After re-barrel :: 2 shots close together and 1 shot further out

[Iron Worker]

No

 

[distantfoe]

Let me guess, it's either a button rifled barrel and/or carbon fiber?

 

[ShtrRdy]

Let me guess, it's either a button rifled barrel and/or carbon fiber?

Haha, no, it's stainless steel cut rifled.

 

[Paulstarr]

Is it possible for a new barrel to be the cause of 2 shots being VERY close together and a third shot being 1/2" to 3/4" apart? The shot that is "out" can be the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd shot.

This is on a Tikka T3 Varmint in 22-250 Rem. Using the original, factory stock. It use to shoot amazingly well.
Replaced the barrel with a Rem Varmint contour, 1:12 twist. Had to reduce the breach end to 1.150" to better match Tikka action.
I was hoping to use close to the same load that worked well in the original barrel so I had the gunsmith cut the finished length to match original barrel.

Things I've tried:
1. Different charge weights (OCW type of test)
2. Different seating depth of bullet
3. Open up barrel channel a little more.
4. Inspect bedding area and then overall stock for any crack.
5. Use a different, known good, scope
6. Use a different scope mount, (to remove the rail). Used the Tikka Optiloc rings and another different scope.
7. Try a different bullet

Have any of you seen a new barrel be the cause of such behavior?

Thanks -- Todd

Looks like you have looked at the obvious, if it still happens, get your gunsmith to look at the barrel to action thread to ensure that it is of sound quality.The symptoms of what is happening can be that when the rifle gets warm the barrel moves in the action and so changes the point of impact, if it is this problem it will get worse as the gun gets hotter.

 

[ed209clark]

I had the same issue with my sock not being tightened properly, that was with a 338 RUM... the engineer in me hates to give up, but powder and a good chronograph will speak volumes, I'm thinking of getting a néw Doppler radar one... as much as it pains me to say it, life is short, sell it.

 

[Guns416]

Is it possible for a new barrel to be the cause of 2 shots being VERY close together and a third shot being 1/2" to 3/4" apart? The shot that is "out" can be the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd shot.

This is on a Tikka T3 Varmint in 22-250 Rem. Using the original, factory stock. It use to shoot amazingly well.
Replaced the barrel with a Rem Varmint contour, 1:12 twist. Had to reduce the breach end to 1.150" to better match Tikka action.
I was hoping to use close to the same load that worked well in the original barrel so I had the gunsmith cut the finished length to match original barrel.

Things I've tried:
1. Different charge weights (OCW type of test)
2. Different seating depth of bullet
3. Open up barrel channel a little more.
4. Inspect bedding area and then overall stock for any crack.
5. Use a different, known good, scope
6. Use a different scope mount, (to remove the rail). Used the Tikka Optiloc rings and another different scope.
7. Try a different bullet

Have any of you seen a new barrel be the cause of such behavior?

Thanks -- Todd

Why are you using a 1-12 twist barrel for a 22-250? I would have put a 1-9 and that would shoot the 50-65 grain bullets very well. The 1-12 bullets are good for the light bullets. The 1-8 barrels are great for the heavy bullets.

 

[Savage 22-243 AI]

Is it possible for a new barrel to be the cause of 2 shots being VERY close together and a third shot being 1/2" to 3/4" apart? The shot that is "out" can be the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd shot.

This is on a Tikka T3 Varmint in 22-250 Rem. Using the original, factory stock. It use to shoot amazingly well.
Replaced the barrel with a Rem Varmint contour, 1:12 twist. Had to reduce the breach end to 1.150" to better match Tikka action.
I was hoping to use close to the same load that worked well in the original barrel so I had the gunsmith cut the finished length to match original barrel.

Things I've tried:
1. Different charge weights (OCW type of test)
2. Different seating depth of bullet
3. Open up barrel channel a little more.
4. Inspect bedding area and then overall stock for any crack.
5. Use a different, known good, scope
6. Use a different scope mount, (to remove the rail). Used the Tikka Optiloc rings and another different scope.
7. Try a different bullet

Have any of you seen a new barrel be the cause of such behavior?

Thanks -- Todd

Just fire 2 shot groups....if nothing is found wrong with the rifle then either you or the reloads.

 

[Apex Custom Rifles]

So it shot good before, got new barrel, now doesn't shoot. What changed? The barrel?

As long as everything else is tight. There's your problem. That's what that barrel will shoot unless you find the magic combo.

 

[Lenny Foffa]

You will need to remove the scope and rings to check the tightness of the screws in the bases. I like cleaning the screw holes , and the screws with Gun Scrubber and a fine brush, then secure the bases with Lock Tight on the screws , then replace the rings and the scope . Clean the rings and ring screws with Gun Scrubber and use some Lock Tight on the screws that secure each 1/2 of the rings. I would also check the bedding to make sure you have some slight clearance along the barrel channel . A dollar bill should slide easily up to the area just forward of the receiver. Then make sure your action screws are not over torqued . Those are the most obvious areas that could cause issues, and the simplest to address. If the problem continues, I would really examine my loading process. Special attention paid to Empty Case Weight, Proper Charge Weights of powder ; COAL , and OGIVE lengths of each round made. Take your time, you will find it and fix it. Good Luck Buddy

 

[MNbogboy]

I'm actually asking if anyone has experienced the cause of a 2-shots-in/1-shot-out pattern as being the barrel. But I'll go ahead and post the components I'm using.

Lapua brass (1x fired) - full length sized - mandrel to expand neck
Sierra 55 gr Blitzking
CCI Lg Rifle primer
Varget
0.015" off the lands

You mentioned you tried a different bullet but didn't mention your load workup procedure. Was the workup similar to your other barrel?
Assuming you have tried something similar to the Berger seating test, with the wide interval they recommend it is often easy to miss the sweet spots (more than one). Easy to leave something on the table. Personally i use .010s on first go around, then .005s, finally .003s for my hunting rifles. Some say that is a waste of ammo & barrel but like some of us i may actually "wear" the barrel out before i am satisfied....lol

 

[lyle2231]

Is it possible for a new barrel to be the cause of 2 shots being VERY close together and a third shot being 1/2" to 3/4" apart? The shot that is "out" can be the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd shot.

This is on a Tikka T3 Varmint in 22-250 Rem. Using the original, factory stock. It use to shoot amazingly well.
Replaced the barrel with a Rem Varmint contour, 1:12 twist. Had to reduce the breach end to 1.150" to better match Tikka action.
I was hoping to use close to the same load that worked well in the original barrel so I had the gunsmith cut the finished length to match original barrel.

Things I've tried:
1. Different charge weights (OCW type of test)
2. Different seating depth of bullet
3. Open up barrel channel a little more.
4. Inspect bedding area and then overall stock for any crack.
5. Use a different, known good, scope
6. Use a different scope mount, (to remove the rail). Used the Tikka Optiloc rings and another different scope.
7. Try a different bullet

Have any of you seen a new barrel be the cause of such behavior?

Thanks -- Todd

Go thru your brass, pick 5 pcs, deprime, trim then weigh. Weigh the powder, Weigh the 5 bullets. The brass is what I would look to for large variations. HTH

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Theres a lot of things that cause fliers. Its hard to know without having the rifle in hand. Bedding, is a big one, bad scopes or shifting mounts. The wrong bullet or powder, bolt handle hitting the stock, trigger hitting the stock, barrel touching the stock, ignition, barrel steel, neck clearance, tight cases, ext. If its random, that makes it harder to diag. Question, did it do this with the original barrel? If not that proves the rest of the platform and its either tune or steel. One of my best 4 shot barrels always threw a flier. Never could get 5 in a hole, but 4 were tiny tiny.

 

[MagnumManiac]

If it's not the bedding causing this issue, then I have seen this on rifles that have had the barrel over-torqued to the action.
I have tried every torque when putting barrels on, if it's a switch barrel, I just nip them up, but if it's permanent, I have found 75lbs/ft to be a good torque on stainless and 65lbs/ft on carbon.
I know others use tighter, but I see no need, as my Comp barrels are screwed in by hand and snapped into home and have never caused a problem.
I would use regular white chalk, cover the entire action/barrel bottom and put it together and see if there are ANY tight spots, or indicators of movement by firing 5 rounds, then carefully dismantle and look.
I have never seen a barrel the cause of 2 close and then a flier, have seen this caused by a scope problem and bedding issues.

Cheers.

 

[tobnpr]

I'd like to see something like an OCW type target with a half-dozen groups, shot at whatever intervals needed to keep the barrel cool (it's not a sporter contour so it shouldn't start stringing after a few shots, anyway) after however many foulers might be needed.

What I'm saying is call me skeptical that your claim the rifle routinely shoots every three-shot group with 2 out of every three touching, with a third outlier- with no consistency to the pattern doesn't make sense to me.

Optimal Group Size for Rifles

Are 5-shot groups really better than 3-shot groups?

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