Barrell Life 338 rum vs 300 rum

[bigbuck]

The following was posted by LTLR in this thread; http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=225043






Notice that he suggest that a 300 Ultra Mag will not keep a Carribou from running 200 to 400 Yards.


I lived in Alaska for 7 years and I killed a few head of Carribou and never found them any where near that bullet proof. I never had or seen one run that far not even when shot with a revolver

The one that I took in the photo below I shot with a 45 Colt 310 grain LFN hard cast bullet at a muzzle velocity of 1240 FPS and he went no more than 20 yards

HA HA you NAILED him with this one

Bigbuck

 

[bigbuck]

Not to hijack but I just have to comment on the "feet flying up in the air and the first thing that hits the ground is the top of their back" YEA RIGHT Mithbusters tried to prove this using a 50 BMG they shot a human dummy and guess what his feet did not fly up in the air and no the first thing that hit the ground was not the top of his back . No massive BODY slam

Give me a .338 edge anyday .

Bigbuck

 

[MontanaRifleman]

Give me a .338 edge anyday .

Bigbuck

This seems like a silly debate, dont ya think???

If you like your EDGE, great

If you like your RUM , great

 

[bigbuck]

This seems like a silly debate, dont ya think???

If you like your EDGE, great

If you like your RUM , great

Your right Montana it is kind of silly

Bigbuck

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

Bigbuck, Thanks for highlighting that post I made quite a while back. I will reiterate that again. I don't know what it has to do with barrel life though. You obviously don't have the experience or maturity to understand what I was saying there. I have hunted caribou for over 30 years, seen many shot and many run quite a ways. The last one I shot with a 300 ultramag right through both lungs ran about 300 yards into a miserable swamp that was very difficult to bring him out of. The point was with my 338-378 he would have been dead right there. I really don't care what part hits the ground first, that is not the point.

 

[jwp475]

JWP, you got nothing better to do than find a forum member to argue with? What did LTLR do to tick you off? Tell you your 338 Edge isn't the finest caliber on the face of the earth? How many 338 Edges have you chronographed, and how many 338 RUMs? You demand the facts. Now show us you've collected more chronograph data than LTLR has with these two cartridges. Perhaps you'd rather spend your time searching the Forum for some more LTLR posts in your continuing effort to discredit him. Time for the winter meds? Give it a break...

I'll tell you where I got my info from. Shawn Carlock. Shawn said that in a 26" barrel and with the lighter wieght bullets the 338 RUM and the 338 EDGE are very close, but with the 300 grain SMK's the Edge has a velocity advantage especially with a 30" barrel Shawn said that it is between 100 to 150 FPS.

I just got of off the phone with Shawn, you can PM him or call him PM him yourself

 

[MontanaRifleman]

I'll tell you where I got my info from. Shawn Carlock. Shawn said that in a 26" barrel and with the lighter wieght bullets the 338 RUM and the 338 EDGE are very close, but with the 300 grain SMK's the Edge has a velocity advantage especially with a 30" barrel Shawn said that it is between 100 to 150 FPS.

I just got of off the phone with Shawn, you can PM him or call him PM him yourself

What does this have to do with barrel life???

 

[jmden]

On the other hand, who's to say that a string can't diverge from the original topic? Sometimes that happens and I don't see it as necessarily a bad thing as long as we are still sharing information and experiences to make ourselves better or hopefully gain a fuller understanding. If the OP wants, they can ask to get the discussion back on track. Or, if he doesn't care, he can stay silent. Is there a rule, unwritten or not, on this issue? Maybe that idea doesn't seem right to some, but at this point, it doesn't bother me personally. But, who am I?

Perhaps I need to go read the forum rules (which I haven't done lately, to be honest). Maybe there's something in there about staying focused and on task. Just my .02. If it's in the forum rules, I apologize and will cease and desist...

 

[MontanaRifleman]

On the other hand, who's to say that a string can't diverge from the original topic? Sometimes that happens and I don't see it as necessarily a bad thing as long as we are still sharing information and experiences to make ourselves better or hopefully gain a fuller understanding. If the OP wants, they can ask to get the discussion back on track. Or, if he doesn't care, he can stay silent. Is there a rule, unwritten or not, on this issue? Maybe that idea doesn't seem right to some, but at this point, it doesn't bother me personally. But, who am I?

Perhaps I need to go read the forum rules (which I haven't done lately, to be honest). Maybe there's something in there about staying focused and on task. Just my .02. If it's in the forum rules, I apologize and will cease and desist...

Good point, and to digress even farther.... sometimes straying off on tangents can be informative and enlightening, but int the case of this thread.... what's the point? Go back and look at the first off topic post that started down this road. To me it appears to be splitting hairs and argumentative for sake of argument. I get nothing out of it. Maybe the OP and others do? There are numerous threads on the EDGE vs the 338 RUM and/or Lapua and it's all the same stuff. Then it turns into a campaign of digging around and trying to discredit another member. Again, what's the point?

Nothing wrong with debate...let's keep it purposeful and informative....

Mark

 

[Chas1]

+1 with Mark. I'd only add that straying off the thread can be somewhat subjective but I get Mark's point. I'm not opposed to straying cause as mentioned sometimes it has a purpose and is informative...it's the cutting hairs and trying to pick a fight mixed with sometimes the personal attacks along the way that's dis-tasteful to me. I say leave the egos and testasterone somewhere else. Just my 2 cents, thanks for listening.

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

I agree a thread can get off tangent and still be very informative, happens all the time. Lets get back on track. I have several college degrees but none in english so maybe I made a bad choice of words with obsolete. I appologize if I did. I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone with the remark. I have been here regularly for years and try to give info and not hurt anyones feelings.

My point is there is hardly any difference between the 338 ultramag and 338-300 ultramag. Certainly not enough to make any difference in a hunting situation. With the introduction of the 338 ultramag my opinion was I saw no need to continue wildcatting the 338-300 so I stopped working with it. By saying obsolete I didn't mean it wasn't a good round anymore. It is still one of the best 338's out there and will still kill stuff just as dead as it did back when I put a bunch of them in the hands of elk hunters back in the 90's before you could even buy a 300 ultramag at the local store. I was just stating my opinion. I guess mine counts to. I am not god on the subject and welcome other opinions all the time. This season I guided two hunters using the 338-300 ultramags I built them back in the 90's. One shot his deer at over 600 yards and the other at over 700 yards. So the guns do still work.

Back in the 90's when the lapua and ultramag case came out I built many rifles wildcatted with these new cases trying to find one I liked better than the old standby 338-378. By doing that I got tons of data on all the big 338's that are comonly talked about today. The reason for this is I found back in the 70's with the introduction of the 250 grain sierra game king, which had the highest BC of any hunting bullet at the time, the 338 was the best long range weapon for large big game. I started with the 340 weatherby and moved up to necking the 378 case and wildcatting it before it became obsolete or whatever with the introduction of the standard 338-378 wby. I was very upset because I spent thousands of dollars on seven custom 338-378's then in the late 90's I could buy a wby accumark for $1300 in 338-378.

They are all very similar. These are averages from several thousand rounds over a chrono with these rifles. Assuming all are equal length barrels with 300 SMK. 338 and 338-300 ultramags will top out with best accuracy from 2750-2850 fps. Which one wins depends on who has the fastest barrel. 338 lapua 2775-2875 fps. 338 lapua improved 2900-3000 fps. 338-378 wby 2950-3050 fps. I think any one of these will kill anything you come across so take your pick. There are the facts from a lot of shooting. If anyone else has chrono info they want to share I am all ears and anyone is welcome to post here as far as I am concerened.

 

[bigbuck]

I agree a thread can get off tangent and still be very informative, happens all the time. Lets get back on track. I have several college degrees but none in english so maybe I made a bad choice of words with obsolete. I appologize if I did. I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone with the remark. I have been here regularly for years and try to give info and not hurt anyones feelings.

My point is there is hardly any difference between the 338 ultramag and 338-300 ultramag. Certainly not enough to make any difference in a hunting situation. With the introduction of the 338 ultramag my opinion was I saw no need to continue wildcatting the 338-300 so I stopped working with it. By saying obsolete I didn't mean it wasn't a good round anymore. It is still one of the best 338's out there and will still kill stuff just as dead as it did back when I put a bunch of them in the hands of elk hunters back in the 90's before you could even buy a 300 ultramag at the local store. I was just stating my opinion. I guess mine counts to. I am not god on the subject and welcome other opinions all the time. This season I guided two hunters using the 338-300 ultramags I built them back in the 90's. One shot his deer at over 600 yards and the other at over 700 yards. So the guns do still work.

Back in the 90's when the lapua and ultramag case came out I built many rifles wildcatted with these new cases trying to find one I liked better than the old standby 338-378. By doing that I got tons of data on all the big 338's that are comonly talked about today. The reason for this is I found back in the 70's with the introduction of the 250 grain sierra game king, which had the highest BC of any hunting bullet at the time, the 338 was the best long range weapon for large big game. I started with the 340 weatherby and moved up to necking the 378 case and wildcatting it before it became obsolete or whatever with the introduction of the standard 338-378 wby. I was very upset because I spent thousands of dollars on seven custom 338-378's then in the late 90's I could buy a wby accumark for $1300 in 338-378.

They are all very similar. These are averages from several thousand rounds over a chrono with these rifles. Assuming all are equal length barrels with 300 SMK. 338 and 338-300 ultramags will top out with best accuracy from 2750-2850 fps. Which one wins depends on who has the fastest barrel. 338 lapua 2775-2875 fps. 338 lapua improved 2900-3000 fps. 338-378 wby 2950-3050 fps. I think any one of these will kill anything you come across so take your pick. There are the facts from a lot of shooting. If anyone else has chrono info they want to share I am all ears and anyone is welcome to post here as far as I am concerened.

Long Time Long Ranger,

I agree with your views on the .338's I just happen to have a 300RUM so I hope to some day turn it into a .338 EDGE I will admitt that one of the reasons for this is because several people have posted long range kills with the .338 EDGE not to mention what Shawns doing with the wildcat . I think this round is to most on this forum a HERO it certainly gets alot of attention. In the end it is what makes each individual happy I believe we could all agree that any of these should put a big smile on ones face

Bigbuck

 

[Chas1]

LTLR, good story, thanks for sharing...and thanks for your contribution to the 338's, I liked hearing it.

 

[wrad]

Bounty Hunter - Thanks for the MikeCr spreadsheet. I am a 67 year old newbie in this fun sport, and feel I'm a freshman-going-sophomore in the art of reloading & LR shooting. I am an Ohio farmer with a 1 mile range, hoping to live long enough to shoot that far and hit something, at least once. You guys are definitely seniors (or grad students), so I don't want to argue with anybody. I do have some questions on the spreadsheet. I always heard that muzzle velocity played a big role in barrel life, yet I don't see that vel is taken into account in the calcs. Also, wouldn't bullet weight (linked inversely to vel) also be a factor? I'm using Retumbo and don't see it in the powder heat table. Where can I find that number?

I have been shooting a factory Rem 300 RUM with mostly sub-moa results, but have been loading 180 gr sciroccos to 3,300~3,350 fps. My borescope shows minor erosion after maybe 250 shots. I think I better back off some. I am about to receive a custom 338-375 Cheytac SnipeTac with a Lilja barrel, and want to treat her like royalty. Can't afford many more of these.

If muzzle vel truly is a factor, then my new little factory (CZ) .204 Ruger at 4,250 fps will be a paperweight soon - right? All this chatter is just to introduce myself. Basic question goes back to the heat number for Retumbo. Any idea?
Thanks,
Walt
Lebanon, OH