferably a sidearm for quick access. As far as weapon I would use my 338 Lapua, and this is one time I wouldn't use the 300 matchking. I personally do not have a problem with recoil, but many do and I think that they actually may do themselves and those around them a dis-service using a .416 or something too hard kicking for them. I would think its better to hit the grizz in the vitals with a 300 win mag than in the *** with a .416 weatherby. I do think that a 300 win mag is undergunned for a grizz, but I guess its better that a bad shot. I would think 338 would be minimum. If I were to use a .30 cal I would choose a ultra-mag or weatherby caliber and not a win-mag.
I've shot a deer a few years back with my 12ga shotgun at 56 yards and he ran about 50 yards before dropping in his tracks after being shot in the heart. I wouldn't feel comfortable with a shotgun for a grizz. Although its better than a golfclub!
My Wyoming mule deer dropped in his tracks with a neck hit from a 140 barnes xlc from my 7STW. Lope did the same thing from a front shoulder shot. (No lungs!) The mulie was 216 yards and the lope was 48. I'm not saying that they are anywhere near a grizz, but instant death without hitting the spinal cord is impressive with any animal.
If someone had bullet failure with the barnes I'm surprised. Not saying it hasn't or couldn't happen just a little surprised. I've never used the Woodleigh's but I have heard that they are excellent dangerous game bullets.
I heard the TSX's have better accuracy.
I personally never hunted Grizz or been around them. I have been around black bears as close a 15 feet. There are a lot of there in my part of NY since I'm right near the New Jersey border and they are protected there(no more Jersey bear hunt! Too many tree-hugger protesters!) Those black bears run away quicker than deer. I've heard that grizz aren't that cowardly.
If I did hunt Grizz I would want a good back up weapon...or two! Preferably a sidearm for quick access. As far as weapon I would use my 338 Lapua, and this is one time I wouldn't use the 300 matchking. I personally do not have a problem with recoil, but many do and I think that they actually may do themselves and those around them a dis-service using a .416 or something too hard kicking for them. I would think its better to hit the grizz in the vitals with a 300 win mag than in the *** with a .416 weatherby. I do think that a 300 win mag is undergunned for a grizz, but I guess its better that a bad shot. I would think 338 would be minimum. If I were to use a .30 cal I would choose a ultra-mag or weatherby caliber and not a win-mag.
I've shot a deer a few years back with my 12ga shotgun at 56 yards and he ran about 50 yards before dropping in his tracks after being shot in the heart. I wouldn't feel comfortable with a shotgun for a grizz. Although its better than a golfclub!
My Wyoming mule deer dropped in his tracks with a neck hit from a 140 barnes xlc from my 7STW. Lope did the same thing from a front shoulder shot. (No lungs!) The mulie was 216 yards and the lope was 48. I'm not saying that they are anywhere near a grizz, but instant death without hitting the spinal cord is impressive with any animal.
If someone had bullet failure with the barnes I'm surprised. Not saying it hasn't or couldn't happen just a little surprised. I've never used the Woodleigh's but I have heard that they are excellent dangerous game bullets.
If you do not trust the Accubonds do not forget the Swift A-frames/Trophy bonded.
