Blown primers on 6.5 CM-Problem Solved on page 6!

[bomberodevil]

I just ordered another 100 cases of Lapua brass, I'll purge the Hornady and the Nosler brass. That way I'll have one less factor to worry about.

 

[slickyboyboo]

I didn't look up the Nosler load data since they don't have a 143 grain bullet. I looked up the Hodgdon data, since they use the exact bullet I was using, and the exact powder and primer I was using. I thought three out of four identical components was better than zero identical components. I started 0.7 grains below their max load, with plans to work up by small 0.1 grain increments.

It's possible that this is simply an overpressure situation and a lesson learn for me, but my staring load was below max and below what I've loaded in this rifle before with zero pressure signs. I'm thinking the brass might be the difference.

On a new load regardless, I always start 1.5-2 gr below published max, and work up in 0.2 gr increments until I find the max of my particular rifle with those components.

 

[cajun]

99.9% the brass. Internal volume can make a big difference. You need to start lower when changing components. The data is just a guide and only good for the exact components in that barrel. Next time run a one shot ladder to find max pressure. You can even spot the nodes by finding where the velocity flattens and the shots on target cluster. Also .7 grains is not enough. Start at the low end.

 

[436]

I have a Dillon beam scale that I use on occasion to confirm the electronic scales. I don't have 100% confidence in the electronic scales, but I do measure every load on two scales, with the thought that both likely won't be off the same amount on the same load. If they are off, I re-weigh them. If they are off twice, I dump the powder back into the hopper and re-dispense the charge.

Well, if you can calibrate it with its weights and double-check it with a good balance bean scale, it's most likely not your powder scale. Back to the firing pin and over-size primer pockets... and possible headspace went out I guess. Any chance you may have gotten some primers mixed up? Cheers

 

[25WSM]

No the creed is no rocket ship but can go plenty fast with rl26. Every gun but one will do 2900 plus with 147 eldm. Lapua brass and cci450 primer. My 1000 yard gun with 32 inch barrel is 2975 with the same loads. I can only vouch for this combo of components. I only shoot the 147s in the big bulk pack. I wont publish the exact powder charge. But start at 45 and go till you hit pressure or run out of room for powder. When I charge my brass the powder is in the neck and I vibrate them to get the powder into the shoulder area. Every custom creed Ive built has shot this load well under 1/2 moa and many in the 1/4 moa range. My 1000 yard rig shoots in the low 1s with boredom. It has shot 3 inches at 1000 in a match. 10 shots where I shoot. Rl26 is amazing stuff in the right cartridge. My 243ai loves it with 115s. I know there are still you creed haters out there that think this is inflated. Its real and there are tons of guys using this exact combo with the same results. So no its still not a rocket ship at 2900 but much closer to one than 2600 factory hornady. And a 147 eldm at 2900 really holds its own at longer range. And the 147 is very stellar on deer. Lung soup. So to the OP try some rl26 and you can get the speed you want with low pressure or get the speed you really want at normal pressure. And the lapua brass about 15 shots before the pockets get loose.
Shep

 

[bomberodevil]

No the creed is no rocket ship but can go plenty fast with rl26. Every gun but one will do 2900 plus with 147 eldm. Lapua brass and cci450 primer. My 1000 yard gun with 32 inch barrel is 2975 with the same loads. I can only vouch for this combo of components. I only shoot the 147s in the big bulk pack. I wont publish the exact powder charge. But start at 45 and go till you hit pressure or run out of room for powder. When I charge my brass the powder is in the neck and I vibrate them to get the powder into the shoulder area. Every custom creed Ive built has shot this load well under 1/2 moa and many in the 1/4 moa range. My 1000 yard rig shoots in the low 1s with boredom. It has shot 3 inches at 1000 in a match. 10 shots where I shoot. Rl26 is amazing stuff in the right cartridge. My 243ai loves it with 115s. I know there are still you creed haters out there that think this is inflated. Its real and there are tons of guys using this exact combo with the same results. So no its still not a rocket ship at 2900 but much closer to one than 2600 factory hornady. And a 147 eldm at 2900 really holds its own at longer range. And the 147 is very stellar on deer. Lung soup. So to the OP try some rl26 and you can get the speed you want with low pressure or get the speed you really want at normal pressure. And the lapua brass about 15 shots before the pockets get loose.
Shep

That is fast, that's a good combination. I load pretty conservatively, load for accuracy over velocity. My other 6.5CM loads have velocities to mid 2700, which I'm happy with. This rifle and load is primarily a deer rifle for the grandkids. I have three other hunting rifles that will shoot larger bullets faster, so I don't try to make the 6.5 CM a speed rifle. That's why I hadn't ever blown a primer before and I was pretty shocked to find out the difference between the Nosler brass and the Hornady brass was this large. Again, lesson learned to not take anything for granted, and to start way low, not just a little low.

 

[bomberodevil]

Well, if you can calibrate it with its weights and double-check it with a good balance bean scale, it's most likely not your powder scale. Back to the firing pin and over-size primer pockets... and possible headspace went out I guess. Any chance you may have gotten some primers mixed up? Cheers

I've bought some different large rifle primers in the last couple of years to have on hand, but in 40 years, I've only used Federal 210 for my hunting rifles. The CCI primers are sitting in a storage box just in case I run out of Federal 210s.

I think it's just the difference between the Nosler and the Lapua brass. I just bought 100 more Lapua, and I'll get rid of the Nosler. Not that I think the Nosler brass is poor quality, but it's just another variable to cut out.

 

[codyadams]

That is fast, that's a good combination. I load pretty conservatively, load for accuracy over velocity. My other 6.5CM loads have velocities to mid 2700, which I'm happy with. This rifle and load is primarily a deer rifle for the grandkids. I have three other hunting rifles that will shoot larger bullets faster, so I don't try to make the 6.5 CM a speed rifle. That's why I hadn't ever blown a primer before and I was pretty shocked to find out the difference between the Nosler brass and the Hornady brass was this large. Again, lesson learned to not take anything for granted, and to start way low, not just a little low.

RL 26 generally nets about 100-150 fps more than h4350, so that is where the 2900 came from for sure. 2700-2800 with H4350 and 140's is about where a 26" creed should live comfortably, so your other loads are solid for sure. And your though process on keeping a creed a creed is spot on brother, that will get you the best results for sure!

 

[bomberodevil]

99.9% the brass. Internal volume can make a big difference. You need to start lower when changing components. The data is just a guide and only good for the exact components in that barrel. Next time run a one shot ladder to find max pressure. You can even spot the nodes by finding where the velocity flattens and the shots on target cluster. Also .7 grains is not enough. Start at the low end.

One of my problems is the public range I use only has 100 and 200 yds range. Running a ladder test with a fairly flat cartridge at 200 won't show a ton of separation. I agree with you on the brass, and I just ordered 100 cases of Lapua to replace the Nosler.

 

[motofrog]

No the creed is no rocket ship but can go plenty fast with rl26. Every gun but one will do 2900 plus with 147 eldm. Lapua brass and cci450 primer. My 1000 yard gun with 32 inch barrel is 2975 with the same loads. I can only vouch for this combo of components. I only shoot the 147s in the big bulk pack. I wont publish the exact powder charge. But start at 45 and go till you hit pressure or run out of room for powder. When I charge my brass the powder is in the neck and I vibrate them to get the powder into the shoulder area. Every custom creed Ive built has shot this load well under 1/2 moa and many in the 1/4 moa range. My 1000 yard rig shoots in the low 1s with boredom. It has shot 3 inches at 1000 in a match. 10 shots where I shoot. Rl26 is amazing stuff in the right cartridge. My 243ai loves it with 115s. I know there are still you creed haters out there that think this is inflated. Its real and there are tons of guys using this exact combo with the same results. So no its still not a rocket ship at 2900 but much closer to one than 2600 factory hornady. And a 147 eldm at 2900 really holds its own at longer range. And the 147 is very stellar on deer. Lung soup. So to the OP try some rl26 and you can get the speed you want with low pressure or get the speed you really want at normal pressure. And the lapua brass about 15 shots before the pockets get loose.
Shep

That is fast! My 24" 6.5 running 127LRX, Lapua Brass, R26 over CCI 450 runs right around 2700 in a good accuracy node not pushing it too hard.

 

[bomberodevil]

RL 26 generally nets about 100-150 fps more than h4350, so that is where the 2900 came from for sure. 2700-2800 with H4350 and 140's is about where a 26" creed should live comfortably, so your other loads are solid for sure. And your though process on keeping a creed a creed is spot on brother, that will get you the best results for sure!

I've always been impressed with the Reloader powders speed, but in an attempt to simplify my reloading life, I use mainly H4350 and H4831 in my 6.5 CM, 270 Win, 280 AI, and 30.06. I can be loading in Phoenix in July, and hunting in Wyoming in November. I like the temp stability of the Hodgdon powders.

 

[codyadams]

I've always been impressed with the Reloader powders speed, but in an attempt to simplify my reloading life, I use mainly H4350 and H4831 in my 6.5 CM, 270 Win, 280 AI, and 30.06. I can be loading in Phoenix in July, and hunting in Wyoming in November. I like the temp stability of the Hodgdon powders.

Absolutely. I am starting to transition that way too, with the addition of a couple vv powders as well

 

[25WSM]

H4350 is probably the number one powder used in the creed. There is a good reason for that. I only shoot my creed at paper. I have a 6.5 prc and a 6.5 saum i hunt with. The creed will always be what it is. A great cartridge. Easy to shoot. Easy to load for. Accurate with room to spare. For a few yrs all my customers wanted 280ai rifles built. Then they all wanted creeds. Now Im semi retired. Want to be all the way retired but everyone knows where I live. The OP got great answers and probably knows now what went wrong. Great sight here.
Shep

 

[cajun]

H4350 was the original creed powder. It's accurate but R26 is much faster.