Absolute Hammer load data

[JAYgs8163]

When you say hard clicker how do you know its not a issue with shoulder set back when sizing example New brass is not fire formed to your chamber once fired is so when sizing if you have zero head space that can cause the bolt to click when opening the bolt run the die down or bump the shoulder back . 002 and sometimes the clickers go away Pesonally I pay more attention too the case head ejector extractor primer pockets etc hard bolt lift etc.

Huh? I think you have me confused with someone else's post.

 

[ButterBean]

So it's basically a torque wrench handle for the press? Not specifically a die. Kind of makes sense but not sure if it does on the LEE Crimp Dies as they bottom out based on how far you screw them in if I'm not mistaken. I don't think handle torque makes a difference with the Lee crimp dies if they're set up accordingly but I could be wrong. Interesting for sure.

Handle torque most defiantly makes a difference, That is why I cam over

 

[nwmnbowhunter]

When you say hard clicker how do you know its not a issue with shoulder set back when sizing example New brass is not fire formed to your chamber once fired is so when sizing if you have zero head space that can cause the bolt to click when opening the bolt run the die down or bump the shoulder back . 002 and sometimes the clickers go away Pesonally I pay more attention too the case head ejector extractor primer pockets etc hard bolt lift etc.

You are correct.

Clickers are not as reliable of an indicator as ejector marks and stiff bolt lift.

In this case I know this rifle. With the jump in velocity and Clicker i know it is a pressure increase and not a chamber issue.

Hope that clarifies it.

 

[JAYgs8163]

Handle torque most defiantly makes a difference, That is why I cam over

I cam over as well. Having a hard time understanding I guess how this handle will help with the Lee crimping die though as the crimping arms only close so much based on the setting and the cam over. Doesn't really matter for me though as they don't make one for my press. Anyways.....

 

[Hard rock]

When you say hard clicker how do you know its not a issue with shoulder set back when sizing example New brass is not fire formed to your chamber once fired is so when sizing if you have zero head space that can cause the bolt to click when opening the bolt run the die down or bump the shoulder back . 002 and sometimes the clickers go away Pesonally I pay more attention too the case head ejector extractor primer pockets etc hard bolt lift etc.

Huh? I think you have me confused with someone else's post.

You are correct.

Clickers are not as reliable of an indicator as ejector marks and stiff bolt lift.

In this case I know this rifle. With the jump in velocity and Clicker i know it is a pressure increase and not a chamber issue.

Hope that clarifies it.

 

[ButterBean]

I cam over as well. Having a hard time understanding I guess how this handle will help with the Lee crimping die though as the crimping arms only close so much based on the setting and the cam over. Doesn't really matter for me though as they don't make one for my press. Anyways.....

I had one and didn't care for it, setting the die and camming over is much easier IMO, Basically the same principle

 

[Hard rock]

Yes it does thanks for the clarification I'm in the process of loadind the 123 gr absolutes . I have a losd worked up for the 124 gr hammer hunters , I have allready gained 100 fps over the 124 hammers the Curtis Axiom action is a 60 degree bolt lift 3 lug so bolt lift is a little different so I'm going by primer pockets and ejector marks on max loads so far so good any advice is allways welcomed thanks

 

[CMP70306]

So it's basically a torque wrench handle for the press? Not specifically a die. Kind of makes sense but not sure if it does on the LEE Crimp Dies as they bottom out based on how far you screw them in if I'm not mistaken. I don't think handle torque makes a difference with the Lee crimp dies if they're set up accordingly but I could be wrong. Interesting for sure.

Handle torque most defiantly makes a difference, That is why I cam over

I had one and didn't care for it, setting the die and camming over is much easier IMO, Basically the same principle

I still intend to cam over on my press (Hornady single stage) but my thoughts were more on quantifying the amount of crimping being done at the cam over point. I want to see how much it changes based on the turning of the die plus how much the bullet, brass with different neck thickness and brass length affects the crimping force.

Basically my goal was to try and put numbers to ButterBean's method to see if there is a specific crimp pressure that works well across calibers and cartridges or if it is completely random.

 

[Mike D Texas]

The group of us that have been loading Absolute Hammers in multiple cartridges have learned to pick a powder the following 2 ways.
1. Go to Hogdon's website and pick the same (or close to) bullet weight. Then see which ones it gives you for the highest velocity at max charge. Of those, pick the one(s) that have the lowest case fill (you'll have to figure that out based on what you know is your case fill capacity). Steve usually suggests starting at or 1-2 gr above listed max charge and working up from there. I'm always cautious, and start 1 gr below max charge. I've found Steve is correct, but I always err to being overly cautious.
2. Go to Nosler load data and look at the loads for the next kisser bullet weight (ie; you're using the 178 gr so look at the 165 gr bullet load data). See which ones give you the lowest car fill and highest velocity. Work up from there, but start below max charge.

Both these methods work and keep you from getting in trouble. We have found that the pressure spikes come on rapidly as you get to max charge for your rifle. If you can do your course pressure testing with a chronograph, it will help you easily identify when you're getting close.
Reach out for help from any of us. GL Taylor and ButterBean are a wealth of knowledge

So help me understand how this works. I am trying to figure out a load for 162 AH in my 308. Using your method #1, I picked a Barnes 168TTSX because it's close to the same length and weight at the 162AH. CFE223 offers the highest velocity but it already shows a compressed load at max charge and temp stability concerns me a bit with it. Next is Varget but it's also compressed. H4895 is next but again compressed. Next in line in BL-C(2) and it doesn't indicate to be compressed @ 46 grains listed as max charge. Quickload also calculates that my case capacity would be 97.2% and pressure looks good.

All that being said, I should start at max charge of BL-C(2) or powders in that similar burn rate and work up from there?

View attachment 274541

 

[jeremy.b]

Since you have quickload, adjust your min case fill below it's default 90% and set a fill cap somewhere between 90-95% and see what falls out

 

[ButterBean]

So help me understand how this works. I am trying to figure out a load for 162 AH in my 308. Using your method #1, I picked a Barnes 168TTSX because it's close to the same length and weight at the 162AH. CFE223 offers the highest velocity but it already shows a compressed load at max charge and temp stability concerns me a bit with it. Next is Varget but it's also compressed. H4895 is next but again compressed. Next in line in BL-C(2) and it doesn't indicate to be compressed @ 46 grains listed as max charge. Quickload also calculates that my case capacity would be 97.2% and pressure looks good.

All that being said, I should start at max charge of BL-C(2) or powders in that similar burn rate and work up from there?

View attachment 274541

View attachment 274542

Since you have quickload, adjust your min case fill below it's default 90% and set a fill cap somewhere between 90-95% and see what falls out

QL will not work with Hammers, Here is an example of AH methodology, I'm shooting the 116AH in a 270AI and I'm using the max book load for a 90gr conventional bullet, you will need to forget all conventional reloading powder applications

 

[Mike D Texas]

QL will not work with Hammers, Here is an example of AH methodology, I'm shooting the 116AH in a 270AI and I'm using the max book load for a 90gr conventional bullet, you will need to forget all conventional reloading powder applications

I understand that I can't use convention QL info. I'm just trying to get a reasonable starting point. But case capacity is case capacity. That's the main data point I'm looking at in QL.
For example if I use the methodology #1 that DougDuey posted above all of the fastest powders listed on Hodgdon's site have me over 110% case capacity, except BL-C(2). I have created a bullet profile in QL with the 162AH so I would know where I sat in relation to case capacity.

You had responded previously to use RL10x or 8208XBR as a starting point, but if I plug in 100% case capacity of RL10x with the 162 AH, the pressure number is calculating 74,000+ (I know it's not accurate) and that just freaks me out to consider loading something that looks to be 12k psi over SAAMI max pressure. I suppose I could load down to QL max and go up from there in a ladder?

I'm willing to listen to you guys that have experience; being a numbers guy just makes it difficult for me though.

 

[tribb]

Ok

 

[ButterBean]

I understand that I can't use convention QL info. I'm just trying to get a reasonable starting point. But case capacity is case capacity. That's the main data point I'm looking at in QL.
For example if I use the methodology #1 that DougDuey posted above all of the fastest powders listed on Hodgdon's site have me over 110% case capacity, except BL-C(2). I have created a bullet profile in QL with the 162AH so I would know where I sat in relation to case capacity.

You had responded previously to use RL10x or 8208XBR as a starting point, but if I plug in 100% case capacity of RL10x with the 162 AH, the pressure number is calculating 74,000+ (I know it's not accurate) and that just freaks me out to consider loading something that looks to be 12k psi over SAAMI max pressure. I suppose I could load down to QL max and go up from there in a ladder?

I'm willing to listen to you guys that have experience; being a numbers guy just makes it difficult for me though.

I'm gonna say it one more time QL will not work, stop trying to use it. Conventional loading practices will not work , You will have to think out side of the box, if you keep trying to use QL you will never get anywhere with Hammer bullets and you will be wasting yours and everyone else's time as well as components