Cutting down barrel to 18 myth?

[buzzgun]

If your shots are limited to 300 yards and you are shooting deer sized animals..........I think you would have a hard time beating a 7-08 shooting the 120 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip.......I'm getting 3000 fps with this bullet out of a 20" Remington Model 7.......I've killed a pile of deer with that combo......I'd expect 2900+ fps with that bullet in an 18" barrel.

 

[J E Custom]

So ive been reading more and more about GPS Defense cutting down their 308 rifles to 18. So my ques is: what other calibers can you cut the barrel down to 18 without considerable lose in accuracy or FPS. Also are they cutting down factory barrels or aftermarket?

Also i found a website the other day that started at 24 and ended at 10 barrel length. It also showed the FPS table for every inch cut off. But i dont rem the caliber.

The 308 was designed around a 18 to 20 inch barrel ,and performs well in this range giving up very little velocity from 20 to18" but it will be about 1 to 200 ft/sec difference.

There is an optimum barrel length for all cartridges (The point that the gain becomes less and
less for each inch of barrel added). Example= I have a 7/08 in a 16" barreled pistol and the
same load is used in my 20" model 7 Rem. A 120 ballistic tip with 49.5 grs H414 @ 2690 ft/sec
in the pistol and 3010 in the rifle. I also had a factory 7/08 in a 18.5" barrel and the velocity
was 2823 ft/sec.

So based on these velocities It appears that optimum performance is around 20 to 22" for the
7/08 size cases.

Of course you can use different powders to reach max pressures sooner and get a little more velocity But the only way to match the same velocities is to use a bigger case.

I have a rule of thumb based on my experience with different cartridges = A case capacity of 50
grans of powder or less needs 20 to 22" of barrel to reach the optimum velocity (Not maximum)

One with 70grains of capacity needs 24 to 26'' of barrel, and one with 70+ grains needs 26 to
30 Inches.

I know that people use magnum cartridges in pistols but they are very inefficient and the gain
is not worth the pain and cost. Plus the muzzle blast is very bad because of all the UN burnt
powder.

If you are looking for a 300+ yard rifle with a short barrel I would recomend a 7/08 with a
20 to 22inch barrel in a short action or a mod 7 Rem.

I have killed deer beyond 500 yards with both the rifle and the pistol with 120,140 and 150grain bullets.

Just an opinion but I would not cut "any" rifle barrel shorter than 18 inches and "any" long
range pistol less than 14 Inches.

J E CUSTOM

 

[liltank]

I have a .308 Win. in an 18" barrel. I have found a load producing 2787fps using 135grn Matchkings. This velocity and and speed have enough ommph to knock a deer down to 400 yards. Would I shoot farther than that with this load, probably not, but it is sufficient for its intended purpose and that is a deep woods rifle. Its range is going to be limited to 150 yards at best.

Tank

 

[zuba]

Thanks for the welcome.

Learn me on this 7mm mag imp please. Ive never heard of that before.

Also if what your telling me is correct, id like to use a 7mm mag but with a shorter barrel. Im not worried about loosing FPS as much as i am knock down energy. But my research has shown that anything in a magnum under 24 barrel burns/wastes to much powder. So how could you shoot a mag out of a 17-18 barrel? Isnt it a waste?

Thanks for the knowledge.

I shoot a 17.5" 7wsm pistol and I'm pushing 168smk's to 2900fps, It shoots better than I do and hopefully will get one at over 500 in a few weeks

 

[edge]

So then y is everything that i read about barrel length so negative about short barrels if your only loosing 200-300fps? In the grand scheme of things thats nothin!

IMO, since this is LONGRANGE hunting, 200-300 fps IS important!

If you want to shoot normal hunting range, then the velocity does not matter much.
Try to hit a target at 1,000 yards with your '06, then try it running 300fps slower

If you want to shoot deer at 300 yards then a short barrel won't hurt much at all.

edge.

 

[Gene Jr.]

I have been watching this thread with interest. I'm working with a 243 win with a 18" barrel to get the most effective range possible. This rifle will be used for whitetail and LR predator and groundhog. It shoots 95gr NBT well and I've been trying different powders to find the highest MV for an accuracy load. So far H4350 looks to be the best with an accuracy load just over 3000fps. This is as much as I could ever have hoped for out of such a short barrel. It is a warm load and loaded to the lands and just fits in the magazine box.

This rifle was never intended to be a dedicated long range gun. But it sure is nice when your treestand gun is capable of 600 yards!

 

[Ernie]

If you are shooting a short barreled rig ( whether it be a rifle or a specialty handgun ) , and you want portability, weight reduction, or even the fun and challenge of a specialty pistol, you simply go up in cartridge capacity to get what you want. Once you know you are going to lose in terms of MV you make up for it in terms of case capacity.
People used to tell me you can't get consistent accuracy with with cases at 06 level and above.
You ought to hear the naysayers when they heard I was chambering a 7.82 Patriot in a 15.75 inch barrel (or was it 16"??). It won't be accurate, etc., etc., etc. FWIW- a 150 NBT @ 3001 fps and the 180 grain SGK in the 2750-2775 range.
When I had Kirby build the 7mm Dakota I had some of the same response, but not nearly to the degree, since there was more acceptance what a short-barreled rig could do. Both of these rigs shot consistently around 1/2 MOA out to 700 yards when I did my job and I had decent conditions.

I only have three 15" SP's: 6.5x57R, 6x47 Lapua, and a 6.5-284 (and soon another 6.5-284 for 1k pistol matches).
I have used the two last ones out to 1k in matches. All of the rest are 17-18 inches long.

I have no doubt that a properly set-up 18" barreled rig is capable of 1k kills on antelope, deer, and elk, in the right conditions and the right person running it.

 

[bvmoney]

SO ive narrowed it down to either a NEF or Stevens 200. I lik the single shot and light weight of the NEF, but will it have the accuracy of a bolt gun. My other pick is the Stevens Model 200. From everything that ive read it is the best/cheapest starting platform for a bolt gun.

SO do i go with single shot or bolt gun?

 

[Gene Jr.]

That's a WHOLE new topic. But to keep it related somewhat... A break action will allow for a longer barrel with a similar overall length due to the lack of an action. The stevens will allow for a lot of modifications where the break open is rather limited.

I've got both and they both have their place. If you want just one gun and want to tinker with it definately get the bolt gun.

Have fun!

 

[rdsii64]

An 18 inch barrel gives up nothing to the longer barrels when it comes to accuracy. You will lose some speed with the shorter barrel. If my understanding is correct you can mitigate some of the speed loss ( not all but some) by moving to a powder that burns fast enough for a complete burn in the shorter barrel.

 

[bvmoney]

Ok well ive decided on Stevens 200 7mm08. Replace the stock with Choate Tactical with alum bedding and cut the barrel down to 18. See how the weight works out for hunting. Not worried about the weight as much as accuracy. Also tryin to do some research on finding good load data. Gonna finally get my reloading equip setup.

 

[Ernie]

Looks like you are getting started with a number of new things. Do some perusing if you have not loaded before, and look for a manual with a good "how to" section on reloading.

 

[edge]

I have a 7mm-08 in a XP-100

Accurate if I do my part and a deer killer past 300 yards.
A good custom load, good optics, and a good trigger will get you well past my capabilities...keep us posted on your progress.

edge.