Frustrated...need help!

[nmbarta]

This is a general statement and not fact, just based on what I've experienced.

"Most" cases will tolerate between .020 and .030 of combined expansion. (Not one shot) meaning that if you move the shoulder .002 each shot, you would get 10-15 shots before you have any issues. That said a max chamber (say .008) will take up .008 or roughly 4 of those shots on the first fire forming shot, which is usually actually two shots.
The point is if the op is somehow moving the shoulder .023 there could be problems with one shot.
I have nothing to base any of this on other than personal experience, some cases will handle more, some less.

 

[milo-2]

Milo-2

I "had" 117 pcs of LC09 brass.

My unfired Black Hills ammo is 1.4545". Fired is 1.4595. I was trying to get it to 1.4575 (.002 bump), but some how with small changes it wasn't doing anything and then it was too far. I was only rotating the die about 1/4" (if that makes sense).

I think I'm just going to discard them, and start with new brass. Might go with Starline until I get my life figured out LOL. Then I will purchase Lapua brass.

Steve

Now that you threw those numbers at us, your bump is not catastrophic, not good either, lol. You can salvage that brass if you fire it once with a jam. If you've ever had a case come apart in your chamber from case head separation, it will open your eyes. I've seen brass ruined in one firing, Dahsers, 6 comp match, all because case growth came the bottom end, you want to try blow the shoulder area forward, and firing 109 rds isn't going to affect barrel life much, if indeed you want to run the LC brass.
Maybe myself and another poster over complicated matters not fully knowing the associated numbers, but I can tell you this, you never want to over simplify this stuff. It is your face that is 8" from the back end of your bolt.

 

[BoomFlop]

Milo-2

Totally agree with not over simplifying it. In fact, I'm not ashamed to admit I'm scared. I've yet to seat a bullet in my reloading career.

I don't think I'm willing or capable to do what I need to in order to salvage this brass. I'm going to take the safe route and get some Starline brass to practice with before ending up with Lapua or other quality brass options.

Thanks so much for your help!
Steve

 

[ShtrRdy]

If I may offer another thought. Before all this precision reloading knowledge was available people would just set up the full length resizing die so the the bottom of the die would contact the shell holder. You would then lube and resize the case without taking any measurement other than the case length. If the case was too long after resizing you would need to trim and chamfer. That was it. You won't blow up a gun because of this approach.

 

[Frog4aday]

Exactly. Well said @ShtrRdy

 

[redneckdan]

If I may offer another thought. Before all this precision reloading knowledge was available people would just set up the full length resizing die so the the bottom of the die would contact the shell holder. You would then lube and resize the case without taking any measurement other than the case length. If the case was too long after resizing you would need to trim and chamfer. That was it. You won't blow up a gun because of this approach.

Case head separations were a lot more common then.

 

[Frog4aday]

Based on what data? Give me a break. Once fired brass, FL die with standard shellholder, fired in standard factory rifle to fireform is NOT going to be dangerous or "separate" @ the case head.

@BoomFlop feel free to send me that LC brass. Thanks!

 

[Tidus56]

If I may offer another thought. Before all this precision reloading knowledge was available people would just set up the full length resizing die so the the bottom of the die would contact the shell holder. You would then lube and resize the case without taking any measurement other than the case length. If the case was too long after resizing you would need to trim and chamfer. That was it. You won't blow up a gun because of this approach.

This is how I learned and did it from the time I was 13-25. I never had a case head separation. I did split a few necks. I was actually shocked when I learned that wasn't the way it was always done. Anyway continue on with the anxiety y'all.
I will add controlling your bump is far better and will save your brass life. I just haven't seen head case separation across thousands of sizing rounds the way explained with the instructions.

 

[rsmithsr]

reloading like this keeps the brass makers happy as it ruins brass FAST.

LEARN TO LOAD FOR YOUR CHAMBERS, or for the smaller of the 2 if sharing ammo. best to load for each one.

reload the under sized brass and shoot some in each rifle.
keep separate and measure that fired brass WITHOUT primers. you need to be a little smaller in a bolt gun and maybe 2-3 thou smaller in a gas gun( I have done gas guns neck sized only...do not listen to the experts out there) sorry you got bad starting advice.

First, you cannot check the headspace measurement with a primer seated, exactly for the reasons you described, decap them before measuring.
Second, as you are using a two die set, which I assume is a full length sizing die, you do not need to really concern yourself with the headspace measurement as that die will set the brass to a minimum spec to fit all SAMMI chambers.

Screw it in until it bottoms on the shellholder, then just a gnat's *Rule 4 Violation* more to get a bit of cam over and you are good to go. get that going then we will talk about body dies and setting shoulder back etc..

 

[rsmithsr]

while it was SAFE.it ruined brass.
it was LAWYER SAFE, not shooter reasonable.

If I may offer another thought. Before all this precision reloading knowledge was available people would just set up the full length resizing die so the the bottom of the die would contact the shell holder. You would then lube and resize the case without taking any measurement other than the case length. If the case was too long after resizing you would need to trim and chamfer. That was it. You won't blow up a gun because of this approach.

 

[Tidus56]

reloading like this keeps the brass makers happy as it ruins brass FAST.

LEARN TO LOAD FOR YOUR CHAMBERS, or for the smaller of the 2 if sharing ammo. best to load for each one.

reload the under sized brass and shoot some in each rifle.
keep separate and measure that fired brass WITHOUT primers. you need to be a little smaller in a bolt gun and maybe 2-3 thou smaller in a gas gun( I have done gas guns neck sized only...do not listen to the experts out there) sorry you got bad starting advice.

I don't load for any gas guns but I am about to. I have been told to bump 6 thou. You're getting reliable chambering with just 2-3 thou?

 

[Frog4aday]

Guy just needs to fireform his brass for right now. He'll be safe doing that as they are currently sized. Won't ruin his brass or gun. But y'all got him spooked & ready to throw away perfectly good LC brass. That's not right.

 

[LaHunter]

Boomflop,

I would recommend that you buy a couple/few reloading manuals. Read and understand the first few sections that describe and explain the various steps of the reloading process. You need to fully understand the what, how, & why of each step of the process. I get the feeling you may not have a complete solid understanding of this. The Sierra website has a good explanation of the various steps also. There is some good info on youtube, but there is some 'not so good' info on youtube, so beware. Once you get this knowledge foundation solidified and really understand what it is that each step is accomplishing and why you are doing it, you will be able to trouble shoot most issues that you may run into.

 

[rsmithsr]

YES. NOT MIXED BRASS, single lots.
I have honestly fired neck sized in an ar15.
not recommended, but there is a lot of bs out there about how much sizing is required for an ar15/ar10.

I don't load for any gas guns but I am about to. I have been told to bump 6 thou. You're getting reliable chambering with just 2-3 thou?