For any one who has "bedded" their seating stem...

I use the Redding dies with the VLD stem. The biggest problem I can see with bedding the stem is ensuring you do it with a bullet with no runout, or you will potentially be inducing runout in all your loaded rounds.

-David
 
TheDerkster said:
I went ahead and did the devcon just because I have some anyways. Much better, but still some variance in seating depth. Id say 30-50% still are off +/- .004. Maybe it's the bullets or the fact that the dies rely on press accuracy since there isn't a dead stop with the sliding sleeve.

I'm use to my lee dies with the 308 where I'm almost always +/- .001 if not .0005 with 178 gr hornady match bthp.
Click to expand...
Derkster,
Sort your bullets by base to ogive into groups so yo can make adjustments up or down to make up for the variance and get all the bullets seated to the same distance off the lands . But first do a live fire test to see if the =/- .004 variance even affects your accuracy.
 
barefooter56 said:
Derkster,
Sort your bullets by base to ogive into groups so yo can make adjustments up or down to make up for the variance and get all the bullets seated to the same distance off the lands . But first do a live fire test to see if the =/- .004 variance even affects your accuracy.
Click to expand...

That's a great idea. :D

Amazing how I miss the simplest ways to double check what the actual problem is. It could be the bullet length causing my problems.

I do have some other grimlins somewhere tho. Not getting the best of groups. I suspect I need different primers for one
 
TheDerkster said:
That's a great idea. :D

Amazing how I miss the simplest ways to double check what the actual problem is. It could be the bullet length causing my problems.

I do have some other grimlins somewhere tho. Not getting the best of groups. I suspect I need different primers for one
Click to expand...
Derkster,
See if that .004 is the issue first. To find your "gremlins" change only ONE thing at at a time and keep good notes. Also keep in mind that we are not always on our game when shooting and that a mediocre result one day with a load that worked before may be you and not the load. Stay out of the weeds. And keep in mind its a HUNTING RIFLE. Not a TARGET RIFLE. Animals have larger x-rings that targets at any range so once you get a load to one or half minute of angle the qucker way to gain accuracy is to work on reading conditions, trigger control and position. In short..practice even in lousy weather. But don't practice if you are distracted or just not into it at the time. It has to be GOOD practice. Shooting skills are perishable and need constant attention.
 
I've been following this and I'm confused. So i'll ask the question so I can hopefully learn something. OP is seeing a difference in CBTO measurements between loads. Is seeing a ring around the the bullet from the seating die. I think most of the time if I look close enough I see some evidence of a ring on the bullet. There have been a lot of good suggestions on how to sort it out. One was to sort the bullets etc. fine to do anyway if looking for consistency. The troubling part is that it is varying so much. So I am looking at it from the press point of view. The die is set at a fixed position, The ram comes up to what should be a positive stop. In other words the distance between the ram and seater should remain a constant or very close. If bullets are sorted or not the ogive to base should not vary much if the stem is pushing on the same diameter surface of every bullet.
Even if the bullet was a bit longer the extra would go deeper into the case and the measurement should be the same? Or is it possible that pressing down hard on the ram could induce a slightly shorter CBTO and less pressure could make a longer one. Is it even possible to force on the ram enough to see a differance? I'm using fairly used gear and dont see more than .001 variance. Something seems out of whack? Could the caliper be out. I'm just fishing because it's a good learning point, and would like to know what fixes it.
 
toliver said:
I've been following this and I'm confused. So i'll ask the question so I can hopefully learn something. OP is seeing a difference in CBTO measurements between loads. Is seeing a ring around the the bullet from the seating die. I think most of the time if I look close enough I see some evidence of a ring on the bullet. There have been a lot of good suggestions on how to sort it out. One was to sort the bullets etc. fine to do anyway if looking for consistency. The troubling part is that it is varying so much. So I am looking at it from the press point of view. The die is set at a fixed position, The ram comes up to what should be a positive stop. In other words the distance between the ram and seater should remain a constant or very close. If bullets are sorted or not the ogive to base should not vary much if the stem is pushing on the same diameter surface of every bullet.
Even if the bullet was a bit longer the extra would go deeper into the case and the measurement should be the same? Or is it possible that pressing down hard on the ram could induce a slightly shorter CBTO and less pressure could make a longer one. Is it even possible to force on the ram enough to see a differance? I'm using fairly used gear and dont see more than .001 variance. Something seems out of whack? Could the caliper be out. I'm just fishing because it's a good learning point, and would like to know what fixes it.
Click to expand...

Seaters don't seat off the same ogive measurement as the caliper block. The measurement it's taken at the point where the rifling meets the bullet after free bore, but the seater contacts a bit below. Any variance in bullet shape causes variance in depth.

Facing facts, I had groups less than .5 at 100 with really no load development. As far as I know, I will be one of the first to run the 195 in a 7mm SS so I'm starting from scratch in a way.

I just gotta keep working at it I suppose! :D
 
TheDerkster said:
Seaters don't seat off the same ogive measurement as the caliper block. The measurement it's taken at the point where the rifling meets the bullet after free bore, but the seater contacts a bit below. Any variance in bullet shape causes variance in depth.

Facing facts, I had groups less than .5 at 100 with really no load development. As far as I know, I will be one of the first to run the 195 in a 7mm SS so I'm starting from scratch in a way.

I just gotta keep working at it I suppose! :D
Click to expand...
derkster,
If you got a half MOA group with your first attempt. I hope you have it all written down. Take that load on out and see what it does. Some of that half inch could be just from episylic swerve of the bullets nose because it hasn't gone completely to "sleep yet so the nose is still traveling in a small arc that goes away at distance when the bullet is completely stable.
 
barefooter56 said:
derkster,
If you got a half MOA group with your first attempt. I hope you have it all written down. Take that load on out and see what it does. Some of that half inch could be just from episylic swerve of the bullets nose because it hasn't gone completely to "sleep yet so the nose is still traveling in a small arc that goes away at distance when the bullet is completely stable.
Click to expand...


59 gr of R26 seated . 02-.015 off the lands is the load. I based this off of a load for 180 hybrids (or VLDs) that Rich developed. I do think it's my shooting to blame. I used a BR rest for that group. I would say .5 inches at 100 is conservative since all the bullets were touching. I tried 200 last night and only got 1 inch or so, but I was in a hurry and that is probably why
 
Great its shooting so well. Sort of makes it a wash. So your thinking its a variance in the bullet itself?
 
barefooter56 said:
Take that out to 2-3-500 yards and see what it does. Pay attention to the MOA of the vertical . Let us know what happens man!
Click to expand...

Will do!

On another note, any reason you know of why I'm shooting so smoke out the barrel? Is R26 just dirty, or do I need a magnum primer? Ive just been using CCI large rifle as of now, but man does she like to smoke.

I would figure on a 28 inch barrel, id get a good clean barrel.
 
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